Is this horror encounter too horrific?

[Jeff the Green]

My Expedition to Castle Ravenloft players please go away.

My players are about to trounce their current encounter, and I only have one in the buffer so it's about time for me to plan out the one after that, and I want to check my idea before I invest heavy time into it.

A ways back the PCs fought an insane priest who'd caused a zombie plague by trying to raise his son from the dead. They made the mistake of doing Constitution damage to him, and so his Taint overloaded and he died. They also made the mistake of not securing his body, so when he rose as an undead there was no one to stop him from getting up and leaving. And then they made the mistake of letting the villagers gather his body, so no one realized it wasn't in the massive funeral pyre they had to build once they stopped the plague. Now it's time for that to bite them in the ass.

When they next go to town, they will discover that all the children are being kept indoors and every adult is about. The children have been vanishing for a week, usually about one a day, and the villagers are frantic. With one exception the players are goody two shoes, so I expect they'll drop everything to look for them. Eventually one child will mention that the last one to go missing went to the church to pray with "Father." This will hopefully make them nervous. Someone will also mention that the ravens have all disappeared.

When they go to investigate the church they'll discover that though it's been boarded up there are signs of it being lived in. Hopefully then they'll investigate the graveyard, where they'll be surprised by the priest and a shugenja that was a PC before she went insane from taint. The shugenja will have the most recent abductee splayed across an altar and be surrounded by seven tiny skeletons and a cloud of tattered ravens.

The priest will attack them with claws, bites, a venomous tongue, and a blade made of screaming souls while the shugenja casts some nasty spells on them empowered by the child's blood. The party will have to take out the shugenja before she kills the kid, but will have to deal with invisible walls of bone, the tiny skeletons (which explode when you destroy them), and the zombie ravens pecking their eyes out.

This will be their first real horror encounter; though they knew what they were getting into playing a Ravenloft campaign, previously it's been a sort of "heroes in a horrific situation" campaign. Do you think I'm going overboard with this? How can I ratchet up or down the horror as appropriate? (Note that this is a PbP game.)

[The Rose Dragon]

I don't think it's particularly horrific. Gory, but not horrific.

[Vultawk]

The only thing particularly horrific about it is that there are children involved. That can be a hot button issue for some people, but it doesn't seem like it's a factor with what you've said your group has dealt with in the past.

[ShadowFireLance]

This to me is particularly awesome, not even close to "horrific"

[Ionbound]

It's Ravenloft. The horrific bar is set so high, it'd take a Dwarf Fortress level of evil to even bump it. You're in the clear.

[GlorinSteampike]

Yeah nothing super horrific unless you try to go into great detail of the child on the altar having stuff done to them or something. Making them skeletons is a good idea, because that takes away from the child-likeness of it.

I find as long as you don't make the players actually attack/kill them children can be used effectively.

[allonym]

That's not really horrific at all. You get a bit of mileage out of kids-as-victims, I guess, but soaking things in blood is not horror.

Now, if you want it to be horrific, you make it look like your scenario is what's happening - have a conspicuous lack of children, at most one or two, who later disappear and the village disavows all knowledge of their existence, and have the village priest and magic user and a couple of other likely bad guys missing from the village, with villagers making dark allusions to them and shutting up if the players ask them anything. Plant clues in the places of the priest and magic user etc which might hint at bad things - a diary from the priest expressing bitterness at his ignorant flock, a dodgy-looking tome for the magic user, and so on. Then, once the players are really deep in the investigation and there's no going back, the actual truth comes to light.

The sacrificial cult is the children of the village, held in sway by a particularly charismatic kid who is very tainted. Perhaps have there be a location with corrupt magic where the child cult meets, the experienced inductees coercing newcomers to eat of tainted food which makes them suggestible, and twisted, and gives them some measure of power. The kids who disappeared earlier were some of the last few village kids to be recruited to the child cult. The village lives in abject terror of their own children, who sacrificed the priest and the magic user and the mayor and whoever to some nameless thing.

For added creepiness, add twisted nursery rhymes. Have a scene where older kids are trying to force a younger kid to lure her own parents to a spot so they can be taken. Play up themes reminiscent of playground bullying. Have the most unpopular kid in the village be there, genuinely happy to finally be accepted and loved by his peers, and have the charismatic ruler punish other kids (previously established to be brats) for picking on him. Read Lord of the Flies for inspiration for specific cruelties for children to commit. And so on, and so forth. Try to avoid a lazy way out, such as having the charismatic leader kid be secretly a demon.

It's creepy because it subverts not only your players' expectations, but also the instinctive feeling that children are innocent, and adults corrupt. It flips ideas of power and authority on their heads. And the parents, and quite possibly the players, depending on how murderhobo they are, will find it hard to stop their plans, not because they are stronger, but because they love their children, and harming a child is so intensely morally wrong. It would be important to make sure that they don't seem mindless, or utterly beyond redemption - definitely don't make it so that killing them could unequivocably be a kindness.

[Scow2]

It's Ravenloft. The horrific bar is set so high, it'd take a Dwarf Fortress level of evil to even bump it. You're in the clear.

In that case, the evil priest should be running a Mermaid-harvesting scheme beneath the chapel (Made of the blackest of bronzes and paved in the bones of dwarves, goblins, and skeletal elks), and instead of killing the children, kidnapping them and putting them in cages with wolves to be mauled to death or come out bigger, stronger, mentally destroyed killing machines, across from a moat of carp.

Rhesus Macaques should also harrass the players at every step, stealing their items, luring them into ‼☼Spinning Blade Traps☼‼ that menace with spikes, and into wild Elephant and Unicorn attacks... while screams rise from the darkness beneath, and... where am I going with this?

[1337 b4k4]

Doesn't seem particularly horrific to me. Like others have said leave things to the imagination rather than describing the horrific sacrificial scene and obviously be aware if any of your players have problems with the victims being children, other than that, it sounds like pretty typical horror tropes to me.

As long as you're already including zombie crows, I'd like to plug my corpse crow monster. It's stated for S&W and other OSR games but shouldn't be too hard to stat for 3.x if you're running that.

[Kazemi]

/snip

It's creepy because it subverts not only your players' expectations, but also the instinctive feeling that children are innocent, and adults corrupt. It flips ideas of power and authority on their heads. And the parents, and quite possibly the players, depending on how murderhobo they are, will find it hard to stop their plans, not because they are stronger, but because they love their children, and harming a child is so intensely morally wrong. It would be important to make sure that they don't seem mindless, or utterly beyond redemption - definitely don't make it so that killing them could unequivocably be a kindness.

This. Subversion is a great tool when it comes to the creepy and catching the players off guard prevents them from having had time to steel themselves. I also am a great fan of using Fridge Logic for a horror effect when you show them something non-threatening that turns out to have been a real threat. Google the creepypastas "White with Red" and "Portraits" for my personal favorite examples of this.

Also, Allonym, you scare me.

[Ionbound]

In that case, the evil priest should be running a Mermaid-harvesting scheme beneath the chapel (Made of the blackest of bronzes and paved in the bones of dwarves, goblins, and skeletal elks), and instead of killing the children, kidnapping them and putting them in cages with wolves to be mauled to death or come out bigger, stronger, mentally destroyed killing machines, across from a moat of carp.

Rhesus Macaques should also harrass the players at every step, stealing their items, luring them into ‼☼Spinning Blade Traps☼‼ that menace with spikes, and into wild Elephant and Unicorn attacks... while screams rise from the darkness beneath, and... where am I going with this?

I was thinking more along on the lines of the Obok Meatgod incident *shudders*. But we don't talk about that anymore.

[Killer Angel]

I was thinking more along on the lines of the Obok Meatgod incident *shudders*. But we don't talk about that anymore.

And with good reasons.

That said, I'm gonna join the chorus of "go with it, it's not too horror"

[Alejandro]

Horror would be if you had the PCs kill a bunch of insane children who attacked them relentlessly with knives on their way to the village, and then arrived in the village, where the villagers ask them to please help their insane children running rampant in the woods.

:D

[Jeff the Green]

Alas, I've already characterized the village children, so no murderous kiddy cult. And there's a paladin and a LG crusader around, so it'd be hard to make the villagers sacrificing their own kids.

I am looking to create some horror and squick, but not so much as to make my players dislike the encounter. I guess we'll see if this fits the bill.

(They've already had some fridge horror as they correctly guessed that they've been gated into Ravenloft for the purpose of turning them into zombies and then sending them back in order to infect their home-worlds and give Count Strahd hordes of undead at his beck and call. He's already got Eberron, and will soon have Rokugan. I'm just looking for some more direct horror this time around.)

[JustSomeGuy]

The creatures and overall vibe in 'Shadow Over Innsmouth' is creepy but allows for LG attacks/self defence, and i'm sure it could be adapted to fit... have your players read it do you know?

[SethoMarkus]

The creatures and overall vibe in 'Shadow Over Innsmouth' is creepy but allows for LG attacks/self defence, and i'm sure it could be adapted to fit... have your players read it do you know?

Along the same lines, what about "The Rats in the Walls" or "The Lurking Fear".

Neither of those is necessarily about (overt) evil, so even a Paladin living in the town might not hold back the tide alone, while still having cause to fight against the slowly creeping madness that such subtle evil brings. The keys to horror is to a) not let the PCs/audience know all of the information, let them make inferences, and b) continually take away or threaten to take away their hope.

Just read through some Lovecraft or Poe to get ideas.

(Also, as a note, rather than describe any gore or bloodshed, infer that it has happened but leave the details up to the player's minds. Rather than show or describe what happens, describe the reactions of any other witnesses; nausea, vomiting, screaming, psychotic episodes, etc)

[JustSomeGuy]

Agree'd - if you explicitly tell the mabout the inhuman horror, they'll start the sword-swinging purgery, but if the townsfolk are all described as normal humans (with references and rumours of the hidden monstrosities and barbarism, but no direct evidence until they're in the belly of the beast so to speak) the PC's won't be attacking them in good conscience until they're way in over their heads and you set up the big 'breaking out of the depths of hell' adventure, if that's where you want to go with it

[Draken]

Doesn't really strike me as particularly horrific.

If you do want more horrendous, you could add a Gray Jester to the fight and change the children from skeletons into Bleak Ones.

[Fighter1000]

There are things about this encounter you describe that creep me out.
I don't know the minds of your players, but if I was in your campaign, I am pretty sure my mind would go back to this encounter at some point, and shudder.
I like that their are pretty much just undead for the most part. You don't slide into the otherworldly creature idea, which is a refreshing change.
Based on all deez posts, I've got to say Call of Cthulhu is on the mind now.

[Wardog]

In that case, the evil priest should be running a Mermaid-harvesting scheme beneath the chapel (Made of the blackest of bronzes and paved in the bones of dwarves, goblins, and skeletal elks), and instead of killing the children, kidnapping them and putting them in cages with wolves to be mauled to death or come out bigger, stronger, mentally destroyed killing machines, across from a moat of carp.

Rhesus Macaques should also harrass the players at every step, stealing their items, luring them into ‼☼Spinning Blade Traps☼‼ that menace with spikes, and into wild Elephant and Unicorn attacks... while screams rise from the darkness beneath, and... where am I going with this?

Don't forget the zombie whales and giant sponge husks. And kitten-rot dust.

[Doorhandle]

Don't forget the zombie whales and giant sponge husks. And kitten-rot dust.

...You know what, dwarf fortress would have a great atmosphere for a horror game. (and that last husk is totally a shoggoth.)

[Ionbound]

Alas, I've already characterized the village children, so no murderous kiddy cult. And there's a paladin and a LG crusader around, so it'd be hard to make the villagers sacrificing their own kids.

I am looking to create some horror and squick, but not so much as to make my players dislike the encounter. I guess we'll see if this fits the bill.

(They've already had some fridge horror as they correctly guessed that they've been gated into Ravenloft for the purpose of turning them into zombies and then sending them back in order to infect their home-worlds and give Count Strahd hordes of undead at his beck and call. He's already got Eberron, and will soon have Rokugan. I'm just looking for some more direct horror this time around.)

Whoa, wait. Eberron got zombie apocalypse'd? How did that happen?

[Scow2]

Whoa, wait. Eberron got zombie apocalypse'd? How did that happen?

DM Fiat, because that's the only justification. That setting by default is too awesome to fall to one because it would ruin everyone ELSE'S plans for the apocalypse.

[Jeff the Green]

Whoa, wait. Eberron got zombie apocalypse'd? How did that happen?

A previous character (a Healer from Eberron) was killed, plague-zombified, and sent home (to his sleeping wife and children ). The plague is almost unstoppable over the long run, especially since it transmits to already dead bodies (such as the thousands of victims of the Last War) and the only reason the heroes were able to stop it in Barovia is that it was a small town with a small graveyard.

Rokugan will suffer the same fate when they kill the shugenja (whom they don't realize has the plague) and she gets transported home.

So while they try to take down Strahd they'll have to deal with at least two gates, one of which pours out zombie warforged etc. and the other pours out zombie samurai.

[allonym]

I'm afraid I don't see how you will ever manage to evoke horror with that plot. It's an error I made a couple of times when I was starting out as a Call of Cthulhu keeper. Scale is very important for horror. The most effective horror movies are not on a global scale. This is the reason that World War Z is not a horror movie/novel (though it certainly has "elements"), but 28 Days Later is. Now, that's fine if you want an epic confrontation game with a little bit of gruesome seasoning, but for bona fide horror you need a heavily scaled back scope.

[AstralFire]

Yeah, see, I hate horror games/stories, and I'd be mildly interested in playing in a scenario like you've described, because it's really more "heroes against the vile darkness with horror elements" than "horror game with D&D elements."

[Jeff the Green]

Yeah, this isn't meant to be a horror game. (I'm not a fan of most "pure" horror anyways, only Lovecraft for me.) It's a horrific fantasy, like the Weeping Angel episodes, a lot of The X Files, or some of Neil Gaiman's stuff. I mean, the climax will be fighting a megalomaniac Vlad Tepes expy with hordes of zombies from two or more worlds. It's the little stuff before that, like the skeleton children, seeing the zombified healer by teleported back to his sleeping wife and daughters, the were-rat swarm, and the realization that Strahd has the ability to strip a paladin's immunity to disease that I'm aiming to inject a little horror to.

[Alejandro]

This is the reason that World War Z is not a horror movie/novel (though it certainly has "elements"), but 28 Days Later is.

To be fair, the movie is pretty horrible.

[allonym]

In that case, it's all good.

One piece of advice I would carry over from actual horror games to a horror-themed heroic game is: All Victories Are Pyrrhic.

[Winter_Wolf]

I don't see anything real horrific in the OP. Maybe I'm jaded, but that sounds more or less like a regular story arc to me.

If you really want to horrify your group, you need to know what horrifies each of your players, and to what extent. Then milk it. Milk it until it's dry. Then let them think they've overcome it or at least gotten away from it. Then use it to tear off their faces the faces of their closest allies and friends. Dial it back if anyone starts to cry/wet themselves.

Like I said, probably jaded. And maybe a little cruel.