Any hope for the Samurai?

[Knight_Of_Twilight]

Among my group, we all have our least favorite classes, but the samurai is universally loathed. I wouldn't normally say this, but even the phb II doesn't have a section on it in the expanded classes part, when every other base class got one.

I wish there was someway to make this class good, but I just can't seem to find it. Have any of you found away to make it effective.

[X15lm204]

I recommend kanachi's version from these boards. It's well balanced, it works well, it fits the flavor better, and it allows for much more flexibility.
http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10215

[Fax Celestis]

No. It sucks.

It also is not the only class that did not receive an expansion. The Spirit Shaman did not, nor did the Spellthief, Wu-Jen, Shugenja, or Ninja.

[Skyserpent]

Wu Jen got Complete Mage...

[Scorpina]

...or the Healer.

[Ramza00]

Archivist also didn't get one.

So where is this Samurai class you speak of, I look through all my complete books and phb2 and I just don't see what you are talking about. Are you by chance talking about the 3.0 Oriental Adventure Samurai?

[Ramza00]

Dread Necro also, I wonder what they would have done as subsitution options for it anyway (besides the warmage advanced learning).

[Fax Celestis]

Archivist also didn't get one.

So where is this Samurai class you speak of, I look through all my complete books and phb2 and I just don't see what you are talking about. Are you by chance talking about the 3.0 Oriental Adventure Samurai?

Samurai's in CWar.

[Scorpina]

Samurai is in Complete Warrior. Page 8.

[Matthew]

It has a picture of a Dwarf Samurai next to it *shudder*.

[Lothorus]

I've never really enjoyed the idea of a core class for samurai, knights, paladins, and other specialty warriors myself. To me, classes like that are goals that warriors spend a good deal of time training for and aspiring to be, so I usually prefer any prestige versions might be available. The old 3.0 manual, Sword and Fist had a prestige Samurai that was alright. I forget the details, but the gist of it was that the samurai focused a bit and got boosts to strength or weapon damage or something. You might want to look into it if you have a second-hand book store nearby. If you're lucky, they might have a DnD section full of cheapo old version stuff.

[Scorpina]

It has a picture of a Dwarf Samurai next to it *shudder*.

I thought it was just a human with a beard...

[Fax Celestis]

Nope, it's a dwarf.

[Matthew]

[mabriss lethe]

yeah...shudder...twice for good measure.
AEG did a passable adaptation of it in Rokugan. The basic switch involved paying exp instead of gp to enhance ancestoral weapons and giving technique feats that opened up whole new doors almost exclusively for them. (samurai could take tech feats along with fighter bonus feats, anyone else wanting to purchase a tech feat had to pick it up at lvl3/6/9 etc.) Passable, I say, still not all that good.

[Norsesmithy]

There is no samurai in complete warrior, Most of the Samurai in games I participate in are actually just LN fighters with falchions, great bows and glaives, sometimes with longspears too.

[Ramza00]

Samurai's in CWar.

Thats wierd my copy of complete warrior seems to be missing part of page 8, all of page 9, and all of page 10. It goes straight from Hexblade to Swashbuckler

So what is the samuari everybody is talking about

[Bears With Lasers]

The Samurai: And You Thought The Divine Mind Was Bad...

[Person_Man]

How to be an effective Samurai:

1) Be some other melee based class.

2) Take the Frightful Presence feat from the Draconomicon.

3) Roleplay.

You are now a Samurai.

WotC tried twice to make this class, and screwed up both times. There is no hope for it until 4.0 comes out, whenever that will be. But the mechanics exist for you to make any type of Samurai that you want to be.

[Fizban]

Alternatively:

1)Be any melee class.

2)Take the Kiai Shout feats from CWar

4)Take Kensai levels if you really need to

3)Roleplay

Considering that the Kiai Shout baisically gives you only unique ability of the samurai class, except for full fleged Frightful Presence.

[Knight_Of_Twilight]

Well, I ment how to make that class good...but yeah, I can make a decent one out of a knight, or even a paladin If I want.

And I didn't realize so many classes missed out- I'll do my homework next time.

[I_Got_This_Name]

Alternate way to play a Samurai:

1) Watch some Samurai movies.

2) Play a Swordsage or Warblade. Select maneuvers around a theme you saw in the movies.

3) Change the names on your maneuvers. Roleplay.

[Bears With Lasers]

Well, I ment how to make that class good...but yeah, I can make a decent one out of a knight, or even a paladin If I want.

Basically, fixing the Samurai requires reworking so extensive that it'll be a new class, not a modified Samurai.

[JaronK]

Yeah, the Samurai is pretty much the best example of how not to make a class. Power wise, it's weak as all hell. It's also completely inflexibile, so all Samurai have to be pretty much the same. Furthermore, the mechanics don't fit the samurai flavor at all. All in all, it just stinks, and no, there's nothing you can do about it except steal from other classes.

With that said, Monk/Kensai with whirling steel strike can actually do a great unarmoured Samurai impression.

JaronK

[Ambrogino]

AEG did a passable adaptation of it in Rokugan.

1) AEG didn't write Oriental Adventures, WotC did.
2) The Rokugan Samurai AEG did write in Legends of the Five Rings has no kind of magic weapons, but skills based on the schools they have studied under, most of which are restricted by Clan.

[Caelestion]

Stunningly, in AEG's d20 supplement Rokugan, they did indeed present a slightly revised version of WotC's Samurai from Oriental Adventures.

[pestilenceawaits]

Yeah I am with the group on this the samurai is lame The main thing I like is the frightful presence.

[Renegade Paladin]

There are feats for that.

[Matthew]

Yeah, if I were going to play a Samurai Character, I would just use the Fighter Base Class.

[Captain van der Decken]

I'd use the Warblade base class, personally.

Samurai is really just one of those hopless classes.