OOTS #883 - The Discussion Thread

[J's]

It is quite likely Haerta never cast the spell.

It makes for an excellent threat, but if actually employed every surviving powerful person in the universe will work overtime to snuff you. If I am, say, Tarquin running a perfectly respectable tyranny, the risk that I might be suddenly dead because of a distant relationship to someone on the other side of the globe is frightening. Yes, Tarquin would be happy to help a random Arch-Paladin hunt down Haerta -- he would have no other choice.

I remember a theory that she did cast it on her enemy, who turned out to be related to her

But it has no support other than being mildly amusing.

Were the souls spliced to V given any back story in a side book? I have only read start of darkness.

[jidasfire]

I suspect that there is a zero percent chance Tarquin is forging an alliance with Xykon. Even if Tarquin, being the embodiment of efficient and orderly Lawful Evil, knew anything about Xykon, the embodiment of obscenely, pointlessly cruel Chaotic Evil, which he doesn't, he very clearly stated that he refuses to work with loose cannons, which I think we can safely say Xykon is. Moreover, he has nothing but contempt for Xykon's brand of typical conquer/destroy the world supervillainy. So no, no alliance there, but possibly preparing for Xykon in some way. That's not out of the question.

As to the strip in general, I think it's safe to say we're finally in the endgame now. There's still probably a ways to go for everything to resolve, but the stage is set for everyone's final plans or moves to come to fruition. The Order has found some major secret room (maybe the Gate, but I doubt it), the Linear Guild is making its final offensive, Tarquin is about to enact some plan, and Qarr is about to push Vaarsuvius. For all the people who think Xykon is coming, well, that's a possibility too, but I honestly think he and his associates will get there too late, and everything will be over but the crying before he does. Frankly, all the plots currently going are quite enough without the arch-villain of the comic coming along and stealing the spotlight, so I hope we just have to deal with the villains already on hand instead of adding even more. Given what plots are already going, it promises to be quite a finale.

[Rakoa]

I suspect that there is a zero percent chance Tarquin is forging an alliance with Xykon. Even if Tarquin, being the embodiment of efficient and orderly Lawful Evil, knew anything about Xykon, the embodiment of obscenely, pointlessly cruel Chaotic Evil, which he doesn't, he very clearly stated that he refuses to work with loose cannons, which I think we can safely say Xykon is. Moreover, he has nothing but contempt for Xykon's brand of typical conquer/destroy the world supervillainy. So no, no alliance there, but possibly preparing for Xykon in some way. That's not out of the question.

I wouldn't say an alliance with Xykon would be completely out of the question, but certainly one which Tarquin is planning to honour would be. I suspect any alliance Tarquin makes with Xykon will be to pit him against his enemies or otherwise eventually betray him, rather than ever really working with him.

[Ir0npanda]

Can somebody please please please explain all this business in this forum thread (including a post by the Giant) about Nale's sword?

[TRH]

Can somebody please please please explain all this business in this forum thread (including a post by the Giant) about Nale's sword?

He dropped his sword when he set off a trap at the beginning of the last OOTS v LG fight, and Belkar's ambush prevented him from getting it back before the Guild withdrew. Wand of Enervation aside, he's weaponless right now.

[Rakoa]

Can somebody please please please explain all this business in this forum thread (including a post by the Giant) about Nale's sword?

I assume that in certain panels there was a continuity error in which Nale had his sword in some and not in others, and it has since been patched up. Only inference on my part.

[ReaderAt2046]

It's HELL... it's all Reality TV all the time... 1,000 Channels of Jersey Shore

Nah, that wouldn't be in the succubus quarters, that would be in the punishment circles.

Do you suppose she's flicking through all the views on the Prime Material trying to find the one covering Nale and Co?

[Leirus]

If Xykon comes, I do not know if Tarquin will survive this. Scoundrel had it right.

[ReaderAt2046]

You know, you're right. I have gone too far this time. I'll stop making new strips now. Everyone, go home. The comic is over. My bad, I went too far.



Tell you what, you read the vampire template entry, particularly the part where it explicitly says that vampire clerics can still cast spells just with different domain access, and you tell me where it says anything about gods or temporary loss of access there. It doesn't. Vampire clerics do not need to worship a god to cast spells, because NO cleric needs a god to cast spells. The rules specifically allow for "non-theistic" clerics, and explains exactly what the effects of turning into a vampire has on a cleric: Rebuke instead of Turn, different domains. Period.

The only thing worse than the usual irrelevant rules pedantry is incorrect irrelevant rules pedantry.

Don't feel so sad, Giant. 99.9% or the people here love your strip, even if the .1% who make stupid comments are the most vocal.

[TheBST]

Well, let's hope that Qarr's dumb enough to:

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tell V that Durkon has died while V was off sobbing. That might be just the thing to make V man/woman-up and get back in the game.

[thatSeniorGuy]

I tell you, I saw the comic title before I read the comic, and I was panicked into thinking that the IFCC were going to swoop in and claim V's soul. Relieved that it didn't happen, though of course it's still on the table.

Blackwing is hilarious.

[LordofNaught]

I have no idea what you're talking about.

[Whistles innocently.]

You're up to something Giant. I don't know what yet, but I know I heard the sound of a Chekov's Gun being loaded, and this one has an itchy finger on the trigger. I'm watching you...

[Aquatosic]

So, Durkula has dark cleric powers now, huh. Probably worshipping Nergal since that is his master's god

[tahu88810]

I'm predicting the imp dies.
The loss of a familiar generally coincides with severely weakening the caster through exp loss, so this will likely happen at a fairly critical moment- Zz'dtri loses several levels and, thus, spell levels, perhaps losing his summoned creature in the process.

Would it mean much in the long run? Not really, but it would mean that the Order would be up against several fairly weak casters (given the Vampire LA and the spells they've both used up already), instead of two moderately powerful casters and one relatively fresh and high level caster.

[Jay R]

Well, let's hope that Qarr's dumb enough to:

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tell V that Durkon has died while V was off sobbing. That might be just the thing to make V man/woman-up and get back in the game.

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...or collapse into another guilt-induced period of uselessness.

[J's]

Ah. I rarely frequent the forum, so... Anyway, yeah, I was kinda going on that too, but I was too lazy to give the extra evidence. Anyway, makes sense. I like it!

Back at Malack's introduction of his god I said that was how Durkon would bring death and destruction back to his homeland. (At least I think I said it, I might be here less than you) Signs point to it being technically right, but no where close to how I pictured it :deerinheadlights:

[Another_Poet]

<good reasons Tarquin wouldn't work with Xykon>

I don't think he'd honor an alliance; he might offer one however. One way or another, a pretty horrendous army of undead + goblins is coming to Tarquin's continent. He needs to find a way to turn that to his advantage.

That said, I agree that it's the wrong point in the arc for Xykon to arrive.

[multilis]

2. If V *is* history's worst mass murderer, then Haerta must have never actually used Familiacide. Because even if she had also only used it once like V, I'm pretty sure her murder count from general "becoming an epic level necromancer" out takes dwarfs V's general murder count to date.
... So confirmation it has never been used before helps make the versimilitude jive much more for me.

It probably has been used, unless hero stopped villain at last available minute right after spell was researched. It is possible that the spell works better the higher level the caster is. (A villain would not research such a spell normally without using it fairly quickly)

It is possible that even Elan killed more with a single "self destruct" button press, there were lots of levels of dungeons that OOTS skipped in first arc of story.

It is more likely IMO that this is just an exaggeration meant to torment V.

[gorocz]

I don't think he'd honor an alliance; he might offer one however. One way or another, a pretty horrendous army of undead + goblins is coming to Tarquin's continent. He needs to find a way to turn that to his advantage.

That said, I agree that it's the wrong point in the arc for Xykon to arrive.

There's no army coming. They're travelling light. Redcloak, Xykon and TitS (Thing in the Shadows, Xykon's words, not mine) is all that's coming...

[IsmAsm]

Quick question: what happens to Planar Allies if their summoner dies?

[Risiez]

Can somebody please please please explain all this business in this forum thread (including a post by the Giant) about Nale's sword?

Also, use your inside voice.

[137beth]

To put it in simle terms for people. lets assume draketooth himself was alive at the time and it was cast on him instead. It would still have taken out the Black Dragon's in the fashion it did, but if Draketooths parents where dead then, (unless the cousins have been getting in each others pants, not something I'd discount totally), his siblings and their children are safe.

Kind of ironic that said cousins possibility aside casting it on a random draketooth would have done V's task just as well, but caused much less collateral.

This is wrong. Girard's siblings and cousins were his blood relatives, it doesn't matter whether his parents were alive.

[FlawedParadigm]

That would explain the banjo.

Yeah, before having experienced Arkansas, I always thought Deliverance was a fictional work. Now I understand it was a documentary.

[multilis]

"it's the wrong point in the arc for Xykon to arrive."

It could be the perfect time for Xykon to arrive.

1) Battle Royale, Mexican standoff, etc where battle gets complex because more than 2 groups fight each other.

2) Common for a weaker main hero to be forced to short term work with the #2 villain to stop the #1 villain from winning/destroying them both.

...

There could be up to 9 different sides and at some point we may have a battle that has many more than 3 sides at same time. (Eg. the Oracle was not home last time Xykon checked, his allies may represent a side)

[Starwaster]

Can we all just take note of the last panel.

"It's history's worst mass-murderer and HIS dim-witted bird."

Twelve Gods, this again? You do realize that every time Rich has to use a personal pronoun for Vaarsuvius that he pretty much rolls some dice to see if it's going to be he, she or it. Right?

[Mike Havran]

Well, let's hope that Qarr's dumb enough to:

Spoiler

Show

tell V that Durkon has died while V was off sobbing. That might be just the thing to make V man/woman-up and get back in the game.

Qarr doesn't seem to know this so far.

But after this strip, I really hope Zz'dtri will kick Nale's and/or Qarr's ass at some point. He's about as powerful as Vaarsuvius - that means most powerful by far in the old Guild - and they deceive him and treat him like a tool without a second thought.

[multilis]

Twelve Gods, this again? You do realize that every time Rich has to use a personal pronoun for Vaarsuvius that he pretty much rolls some dice to see if it's going to be he, she or it. Right?

Clearly V. is a female. A male would man up and solve his problems, while a female like V just sits there weeping and want sympathy. ;P

[Amphiox]

Blackwing wins the award for most unhelpful help by a pet or familiar. Congratulations.

He's a crow. As birds go, he should be high in INT, low in WIS.

I see a certain odd genre blindness in Tarquin here. I wonder if he's setting Nale up to fail intentionally, or if his concern for his family and legacy is actually causing him to miss the setup where he has everything in hand and then it all goes around as soon as he relinquishes personal control.

What he's done is split his party!

Which is either a big mistake and evidence of Tarquin's weakness, whatever that might be, or part of a bigger plan....

[Fshy94]

I'm predicting the imp dies.
The loss of a familiar generally coincides with severely weakening the caster through exp loss, so this will likely happen at a fairly critical moment- Zz'dtri loses several levels and, thus, spell levels, perhaps losing his summoned creature in the process.

Would it mean much in the long run? Not really, but it would mean that the Order would be up against several fairly weak casters (given the Vampire LA and the spells they've both used up already), instead of two moderately powerful casters and one relatively fresh and high level caster.

I'm no expert on D&D, but I checked the SRD, and it seems to be 200 xp per caster level loss, assuming you fail your save. Now, giving Z the insanely generous 20 wizard levels, that seems to be 4000 exp. And from what I can look up, the difference between levels 14 and 15 is about 14k exp.

Unless Z *just* levelled up, we're not going to see even one level loss in that case, and we're really not going to see multiple.

Clearly V. is a female. A male would man up and solve his problems, while a female like V just sits there weeping and want sympathy. ;P

You win a prize for the highest ratio of trolling potential to effort expended in a comment I've seen in awhile. :P

[NihhusHuotAliro]

I like Z, he doesn't seem truly cruel, sadistic, or unlikeable; just an evil spellcaster.

Whatever happens, I hope he lives and has some sort of relatively happy ending.

Now, is that Vaarusvius calling Qarr a s.o.b. in the last panel?

If so, wow. I thought only middle-schoolers knew that insult. Kudos to the giant if that's what he meant.