Werewolf

[Jonrea]

Is taking the template worth it? Which is better, natural or afflicted. There is no alignment restrictions, so im free there.

I think starting ECL is 7.

Undead campaign. All monster races allowed.

I was thinking going warblade with focus on Tiger Claw and Stone Dragon (TC for flavor and SD for DR removal).

Backup plan is a living Hunter of the Dead (Undead Hunter? the PrC from CW that doesn't like undead). If the above option isn't a good idea, what would be a good build for this?

[JaronK]

As a general rule, if the LA gets above 2, it's almost impossible for the template to actually be decent.

There are a few exceptions of course.

JaronK

[TheOOB]

I have found lycanthropes are one of the few templates that create a viable character, assuming you are not a spellcaster.

Afflicted lycanthrope is only really good as a roleplay option, even with skill point investment in control shape shapeshifting is too unreliable to be a good combat option.

Natural lycanthropes are great though, DR 10/silver helps to make up for the three levels of hp your missing, and the stat bonuses and natural attacks help make up for the three levels of AB your missing. Werewolves are a viable choice, but not the best lycanthropes around(their stat returns arn't great for the 2 levels you invest into them). My favorite type of lycanthrope to be is a Werefox(using the MMs dog for the fox statitics), dogs have better stat bonuses then wolves, and have one less HD.

As for class, warblade is a fairly poor choice, your manuvers will be pretty far behind because of LA so you'd be better off playing a fighter, whos bonus feats are almost as valuable any level. I've had some success as a monk (you can use unarmed strike and all natural attacks in the same round), but the low attack bonus+LA is hard to overcome at times.

[PinkysBrain]

A low level afflicted lycanthrope should be prepared to do a lot of his adventuring and combat in animal form. As such an animal with pounce is pretty much a necessity.

It's a viable way of fighting, but slightly silly.

[Fizban]

Hehe, yea Dog would be the animal of choice there. Keep in mind these aren't our modern pet dogs, these are big, angry, wolf-related dogs. The MM suggests the stats for animals such as coyote and african wild dog, which I prefer since Frostburn put the fox as a tiny animal. As for class, once again as TheOOB said, melee class is best. Fighter is always useful, barbarian looks good if hybrid rage is as good as it sounds. If you want more attacks you could pick up the Rapidstrike feats from the Draconomicon, but they're pretty prerequisite heavy.

[Jonrea]

So how does natural weredog fighter going into warshaper sound?

[Beelzebub1111]

Werebadgers (using a dire badger as the animal) are AWESOME as fighters. If you can overlook your teammate's jokes about mushrooms and snakes. +4 str +6 dex and (here's the clincher) +8 con that plus a rage ability is totally worth the +2/+3 LA

[Fizban]

That's be +8 con actually, and 3 animal hit dice. It's got it's perks.

And yes, Warshaper is quite awesome, use it, and laugh.

[PinkysBrain]

Actually, the best animals are dire animals ... they have all good saves and better ability scores for their HD/size. Especially the saves are a big deal IMO.

Dire Ape, badger, bat and jackal are the best choices I think.

A Dire Badger lycanthrope barbarian2/frenzied berserker would be pretty fearsome ... throw in a martial adept class and an Iron Heart Vest of Iron Heart Surge so you can break out of your rage/frenzy when necessary.

[Beelzebub1111]

badger/barbarian would be redundant. stick with fighter

[Captain van der Decken]

If you're thinking Tome of Battle, Warblade pretty much replaces Fighter.

[PinkysBrain]

badger/barbarian would be redundant. stick with fighter

Oops, forgot for a moment rage is exactly the same between the two.

[tape_measure]

why not werebear?

+16 str, +2 wis, +2 dex, +8 con. You lose the raging ability, but you were actualy looking for that to begin with. You get strong bites an claws also.

[Fireball.Man.Guy.]

I always go for Werebear, I once had one that carried around a sailing ship, just cause he could.

[Were-Sandwich]

I've always wanted to play a Were-Dire Wolf, because I have this awesome Wolfen miniature to use for him.

[PinkysBrain]

He need something with at most 3 HD to hit the required ECL. I'd go for a human natural were-dire-badger crusader 1, ECL7 exactly.

[Shazzbaa]

As far as afflicted lycanthropes go, TheOOB speaks true, from my experience -- I've maxed out Control Shape and still fail checks at inopportune moments.

As far as Dire Animals go, remember that your hybrid form is the size of whichever form is larger (animal or humanoid), so if you're changing to a larger form you've got a chance of wrecking your armour. Unless there's some reason I'm not aware of that this isn't an issue...

What is Warshaper?

[Fizban]

PrC in Complete Warrior IIRC. It requires some form of shapecahanging, and gives you benefits when in alternate forms. Among these are the ability to grow/enhance natural weapons, increase your con score, heal yourself, become immune to crits, and shift faster.

[Beelzebub1111]

why not werebear?

+16 str, +2 wis, +2 dex, +8 con. You lose the raging ability, but you were actualy looking for that to begin with. You get strong bites an claws also.

Three words, too many hitdice. That is, before you can take any benifits of a character level.

[Collin152]

Way more than 3 words, but true to the core.

[Shazzbaa]

PrC in Complete Warrior IIRC. It requires some form of shapecahanging, and gives you benefits when in alternate forms. Among these are the ability to grow/enhance natural weapons, increase your con score, heal yourself, become immune to crits, and shift faster.

*glances over warshaper*
*COUGHSPUTTER*
Is this for real and for true?

I'll have to read it more carefully when I can borrow my friend's CW... but... um... that looks... nice. 0_o

[fireinthedust]

Warshaper is huge. Actually, the whole book has huge PrCs (way better than the DMG ones, mostly). Although for a lot fo them you're giving up a lot: caster levels, etc, just for one special ability.

Frenzied Berserker isn't bad, though, for a werebadger, if you really want to go all out on the berserking.

Shazzbaa: nice sketchbook!

[JimmyDPawn]

I'd have to go with werebear, mosty for the reason; Lawful good.

Werewolves (except for one prestige class of them, I can't recall exactly which one) always have the risk of going evil.

Werebears, the worse you have to worry about is turning Lawful Good. Unless you REALLY find yourself wanting to argue with the Paladin, it's not too much of an issue.

Also, the wizards site has a section with 'levels' of lycanthropes, so you can start them at lower levels than their full LA.

EDIT: Link added http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/sp/20031114a

[Fizban]

Bah, that were-alignment stuff is crap, plenty of people have their own ideas about what animals are inherently evil. Since when is a bear lawful good anyway? And what alignment is a badger? Whatever you need it to be, that's what.

[ghost_warlock]

In 2nd ed, the werebear was Chaotic good. I guess that's something they've changed...

As far as lycanthropes go, I've always like ones that aren't in the MM in the current edition - werebats (use direbat), wereravens (not viable in 3.X), and the werepanther. In an former campaign I played a werepanther barbarian with the whirling frenzy variant. Very sweet!

[Captain van der Decken]

Werewolves (except for one prestige class of them, I can't recall exactly which one) always have the risk of going evil.

There's a CG elf version, with no hybrid form. Not sure what book it was in.

[TSGames]

*glances over warshaper*
*COUGHSPUTTER*
Is this for real and for true?

I'll have to read it more carefully when I can borrow my friend's CW... but... um... that looks... nice. 0_o

Yeah...I had a friend play a warshaper changling monk. It was mean, fast healing 2(while conscious), 15ft reach(or something like that) increased damage and natural attacks, but no one seemed to mind, we all had very powerful characters.

[Thomas]

There's a CG elf version, with no hybrid form. Not sure what book it was in.

Lythari. Races of Faerûn. They're not exactly werewolves (but in 3rd ed. use the template); they're Lythari, an elf race that's been around since before pretty much all the other races (Lythari and Avariel were among the first to enter Toril).

[Yerrik]

On the lycanthrope subject:

Because halflings are small they can be tiny, medium or small were-races.

So a halfling can be a were-cat or were-monkey.

How do they handle the str atribute?

A monkey has:
Str 3, Dex 15, Con 10, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 5
-8, +4, 0

So would the halfling were-monkey in hybrid form have +4 dex, or +4 dex, -8str? Or am I missing something?

[Fizban]

All lycanthropes gain +2 to Wisdom. In addition, when in animal form, a lycanthrope’s physical ability scores improve according to its kind, as set out in the table below. These adjustments are equal to the animal’s normal ability scores -10 or -11. A lycanthrope in hybrid form modifies its physical ability scores by the same amount.

On the one hand, it says improves, on the other hand, it says "equal to". Logic says it gets reduced if needed.
Edit: although the hybrid form takes the larger size, so it might not have the str penalty.