Adamantine body worth it?

[2xMachina]

I've been looking into a lvl 6 Warforged Warblade, and while initially, I wanted Adamantine body, I'm not so sure now...

It doesn't look very good, just a full plate at most. Might as well buy a Skin of Ecto armor for 3k?
It's good at low lvls, yeah, but once you get gold... It's no better than someone with adamantine fullplate.

[Escheton]

And an adamantine dagger. Don't forget the hardness negating slam attack.

[HunterOfJello]

It's a great feat at level 1, but once you get to a level where a character can afford Full Plate, then it really isn't too amazing.

One benefit it does have, is allowing a character that wouldn't normally have access to heavy armor, to be able to grab the full benefits of the best mundane Full Plate at level 1.

[TaintedLight]

I've been looking into a lvl 6 Warforged Warblade, and while initially, I wanted Adamantine body, I'm not so sure now...

It doesn't look very good, just a full plate at most. Might as well buy a Skin of Ecto armor for 3k?
It's good at low lvls, yeah, but once you get gold... It's no better than someone with adamantine fullplate.

Well, you did save the gold on a suit of armor that is leagues beyond anything you would otherwise have at first level. The utility gained from such a boost is not to be laughed at over the course of your first few levels. If you actually have to PLAY the character from first level, I'd consider it a pretty helpful feat. After all, couldn't you just get it enchanted later?

[2xMachina]

I don't think you get adamantine slam attack.

And well, at lvl 6, you can afford pretty good armor. The skin I said only costs 3k for 8AC.

[Admiral Squish]

Actually, if you have DR/Adamantine, your natural attack count as adamantine. Same for DR /magic, or DR/ Cold Iron or something.

[Wonton]

Reading it over, the feat is slightly weaker than Adamantine Full Plate (I guess they thought that DR 3/- would be OP... *sigh* ). Adamantine Full Plate, already a fairly subpar option for its price, costs around 16,000... is a feat worth most of the benefits of a mediocre 16K item? I'd say no.

Edit:

Actually, if you have DR/Adamantine, your natural attack count as adamantine. Same for DR /magic, or DR/ Cold Iron or something.

No, that's just wrong. The DR rules state:

Some monsters are vulnerable to magic weapons. Any weapon with at least a +1 magical enhancement bonus on attack and damage rolls overcomes the damage reduction of these monsters. Such creatures’ natural weapons (but not their attacks with weapons) are treated as magic weapons for the purpose of overcoming damage reduction.

and

Some monsters are vulnerable to chaotic-, evil-, good-, or lawful-aligned weapons. A creature with an alignment subtype (chaotic, evil, good, or lawful) can overcome this type of damage reduction with its natural weapons and weapons it wields as if the weapons or natural weapons had an alignment (or alignments) that match the subtype(s) of the creature.

It does not mention this for special materials, or damage types.

[2xMachina]

I can only find for DR/magic counts as magic.

[lord_khaine]

Yeah, it seems to be a semi-commen mistake that dr/adamantine makes your attacks count as adamantine.

[Admiral Squish]

I admit, I was hasty there, but it is a rational extension, is it not? I also mentions DR/Epic.

Would it not make sense that a construct that is supposedly made of adamantine, with DR/adamantine, that attacks by slamming an opponent with a limb supposedly made of adamantine, would count as though it were a weapon made of adamantine?

Would you count the gauntlet attack of adamantine fullplate as an adamantine weapon? That's BASICALLY what we're looking at.

[Wonton]

So does getting DR 1/- allow you to penetrate DR/- then? Or being a Zombie makes all your attacks Slashing weapons?

[Awnetu]

I have 2 words for you. Warforged Juggernaught.

5 level PrC, and it is AMAZING.

[Admiral Squish]

So does getting DR 1/- allow you to penetrate DR/- then? Or being a Zombie makes all your attacks Slashing weapons?

No, but those are specially mentioned otherwise.

When a damage reduction entry has a dash (-) after the slash, no weapon negates the damage reduction.

Emphasis mine.

Slam
The creature batters opponents with an appendage, dealing bludgeoning damage.

So, it mentions, specifically, dealing bludgeoning damage, not slashing. If you pick up a normal hammer with DR/ adamantine, the hammer isn't magically adamantine, it's still just a hammer. But a fist made of adamantine seems to me like it would count as such.

As for special materials, it's a common myth for werewolves to be vulnerable to the claws and fangs of other werewolves. The nemean lion similarly fell to it's own claws. These could be backwards-extrapolated into D&D terms to indicate creatures overcoming their own sort of damage reduction.

[Wonton]

So, it mentions, specifically, dealing bludgeoning damage, not slashing. If you pick up a normal hammer with DR/ adamantine, the hammer isn't magically adamantine, it's still just a hammer. But a fist made of adamantine seems to me like it would count as such.

As for special materials, it's a common myth for werewolves to be vulnerable to the claws and fangs of other werewolves. The nemean lion similarly fell to it's own claws. These could be backwards-extrapolated into D&D terms to indicate creatures overcoming their own sort of damage reduction.

Do not bring your common sense into this! This is a RAW discussion!

Hey, if I was DM-ing, I would certainly consider that as a houserule. All I'm saying is, don't mislead the OP (though I don't think he was misled for a second), cause his DM is likely to think differently.

[Greenish]

I have 2 words for you. Warforged Juggernaught.

5 level PrC, and it is AMAZING.

It's pretty cool, though it could do with full BAB, no matter how the flavour is "becoming more like a construct".

[Escheton]

There is a feat that allows warforged to slam werewolfs actually. And overcome and such, duh
Silver tracing or something.

[Swok]

It is totally awesome for a wildshape ranger/divine minion of mulhorand Master of Many Forms warforged though.

Since unless I'm totally forgetting something, you'll keep the benefit of the feat in your new form.

[Escheton]

and if not(bothersome dm?) there is always the +3 enhancement Wild.
Or just wilding clasps.

[Admiral Squish]

It is totally awesome for a wildshape ranger/divine minion of mulhorand Master of Many Forms warforged though.

Since unless I'm totally forgetting something, you'll keep the benefit of the feat in your new form.

I actually checked on this one, and it turns out it's true. You DO keep your living construct traits and your armor shifts with you.

[Marnath]

I don't see how it would be overpowered to let adamantite body make your slam pass DR. It does 1d4 damage and doesn't provide iterative attacks. That's kind of weak past low levels, and presumably you'll use a real weapon most of the time.

[Admiral Squish]

Supporting my statement with evidence!

Wild Shape:
At 5th level, a druid gains the ability to turn herself into any Small or Medium animal and back again once per day. Her options for new forms include all creatures with the animal type. This ability functions like the alternate form special ability, except as noted here. The effect lasts for 1 hour per druid level, or until she changes back. Changing form (to animal or back) is a standard action and doesn’t provoke an attack of opportunity. Each time you use wild shape, you regain lost hit points as if you had rested for a night.

Emphasis mine.

Alternate Form
A creature with this special quality has the ability to assume one or more specific alternate forms. A true seeing spell or ability reveals the creature’s natural form. A creature using alternate form reverts to its natural form when killed, but separated body parts retain their shape. A creature cannot use alternate form to take the form of a creature with a template. Assuming an alternate form results in the following changes to the creature:

* The creature retains the type and subtype of its original form. It gains the size of its new form. If the new form has the aquatic subtype, the creature gains that subtype as well.
* The creature loses the natural weapons, natural armor, and movement modes of its original form, as well as any extraordinary special attacks of its original form not derived from class levels (such as the barbarian’s rage class feature).
* The creature gains the natural weapons, natural armor, movement modes, and extraordinary special attacks of its new form.
* The creature retains the special qualities of its original form. It does not gain any special qualities of its new form.
* The creature retains the spell-like abilities and supernatural attacks of its old form (except for breath weapons and gaze attacks). It does not gain the spell-like abilities or attacks of its new form.
* The creature gains the physical ability scores (Str, Dex, Con) of its new form. It retains the mental ability scores (Int, Wis, Cha) of its original form. Apply any changed physical ability score modifiers in all appropriate areas with one exception: the creature retains the hit points of its original form despite any change to its Constitution.
* The creature retains its hit points and save bonuses, although its save modifiers may change due to a change in ability scores.
* Except as described elsewhere, the creature retains all other game statistics of its original form, including (but not necessarily limited to) HD, hit points, skill ranks, feats, base attack bonus, and base save bonuses.
* The creature retains any spellcasting ability it had in its original form, although it must be able to speak intelligibly to cast spells with verbal components and it must have humanlike hands to cast spells with somatic components.
* The creature is effectively camouflaged as a creature of its new form, and it gains a +10 bonus on Disguise checks if it uses this ability to create a disguise.
* Any gear worn or carried by the creature that can’t be worn or carried in its new form instead falls to the ground in its space. If the creature changes size, any gear it wears or carries that can be worn or carried in its new form changes size to match the new size. (Nonhumanoid-shaped creatures can’t wear armor designed for humanoid-shaped creatures, and vice versa.) Gear returns to normal size if dropped.

Emphasis mine

Finally, looking in MM III, Pg. 190, the warforged stat block given clearly refers to fortification, composite plating, and living construct traits as Special Qualities.

Q.E.D.

[Fearan]

It is totally awesome for a wildshape ranger/divine minion of mulhorand Master of Many Forms warforged though.

Since unless I'm totally forgetting something, you'll keep the benefit of the feat in your new form.

Right. One problem - this feat disallow you to use druidic powers. So, Adamantine cryohydra is a no-no. Try Ironwood Body instead

[Swok]

Why do you think I specified Wildshape Ranger and Divine minion? Neither of those have the no metal armor clause druids have.

[Fearan]

Why do you think I specified Wildshape Ranger and Divine minion? Neither of those have the no metal armor clause druids have.

But they do have point "as a druid" in wildshape description. Oops

[Marnath]

But they do have point "as a druid" in wildshape description. Oops

Wildshape loss from metal armor is a factor of being a druid, not of the ability. If you got it on a different class it shouldn't matter if you use metal armor.

[2xMachina]

There is also Mielikki. Metal? No problem. (She dislikes metal armor rangers can't wear tho)

[lord_khaine]

So, it mentions, specifically, dealing bludgeoning damage, not slashing. If you pick up a normal hammer with DR/ adamantine, the hammer isn't magically adamantine, it's still just a hammer. But a fist made of adamantine seems to me like it would count as such.

But isnt not made of adamantine, its an alloy reinforced with the stuff, thats also why the dr isnt better.

[Riffington]

Well, when you say "worth it", you have to ask "compared to what?"
If you mean "compared to being a different race", well - maybe not. Warforged have cool stuff, but they also are spending this feat on their body.

If you mean "compared to just wearing awesome armor"... well, wouldn't you have to take the Unarmored feat to do that? So if you're planning on being a warforged with adamantine full plate anyway, you'd be spending the same feat and a lot of money for one extra DR. Also, I'm not fully certain whether Adamantine Body gets rid of your Light Fortification, but if not - that's much better than the one DR.

[Ashiel]

It's pretty cool, though it could do with full BAB, no matter how the flavour is "becoming more like a construct".

Random note. Pathfinder constructs have a perfect BAB; so if you're playing Pathfinder, it's a good upgrade for the class.

[Awnetu]

Bleh, losing at most 2 points of BAB is more than made up by those abilities.

I know you lose 5 levels of class features, in exchange you get so many useful immunities.

You never take ability score damage, death effects bounce off, your immune to mind affecting spells and abilities, you cannot be crit, those all make your character a heck of a lot harder to kill. In addition you get boosts to your charging, bull rushes, and grapples.


Any martial class has a great chance of utilizing at least 2 of those options, wizards can still heal you, as can anyone with the repair skill. If you are not a party face, and have any use for the Adamantine Body feat, I see no reason not to consider this class. Even if its just 2 levels.