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  1. - Top - End - #1
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
    Zakaroth's Avatar

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    Default Black Lotus [Martial Discipline]

    Last update on 26-01-2013:
    This discipline comes with the Sublime Assassin class.

    The Black Lotus Discipline


    This secret discipline focuses on stealth, poison and assassination techniques. The key skill for Black Lotus is Sleight of Hand. Black Lotus favored weapons include the dagger (any type), hidden blade, ninja-to and short sword (any type).

    1ST LEVEL
    Blackened Heart Focus: (Boost) ─ Suppress your emotions and sharpen your intent.
    Poison Swap: (Counter) ─ Apply poison to your blades as an immediate action.
    Spiraling Lotus Stance: (Stance) ─ Your attacks are sharpened against weakened foes.
    Veiled Stab: (Strike) ─ Use a Sleight of Hand check to make a sneak attack.

    2ND LEVEL
    Death Blossom: (Strike) ─ Attack a Dex denied opponent and deal bonus sneak attack damage, increase the chance of poisoning your opponent.
    Fading Petal: (Counter) ─ Counter being flanked or use Sleight of Hand check to prevent being disarmed, grappled or tripped.

    3RD LEVEL
    Enduring Venom: (Counter) ─ Force reroll against your poison with a -2 penalty.
    Twisting Fang: (Strike) ─ Deal +1d8 per two initiator levels bonus damage and with increased critical potency.
    Way of the Unseen: (Stance) ─ You gain darkvision, increased movement and enhanced stealth.

    4TH LEVEL
    Blade Paradox: (Counter) ─ Counter an attack of opportunity.
    Throatseeker: (Strike) ─ Attack a Dex denied opponent and deal bonus sneak attack damage, may hinder the targets ability to speak.

    5TH LEVEL
    Blades of the Unseen: (Boost) ─ Swiftly slide behind your target in order to make an attack.
    Shroud of Sins: (Stance) ─ Enhance your assassination techniques.

    6TH LEVEL
    Flourishing Lotus Stride: (Boost) ─ Free your movement, enhance your speed and ignoring difficult terrain.
    Withering Lotus Strike: (Strike) ─ Make an powerful sneak attack that deals bonus damage, 1d6 Con damage and prevent healing.

    7TH LEVEL
    Black Venom Thrust: (Strike) ─ A critical strike that deals four times Dex to damage, target must instantly roll for secondary poison damage.
    Eyes of Massacre: (Stance) ─ Increase the critical capabilities of your weapons.

    8TH LEVEL
    Black Lotus Eclipse: (Strike) ─ Attack a Dex denied opponent and deal bonus sneak attack damage, may inflict exhaustion and blindness.
    Veil of Deception: (Counter) ─ Add half your Sleight of Hand ranks to AC and cause target to become flat-footed against your next turn attacks.

    9TH LEVEL
    Death Sealer: (Strike) ─ Make a full attack action against Dex denied opponent, your attacks automatically critical hit and may grant the option to Coup de Grace.
    Last edited by Zakaroth; 2014-03-03 at 05:37 PM. Reason: Fixed a value in the maneuver list.

  2. - Top - End - #2
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
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    Default Maneuver Descriptions

    1st-Level
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    Blackened Heart Focus
    Black Lotus (Boost)
    Level: Black Lotus 1
    Initiation Action: 1 swift action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You
    Duration: End of turn

    Emotions are but a burden for those who practice the art of assassination, distracting through doubt, fear, or even worse, pity. No. One of the first things an assassin must learn is to reign over his emotions, exiling them from his being, turning his gaze hollow.

    As you initiate this boost you suppress all emotions. This boost functions similar to a Calm Emotion spell, with the exception that it doesn't prevent you from attacking. In addition, until the end of turn, your inner rest provides you with a +1 bonus to attack rolls, plus your melee weapons have their threat range increased by 1, and critical threats do not require a conformation roll.

    Poison Swap
    Black Lotus (Counter)
    Level: Black Lotus 1
    Initiation Action: 1 immediate action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You
    Duration: Instantaneous

    You can initiate this maneuver at any time you would successfully hit an opponent in melee combat. You may apply a poison to your weapons as an immediate action. You don’t risk poisoning yourself when using this maneuver.

    Spiraling Lotus Stance
    Black Lotus (Stance)
    Level: Black Lotus 1
    Initiation Action: 1 swift action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You
    Duration: Stance

    As you weaken your target, your resolve and intent sharpen, further enhancing your combat efficiency. Whenever you attack an opponent that is poisoned or below 50% of their maximum health, you gain a +2 bonus on attack rolls, damage rolls and AC. If both conditions are met, the total bonus is increased to +4. This bonus lasts until the beginning of your next round and is immediately lost if you leave this stance.

    Veiled Stab
    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 1
    Initiation Action: 1 standard action
    Range: Melee Attack
    Target: One creature

    As part of this maneuver, you make a single melee attack. Instead of a normal attack roll you must make a Sleight of Hand check opposed by your opponent's AC. If your Sleight of Hand check succeeds, this strike is considered a successful sneak attack, dealing an additional 1d6 sneak attack damage per four initiator levels (rounded up). If the Sleight of Hand check fails, you instead make a single melee attack at you highest attack modifier.


    2nd-Level
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    Death Blossom
    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 2
    Initiation Action: 1 standard action
    Range: Melee Attack
    Target: One creature

    This maneuver functions only against opponents who are denied their Dexterity modifier to AC. As part of this maneuver, you make single melee attack. If successful, you deal an extra 1d6+2 points of sneak attack damage per two initiator levels. If the weapon is coated with an injury poison, you add your Dexterity modifier (if positive) as a mastery bonus to the DC for resisting your poison.

    Fading Petal
    Black Lotus (Counter)
    Level: Black Lotus 2
    Prerequisite: One Black Lotus maneuver
    Initiation Action: 1 immediate action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You

    You can initiate this maneuver at any time you are flanked or an attempt is made to disarm, grappled or trip you. If you initiate this maneuver as a reaction to being flanked, the flanking creature loses its advantages for flanking you until the beginning of its next turn. If this maneuver is initiated as a reaction on a disarm, grapple or trip attempt you roll a Sleight of Hand check instead of the corresponding defensive roll and use the result of that check to determine the attempts successfulness. A result of a natural 1 on your Sleight of Hand check is not an automatic failure.


    3rd-Level
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    Enduring Venom
    Black Lotus (Counter)
    Level: Black Lotus 3
    Prerequisite: One Black Lotus maneuver
    Initiation Action: 1 immediate action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You

    By applying a focused wave of ki, you disrupt you victim’s immune system. You can use this maneuver to reroll any failed attempt to poison your foe, by means of an injury poison. Your opponent must reroll his save with a -2 penalty.

    Twisting Fang
    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 3
    Prerequisite: Three Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 standard action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You

    With a single strike of deathly precision, you pierce your enemy in a vital point. A combination of deep twists causes severe internal damage, leaving your opponent ravaged.

    As part of this maneuver, you make single melee attack. If successful, your opponent suffers an extra +1d8 points of damage per two initiator levels. When using a light melee weapon while initiating this maneuver, the weapons threat range and multiplier (maximum of 4) are increased based on initiator level. This effect stacks with other effects that increase threat range.

    Initiator Level Range Multiplier
    5-8 +1 +0
    9-12 +2 +1
    13+ +3 +2

    Way of the Unseen
    Black Lotus (Stance)
    Level: Black Lotus 3
    Prerequisite: One Black Lotus maneuver
    Initiation Action: 1 swift action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You
    Duration: Stance

    While in this stance, you gain darkvision out to 60 feet, a +10 competence bonus to movement speed and may add your initiator level as a competence bonus to Hide and Move Silently checks. In addition, you no longer take a penalty to Hide and Move Silently checks when moving up to running speed.


    4th-Level
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    Blade Paradox
    Black Lotus (Counter)
    Level: Black Lotus 4
    Prerequisite: Two Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 full-round action; See text
    Range: Personal
    Target: You
    Duration: immediate

    Whenever an opponent makes an attack of opportunity against you, you can initiate this maneuver as an immediate action. As part of this maneuver, you must make a Sleight of Hand check opposed by your opponent's attack roll. If your Sleight of Hand check succeeds, your opponent misses and you make an attack of opportunity against your attacker. If it hits, he becomes flat-footed against your next turn melee attack. This attack must take place on your next turn to gain benefit of this maneuver.

    Throatseeker
    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 4
    Prerequisite: Two Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 standard action
    Range: Melee Attack
    Target: One creature
    Saving Throw: Fortitude partial

    This maneuver functions only against opponents who are denied their Dexterity modifier to AC. As part of this maneuver, you make single melee attack. If successful, you deal an extra 1d6+2 points of sneak attack damage per two initiator levels, and must make a successful Fort save or become temporary hindered to speak. For the next 10 minutes, the target takes a -10 penalty on any skill check requiring speech, is unable to call for help, and suffers a 5% per initiator level chance of failure when casting a spell with verbal commands.


    5th-Level
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    Blades of the Unseen
    Black Lotus (Boost)
    Level: Black Lotus 5
    Prerequisite: Two Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 swift action
    Range: Requires an opponent in melee range

    You can initiate this boost only if you have an opponent within melee range that is a maximum of two size categories larger than you. Make a Sleight of Hand check opposed by your opponent’s Sense Motive check. If successful, you move behind your target in the blink of an eye, catching him flat-footed. Furthermore, regardless of the check, your light melee weapons have their threat range increased by 1 until the end of turn.

    Shroud of Sins
    Black Lotus (Stance)
    Level: Black Lotus 5
    Prerequisite: Two Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 swift action
    Target: You
    Duration: Stance

    One basic principle behind the Black Lotus discipline is to initiate with malice and aspire to kill in a single blow, using any means necessary. While in this stance, you may add half your initiator level as a mastery bonus to the saving throw DC's of any injury poison you apply to your weapons.
    Furthermore, while wielding light weapons, the first melee attack each turn against a Dex denied or flanked opponent deals an additional 1d6 sneak attack damage per four initiator levels. However, if this attack is made against a target that is unaware of the initiator or does not recognize the initiator as an enemy, then the number of additional sneak attack dice granted by this stance is doubled.


    6th-Level
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    Flourishing Lotus Stride
    Black Lotus (Boost)
    Level: Black Lotus 6
    Prerequisite: Two Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 swift action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You
    Duration: End of turn

    Until the end of turn, you benefit from effects similar to that of a Freedom of Movement spell and may make a move action as a free action, moving at double your speed while ignoring difficult terrain.

    Withering Lotus Strike
    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 6
    Prerequisite: Two Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 standard action
    Range: Melee Attack
    Target: One creature
    Duration: 10 minutes
    Saving Throw: Fortitude partial

    This maneuver functions only against opponents who are denied their Dexterity modifier to AC. As part of this maneuver you make single melee attack. If successful, you deal an extra 1d6+2 points of sneak attack damage per two initiator levels, and your foe must make a successful Fortitude save or take 1d6 points of Constitution damage and become unable to regain hit points or ability damage by any means (this includes Fast Healing, regeneration or forms of magical healing). Any heal checks to stabilize a dying creature under the effect of this maneuver automatically fail.


    7th-Level
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    Black Venom Thrust
    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 7
    Prerequisite: Three Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 standard action
    Range: Melee Attack
    Target: One creature

    As part of this maneuver, you make a single melee attack. If successful, you add four times your Dexterity modifier to damage instead of Strength, and the attack is considered an automatic critical hit. If the weapon is coated with an injury or ingested poison and the target fails the save, he must immediately roll for the secondary poison damage.

    Eyes of Massacre
    Black Lotus (Stance)
    Level: Black Lotus 7
    Prerequisite: Three Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 swift action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You
    Duration: Stance

    As you observe an enemy, your eyes focus, and the position of every vein, organ and vulnerability becomes clear to you. While in this stance, the base critical threat range of any light melee weapons you wield is considered 17-20 and whenever the sublime assassin rolls a critical threat, he may roll twice to confirm the critical, using either result. If both results would confirm, the critical multiplier is increased by one. This effect does not stack with other effect that increase the critical modifier.


    8th-Level
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    Black Lotus Eclipse
    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 8
    Prerequisite: Three Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 standard action
    Range: Melee Attack
    Target: One creature
    Duration: 1 minute
    Saving Throw: Fortitude partial

    Enhanced by ki, you make a devastating blow to the targets nerve system, wrecking your foe's body. This maneuver functions only against an opponent who is denied his Dexterity modifier to AC. As part of this maneuver, you make single melee attack. If successful you deal an extra 1d6+1 points of sneak attack damage per initiator level, and you foe must make a successful Fortitude save or become exhausted, blinded and lose their next move action.

    Veil of Deception
    Black Lotus (Counter)
    Level: Black Lotus 8
    Prerequisite: Three Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 immediate action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You
    Duration: immediate

    If an opponent attacks you in melee, you can initiate this maneuver. You add halve your Sleight of Hand ranks to AC. If the attack misses, any subsequent attacks directed towards you miss this turn and the attacking creature becomes flat-footed against your next turn melee attacks. These attacks must take place before or on your next turn to gain the benefit of this maneuver. You cannot initiate this maneuver if you are considered flat-footed against the incoming attack.


    9th-Level
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    Death Sealer
    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 9
    Prerequisite: Four Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 full-round action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You
    Saving Throw: Fortitude partial

    You make a combination of strikes with lethal precision, ravaging your opponent’s most vital points. As he drops to the ground, paralyzed due to excruciating pain. You use this final moment of opportunity to instantly send him to his already impending death.

    This maneuver functions only against an opponent who is denied his Dexterity modifier to AC. As part of this strike you make a full attack action. Each attack automatically scores a critical hit and the critical multiplier is considered ×4. At the end of turn, if any of your attacks against your opponent were successful, he must make a Fortitude save (DC 19 + your Dex modifier) or become paralyzed for 1d4+1 rounds. If he fails the save, you may choose to make a Sleight of Hand check opposed by your opponent's AC. If successful, you make a Coup de Grace as an immediate action. You do not provoke an attack of opportunity by doing so.
    Last edited by Zakaroth; 2015-09-30 at 04:46 AM. Reason: Fixed a mistake in a maneuver

  3. - Top - End - #3
    Dwarf in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    New Feats

    Deathly Precision
    Due to keen precision you can place your attacks there were they deal great damage.
    Prerequisite: Weapon Finesse, one Black Lotus maneuver.
    Benefit: Whenever you make a successful attack with one of the preferred weapons of the Black Lotus discipline, you add both your Dexterity and Strength modifier to damage and critical confirmation rolls.

    Life’s Eclipse
    Your deeper insight in the deathly arts of the Black Lotus discipline allows you to perfect your stealth and assassination techniques even further. During combat you use this insight to put yourself one step ahead of your enemies, while setting them one step closer to their death.
    Prerequisite: Sleight of Hand 9 ranks, Deathly Precision, two Black Lotus maneuvers.
    Benefit: The Life’s Eclipse feat enables the use of three tactical options.
    Death Dealer: Whenever you successfully poison a foe in combat with one of the preferred weapons of the Black Lotus discipline, you may make an attack of opportunity against that foe as an immediate action. You can only gain benefit of this effect once per round.
    Deep Wounds: Whenever you successfully critical hit a foe in combat with one of the preferred weapons of the Black Lotus discipline, you deal an additional 2 points of Constitution damage.
    Master of Deception: While you are in a Black Lotus stance, you may use a Sleight of Hand check instead of a bluff check when fainting in combat.
    Last edited by Zakaroth; 2011-12-15 at 08:06 PM.

  4. - Top - End - #4
    Bugbear in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Maneuver Descriptions

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zakaroth View Post
    Veiled Stab
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    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 1
    Initiation Action: 1 standard action
    Range: Melee Attack
    Target: One creature

    As part of this maneuver, you make a single melee attack. Instead of a normal attack roll you must make a Sleight of Hand check opposed by your opponent's AC. If your Sleight of Hand check succeeds, this strike is considered a successful sneak attack, dealing sneak attack damage based on your ranks in Sleight of Hand. This maneuver stacks with any other sources of sneak attack damage.

    {table=head]Sleight of Hand|Sneak Attack
    1-5 | 1d6
    6-10 | 3d6
    11-15 | 5d6
    16-20 | 7d6
    21+ | 10d6
    [/table]
    Rouge with Martial study deals 19d6 sneak attack damage. Not exactly well balanced.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakaroth View Post
    Cruel Strike
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    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 3
    Prerequisite: One Black Lotus maneuver
    Initiation Action: 1 standard action
    Range: Melee Attack
    Target: One creature

    As part of this maneuver, you make single melee attack. If successful, your opponent suffers an extra +2d8 points of damage. When using a light melee weapon while initiating this maneuver, the weapons threat range increases by 2. This effect stacks with other effects that increase threat range.
    so 18-20 becomes 16-20 then doubles from keen to 11-20? Rather powerful for a level 3 manuver.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakaroth View Post
    Shroud of Sins
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    Black Lotus (Stance)
    Level: Black Lotus 5
    Prerequisite: Two Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 swift action
    Target: You
    Duration: Stance

    One basic principle behind the Black Lotus discipline is to initiate with malice and aspire to kill in a single blow, using any means necessary. While in this stance, you may add half your initiator level as a mastery bonus to the saving throw DC's of any injury poison you apply to your weapons. Furthermore, the first melee attack you make against an opponent, while wielding a light weapon, deals increased sneak attack damage. This is based on the number of ranks in Sleight of Hand you have. If you have 19 or more ranks, the first sneak attack may be made as a Death Attack (Fortitude DC: Initiator level + Int modifier). However, these attacks require the target to be unaware of the initiator or he must not recognize the initiator as an enemy. On a successful save the attack grants the normal 100% bonus to sneak attack damage.
    Finally, you may draw light weapons as an immediate action, allowing them to be used during an attack of opportunity, even while sheeted or concealed.

    {table=head]Sleight of Hand|Sneak Attack Bonus
    4-13 | +50%
    14-18 | +100%
    19+ | Death Attack
    [/table]
    Now with a small dip that rouge can be dealing 38d6 sneak attack damage.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakaroth View Post
    Black Serrater
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    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 5
    Prerequisite: Two Black Lotus maneuver
    Initiation Action: 1 standard action
    Range: Melee Attack
    Target: One creature

    As part of this maneuver, you make single melee attack. If successful, your opponent suffers an extra +5d8 points of damage. When using a light melee weapon while initiating this maneuver, the weapons threat range increases by 3 and multiplier by 1. This effect stacks with other effects that increase threat range.
    Same problem as cruel strike, but now you can reach 9-20 threat range, which means weapon mastery can give garunteed crits.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakaroth View Post
    Flourishing Lotus Stride
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    Black Lotus (Boost)
    Level: Black Lotus 6
    Prerequisite: Two Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 swift action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You

    As part of this boost you may make a move action as a free action. Moving at double your speed, ignoring difficult terrain and any penalties to hide and move silently this turn.
    The "Any Penalties" line stops every possible penalty, including the effects of glitterdust and the likes. Not fair.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakaroth View Post
    Withering Lotus Strike
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    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 6
    Prerequisite: Two Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 standard action
    Range: Melee Attack
    Target: One creature
    Duration: 10 minutes per initiator level
    Saving Throw: Fortitude partial

    As part of this maneuver, you make single melee attack. If successful you deal an extra 10d6 points of sneak attack damage plus an one point of damage per initiator level, and your foe must make a successful Fortitude save or take 1d6 points of Constitution damage and become unable to regain hit points or ability damage by any means (this includes Fast Healing, regeneration or forms of magical healing). Any heal checks to stabilize a dying creature under the effect of this maneuver automatically fail.
    Stab one guy once and he'll never recover hit points again. Ever. Way to powerful, as it removes the possibilty of recurring villians.
    Sorry, missed 10 min/level. Just kill all healing for 2 hours. Still, why make incombet healing even more useless?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakaroth View Post
    Eyes of Massacre
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    Black Lotus (Stance)
    Level: Black Lotus 7
    Prerequisite: Three Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 swift action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You
    Duration: Stance

    As you observe an enemy, your eyes focus, and the position of every vein, organ and weak spot becomes clear to you. While in this stance your critical threat range, when using light melee weapons, is increased by 2. This bonus stacks with other effects that increase threat range (apply after all other threat range altering effects). In addition, you get a mastery bonus on confirming critical hits equal to half your initiator level. Finally, your sneak attack bonus damage is increased to d8’s (from d6’s).
    Finally, uber crit range as a stance. find a way to get 1 more range and you can have criticals with every hit (Via weapon mastery).

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakaroth View Post
    Twisting Fang
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    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 7
    Prerequisite: Three Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 standard action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You

    With a single strike of deathly precision, you pierce your enemy in a vital point. A combination of deep twists causes severe internal damage, leaving your opponent hemorrhaged.

    As part of this maneuver, you make single melee attack. If successful, your opponent suffers an extra +10d8 points of damage. When using a light melee weapon while initiating this maneuver, the weapons threat range increases by 4 and multiplier by 2. This effect stacks with other effects that increase threat range. If this strike results in a critical hit you deal an extra 1d4 points of Constitution damage, and cause the target to bleed according to the table given at Bloodstainer.
    One feat and your 100% likely to crit on this. Hell, you had 3-20 treat range anyway thanks to eyes of massacre.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakaroth View Post
    Death Sealer
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    Black Lotus (Boost)
    Level: Black Lotus 9
    Prerequisite: Four Black Lotus maneuvers
    Initiation Action: 1 swift action
    Range: Personal
    Target: You
    Duration: End of turn.
    Saving Throw: Fortitude partial

    You make a combination of strikes with lethal precision, ravaging your opponent’s most vital points. As he drops to the ground, paralyzed due to excruciating pain. You use this final moment of opportunity to instantly send him to his already impending death.

    Until the end of turn, your melee attacks against a flat-footed opponent automatically score a critical hit and the critical multiplier is considered ×4. At the end of turn, if any of your attacks against a flat-footed opponent were successful, your opponent must make a Fortitude save (DC 19 + your Dex modifier) or become paralyzed for 1d4 rounds. If your target fails the save, you may choose to make a Sleight of Hand check opposed by your opponent's AC. If successful, you make a Coup de Grace as an immediate action. You do not provoke an attack of opportunity by doing so.
    auto-crit isn't big at this point, setting multipler to x4 could lower it, and AC will be untouchable by Slight of hand at that point. (I've seen AC 50 before buffs at level 16).

    Like the concept, but it still has some flaws.
    Last edited by jojolagger; 2011-10-04 at 12:07 PM.

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    Dwarf in the Playground
     
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    Default Re: Maneuver Descriptions

    Quote Originally Posted by jojolagger View Post
    [SPOILER]
    Rouge with Martial study deals 19d6 sneak attack damage. Not exactly well balanced.
    Yes, however you will only make a single melee attack that round, and at level 20. Dont really think its overpowered, just useful.

    so 18-20 becomes 16-20 then doubles from keen to 11-20? Rather powerful for a level 3 manuver.

    Same problem as cruel strike, but now you can reach 9-20 threat range, which means weapon mastery can give garunteed crits.

    One feat and your 100% likely to crit on this. Hell, you had 3-20 treat range anyway thanks to eyes of massacre.
    I didnt take into account the rapier. With a critical range of the favored weapons being 19-20, apply keen first > 17-20 -(+2)-> 15-20. The aim was to give about a 20 to 30% crit chance. Either way, it may indeed be better to remove the stacking clause..?

    Now with a small dip that rouge can be dealing 38d6 sneak attack damage.
    Only in melee, on the first attack, if the target is unaware. Still, to much? Lower it to 25% and 50% increase?

    The "Any Penalties" line stops every possible penalty, including the effects of glitterdust and the likes. Not fair.
    Yeah, bad wording on my part. It is suppose to ignore penalties due to moving at running speed. Will fix it.

    Stab one guy once and he'll never recover hit points again. Ever. Way to powerful, as it removes the possibilty of recurring villians.
    Sorry, missed 10 min/level. Just kill all healing for 2 hours. Still, why make incombat healing even more useless?
    Well, to ensure killing. Seemed to fit the principle behind the discipline. Jet, 10 min/level seems like overkill, will reduce it to 1 min/level.

    Finally, uber crit range as a stance. find a way to get 1 more range and you can have criticals with every hit (Via weapon mastery).
    Again designed with a base crit of 19-20 in mind > 17-20 > 15-20. However, you should note that by taking improved critical (rapier) while wielding a keen rapier you will also have a crit range of 12-20. Maybe reword it so it will set the crit range of any light melee weapon to 18-20?
    It was designed with the associated light weapons in mind. Which, at maximum investment, would end up with a 15-20 range, as intended.

    auto-crit isn't big at this point, setting multiplier to x4 could lower it, and AC will be untouchable by Slight of hand at that point. (I've seen AC 50 before buffs at level 16).
    In general, a Slight of Hand check has more likely hood to connect than a attack roll. Assuming you invested in it. As at level 20 it has a base "BAB" of 23, and is/can further be increased by your Dex and item bonuses. Or am I missing something?

    Like the concept, but it still has some flaws.
    Thank you, as well for your feedback, and I will be working on those flaws!

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    Colossus in the Playground
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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    Spiraling Lotus Stance is too good. Let me explain.

    The feat Great Dexterity increases your Dexterity score by 1. It has a prerequisite of being 21st level or higher.

    Meanwhile you can take Martial Study (Black Lotus maneuver) and Martial Stance (Spiraling Lotus Stance) and get +2 Dex AND a stacking bonus to hit and damage.

    So you've effectively made Martial Stance (Spiraling Lotus Stance) a better feat than an epic feat. It's too strong.

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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    Hmmm, seems like a weak feat actually, especially for epic :P
    But fair enough, will remove the dex bonus.

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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    Decrease the crit range increases by 1 on all maneuvers and stances that increase it (and don't have it stack with keen and Improved Crit) and remove Shroud of Sins since it is either completely useless or way too powerful.

    Withering Lotus healing inability should last less long. Maybe 1 round/level.
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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakaroth View Post
    Hmmm, seems like a weak feat actually, especially for epic :P
    But fair enough, will remove the dex bonus.
    Much better.

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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    Quote Originally Posted by Morph Bark View Post
    Decrease the crit range increases by 1 on all maneuvers and stances that increase it (and don't have it stack with keen and Improved Crit) and remove Shroud of Sins since it is either completely useless or way too powerful.

    Withering Lotus healing inability should last less long. Maybe 1 round/level.
    Followed your advice on the critical part. You really think Shroud of Sins cant be balanced? I already lowered the damage increase to max +50% (empowered), and note that its only on the first attack you make. Although, I just realized a major flaw in it. After the first attack, except for the poison DC bonus, their is no real reason to stay in the stance...

    Quote Originally Posted by NeoSeraphi View Post
    Much better.
    Thanks for pointing it out.

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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakaroth View Post
    Followed your advice on the critical part. You really think Shroud of Sins cant be balanced? I already lowered the damage increase to max +50% (empowered), and note that its only on the first attack you make. Although, I just realized a major flaw in it. After the first attack, except for the poison DC bonus, their is no real reason to stay in the stance...
    That's one of the reasons, yes. Another is that if you have no Sneak Attack, you don't even gain that benefit.

    Perhaps otherwise remove Veiled Stab (or make Veiled Stab simply add 1d6 or 2d6 Sneak Attack, without requiring Sleight of Hand ranks) and have Shroud of Sins grant Sneak Attack like Veiled Stab (but have the increases slowed to make it more balanced, like 1d6 Sneak Attack per 4 ranks in Sleight of Hand).
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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    That sounds like an idea. So, granting max 5d6 (L20), to the first sneak attack only or a bonus to each? Do you also suggest removing the Death Attack part?

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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    Quote Originally Posted by Zakaroth View Post
    That sounds like an idea. So, granting max 5d6 (L20), to the first sneak attack only or a bonus to each? Do you also suggest removing the Death Attack part?
    The Death Attack doesn't really fit I'd say. I'd have the Sneak Attack apply to every first attack of each round, if they are flanking or the target is flat-footed or Sneak Attack would otherwise somehow apply.
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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    Ok, made some changes to Shroud of Sins. It now gives bonus sneak attack dices to the first sneak attack each turn. If the target is unaware of the initiator, this bonus is doubled. Edit: Maybe base this of initiator level instead, granting 1d6 SA per 4 initiator levels, making it less attractive for rogues.

    Changed Eyes of Massacre: Now sets the light weapons threat range to 18-20, instead of increasing it.

    Also changed the "sneak attack" maneuvers; they now work against opponents that are denied their Dex to AC, instead of just flat-footed ones. So that u can use feint to set-up.
    Last edited by Zakaroth; 2011-10-05 at 04:02 PM.

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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    Ok, uploaded the discipline feats and tuned a lot of the maneuvers (mostly down).

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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    It's beautiful. Shadow Hand and Black Lotus. TIEM FOR TEH KILLING

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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    After having been away for some time, I have made several big changes: Removed some redundant maneuvers, shifted some around and added a few new ones. This is a near final version and would like to receive some final feedback. I am aware that the power level is above some/all of the original disciplines, but that is intended. I designed the maneuvers so that they scale as you level.
    I could use help with flavor texts for some of the maneuvers, as I'm not really good at story-like writing, so if someone wants to volunteer please let me know. You will of course get credits for doing so.

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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    Seems nice, at least at low levels (as I didn't really close read the higher levels); Asking for permission to steal (with credit, obviously) parts of this for a work-in-progress E6 game to which this might fit nicely
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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    Mad Props bro (or sis. use which ever applies). At first I thought the sneak attack dice was insane but then a thought occurred to me. First of all (and as it has been mentioned before) all of these "stacks" of sneak attack damage all apply to only one attack. A rogue with 2 weapon fighting and max sneak attacks have the potential for much more sneak attack damage if speced properly. So yah mad props.
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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    One obvious issue here is that targets that are immune to sneak attacks and poison and/or critical hits (such as undead, elementals, plants, etc) are completely immune to most of this discipline, making it much like Desert Wind in that respect. Obviously if the player has access to things that bypass this it might be okay, but that might not be available.

    I'd consider adding in a few maneuvers designed to deal with this, for example boosts that bypass critical immunity, stances that grant some alternate effect when you would have landed a sneak attack, and similar.

    JaronK

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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    I second what JaronK has stated. As well, looking at Veiled Stab, there is no mention of when the bleed damage occurs to an afflicted target (start of their turn? End of their turn?). Also, in the same ability, it states that your sneak attack bonus is +1d6/4 Initiator levels. Does this bonus stack with any Sneak Attack dice you may have, or does it replace them? The way it is worded leads me to believe that it replaces them, but I still think it should be made clear.

    I would also suggest making Death Sealer's DC increase for every successful hit above the first made in the Full Attack, for flavour purposes, but it isn't really necessary.

    Other than that, I really like this discipline. It's just freaking awesome.
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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    Here's one that I could see being in this school:

    Shifting Strike
    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 1
    Initiation Action: 1 standard action
    Range: Melee Attack

    Your deft bladework confounds your opponent, feinting and attacking in the same maneuver.

    When you initiate this maneuver, you may roll a Sleight of Hand check instead of an attack roll. If successful, he is considered flat-footed when resolving damage dealt by this attack.

    ----
    That would allow you to apply precision damage even on rounds after the first, without having to flank. Later versions could do things like forcibly move them 5 feet (Opening up an AO) or allowing you to poison the blade as part of the same action.

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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    Quote Originally Posted by Iceforge View Post
    Seems nice, at least at low levels (as I didn't really close read the higher levels); Asking for permission to steal (with credit, obviously) parts of this for a work-in-progress E6 game to which this might fit nicely
    Feel free to do so, it is there to be used

    Quote Originally Posted by BladeTempest View Post
    Mad Props bro (or sis. use which ever applies). At first I thought the sneak attack dice was insane but then a thought occurred to me. First of all (and as it has been mentioned before) all of these "stacks" of sneak attack damage all apply to only one attack. A rogue with 2 weapon fighting and max sneak attacks have the potential for much more sneak attack damage if speced properly. So yah mad props.
    Thanks for the kind words. That is exactly the reason for the relatively high damage. I like the idea of an assassin to strike to kill, in a single devastating blow. The maneuvers are designed to reflect this.

    Quote Originally Posted by JaronK View Post
    One obvious issue here is that targets that are immune to sneak attacks and poison and/or critical hits (such as undead, elementals, plants, etc) are completely immune to most of this discipline, making it much like Desert Wind in that respect. Obviously if the player has access to things that bypass this it might be okay, but that might not be available.

    I'd consider adding in a few maneuvers designed to deal with this, for example boosts that bypass critical immunity, stances that grant some alternate effect when you would have landed a sneak attack, and similar.
    I understand your point, but this was pretty much intended. The idea is that assassination abilities are specialized to target the living, thus mostly humanoid creatures. It kind of makes sense that these abilities wouldn't be ineffective against the non-living and "odd" creatures. One could always compensate for this weakness by taking some maneuvers from another discipline.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rakoa View Post
    • I second what JaronK has stated. As well, looking at Veiled Stab, there is no mention of when the bleed damage occurs to an afflicted target (start of their turn? End of their turn?).
    • Also, in the same ability, it states that your sneak attack bonus is +1d6/4 Initiator levels. Does this bonus stack with any Sneak Attack dice you may have, or does it replace them? The way it is worded leads me to believe that it replaces them, but I still think it should be made clear.

    • I would also suggest making Death Sealer's DC increase for every successful hit above the first made in the Full Attack, for flavour purposes, but it isn't really necessary.

    Other than that, I really like this discipline. It's just freaking awesome.
    • Good point, I'll add that.. I guess at the end of their round makes most sense.
    • It is suppose to stack, I'll clarify the wording.
    • Actually, I have considered this, but eventually refrained from it because I thought it was powerful enough as is (it's pretty much an instant kill on failed save)
    Thanks for the feedback and I am glad to hear that you like it :)

    Quote Originally Posted by Acanous View Post
    Here's one that I could see being in this school:

    Shifting Strike
    Black Lotus (Strike)
    Level: Black Lotus 1
    Initiation Action: 1 standard action
    Range: Melee Attack

    Your deft bladework confounds your opponent, feinting and attacking in the same maneuver.

    When you initiate this maneuver, you may roll a Sleight of Hand check instead of an attack roll. If successful, he is considered flat-footed when resolving damage dealt by this attack.

    ----
    That would allow you to apply precision damage even on rounds after the first, without having to flank. Later versions could do things like forcibly move them 5 feet (Opening up an AO) or allowing you to poison the blade as part of the same action.
    This is pretty much what Veiled Strike already does, plus more, or am I missing something?

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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    you should create a maneuver that make use of a ingested poison in battle

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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    I have a problem with Veil of Deception, it seems like you can counter the last attack from a fighter, and his previous attacks for the round retroactively become misses. Furthermore, the Initiator becomes immune to attacks (ranged and melee) for the rest of the round, and anyone who attacks him effectively becomes flat footed.
    Last edited by The Random NPC; 2013-03-25 at 03:54 PM.
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    Default Re: Black Lotus Discipline

    Well, if you choose to activate after the first attack, it will not affect attacks that have already connected. But the wording contains a mistake, it shouldn't say round, it was designed with "turn" in mind, I will fix this and further clarify the wording. Thanks for pointing this out.

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