Damage reduction

[Human Paragon 3]

If you gain similar resistance (for example fire resistance 5 to fire) from two different class features from two different classes or templates, do they stack of overlap? My adult in me says they just overlap, but the kid in me says they should stack together to create super fire resistance (of 10).

So which is it?

[Solo]

they do not stack. the highest DR applies.

[RandomNPC]

i am not reading from a book or SRD, as i am to lazy and it is to late.

i however beleive they overlap.

[Yechezkiel]

The only time they do stack is when one of the sources specifically states so; most DR entries (and even energy absorb effects) go into the details if they are meant to work together.

[Damionte]

They overlap unless the class ability specificalyl says they stack.

Some class abilities (mainly prestige classes) will actually tell you thier abilities stack with that of X-class/classes. In which case they stack.

[Human Paragon 3]

I'm looking specifically at the Fiend-Blooded prestiege class. It does not specifically say it stacks, but I don't think I'd be remiss to let it stack with the DR granted from the Tiefling race. This bends the RAW, but it does seem in the spirit.

Somebody wiser is free to smack me down.

[Damionte]

We know it's against the rules you kow it's against the rules. but in the end ....it's your game do what you want.

[Human Paragon 3]

We know it's against the rules you kow it's against the rules. but in the end ....it's your game do what you want.

Natch. I don't want to get into a circular discussion where everybody is stating the obvious at one another- rather I'm wondering if this would be unbalancing. Fiend Blooded is a pretty strong prestige to begin with.

[Yechezkiel]

Natch. I don't want to get into a circular discussion where everybody is stating the obvious at one another- rather I'm wondering if this would be unbalancing. Fiend Blooded is a pretty strong prestige to begin with.

Well, allowing DR to stack would be unbalancing.

If it's just in this one case? Other players will demand the same ruling and to be fair they'd have to be allowed. I say don't allow this as an exception, keep it simple.

[Damionte]

Well, allowing DR to stack would be unbalancing.

If it's just in this one case? Other players will demand the same ruling and to be fair they'd have to be allowed. I say don't allow this as an exception, keep it simple.

ditto...

Hmm since my reply was too short... double ditto

[The_Pyre]

I think we would have to differentiate between DR and energy resistance, as these are two separate things. DR from different sources do stack. Energy resistance probably does not.

[Dhavaer]

I think we would have to differentiate between DR and energy resistance, as these are two separate things. DR from different sources do stack. Energy resistance probably does not.

And on a related note, Damage Reduction functions for each attack, and Energy Resistance functions every round. So you can overwhelm Resistance but not Reduction.

[Person_Man]

Damage Reduction and Energy Resistance are two totally different things.

Damage Reduction applies to each attack, and does not apply to energy attacks (even nonmagical ones), spells, spell-like abilities, supernatural abilities, or weapons with qualities that bypass it. Damage reduction always overlaps, using the best reduction value for that attack, unless the description specifically says otherwise (almost never in 3.5 rules).

Energy Resistance only applies to total damage that round. It almost always applies to a specific energy type (or list of energies). It doesn’t matter whether the damage has a mundane or magical source. Energy resistance overlaps, unless the description says otherwise (again, almost never in 3.5).

So not only do they apply to two totally different things, but Energy Resistance is generally a lot weaker and easier to overcome, since it only applies to total damage that round.

Also from a build optimization point of view, neither is particularly attractive. With the exception of a few cheese templates (Mineral Warrior), Damage Reduction is just too hard to get, and if you do get it, its generally quite low. Energy Resistance/Immunity is a great spell to have, but its just too situational to waste gp or class/racial abilities on it. In the end, your best defense is almost always the standard High Con, high Saves, high AC, and a few plum special abilities like Evasion and Immunity to Crits.

[Skjaldbakka]

And on a related note, Damage Reduction functions for each attack, and Energy Resistance functions every round. So you can overwhelm Resistance but not Reduction.

wahuh? I coudl have sworn resistance was agaisnt each source of damage. Could you quote that ruling?

[Dhavaer]

wahuh? I coudl have sworn resistance was agaisnt each source of damage. Could you quote that ruling?

A creature with resistance to energy has the ability (usually extraordinary) to ignore some damage of a certain type each round, but it does not have total immunity.

From here.

[Gavin Sage]

Whenever damage reduction completely negates the damage from an attack, it also negates most special effects that accompany the attack, such as injury type poison, a monk’s stunning, and injury type disease. Damage reduction does not negate touch attacks, energy damage dealt along with an attack, or energy drains. Nor does it affect poisons or diseases delivered by inhalation, ingestion, or contact.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/specialAbi...amageReduction

Seems this quote is important to this question.....

[AtomicKitKat]

For some reason, I think the SRD is wrong about it, or there was errata somewhere. The 3.5 MM explicitly states "ignore some damage each time it takes damage from the listed energy type."

Edit: So I did some digging on Google, and it seems "each round" is from 3.0, whereas "each attack" is for 3.5, which makes more sense(and ties it to Damage Reduction, so you have less systems to remember. Besides which it makes very little sense to do it on a per round basis. "Oh look. Your fireball heated that Balor up so badly that he suddenly started feeling pain when your Warmage cohort threw an Orb of Fire at him. Now, round 2 begins. Oh look, your fireball failed to even scratch that Balor...")

Old thread, but relevant to this.

[Gavin Sage]

There's nothing I can find about per round or anything like that. Protection from Energy prevents all energy damage from one type until exhausted. Resist Energy (spell or ability) provides reduction of energy damage until the spell expires.

And Damage Reduction does squat on energy damage.

[NullAshton]

Well actually, they would stack if they're the exact same ability.

Here's a precedent. Both Paladin and Cleric have the turn undead abilities, however there is not any text specifying that they stack. HOWEVER, look at the description of multiclassing. It gives three examples of three seperate abilities in core stacking, that weren't in the description of the classes themselves. Thus, it can generally be gathered that it's intended for similar class features(like energy resistance) to stack.

[Human Paragon 3]

Well actually, they would stack if they're the exact same ability.

Here's a precedent. Both Paladin and Cleric have the turn undead abilities, however there is not any text specifying that they stack. HOWEVER, look at the description of multiclassing. It gives three examples of three seperate abilities in core stacking, that weren't in the description of the classes themselves. Thus, it can generally be gathered that it's intended for similar class features(like energy resistance) to stack.

Link please?

[Gavin Sage]

Link please?

Natural energy resistance stacks with natual energy resistance. Though this is tricky to do in core since normal race don't have energy resistance. However Epic characters can have Energy Resistance:

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/feats...ergyResistance

Which notes it increasing existing resistance but not stacking with any non-permanent source.

[TheOOB]

Well actually, they would stack if they're the exact same ability.

Here's a precedent. Both Paladin and Cleric have the turn undead abilities, however there is not any text specifying that they stack. HOWEVER, look at the description of multiclassing. It gives three examples of three seperate abilities in core stacking, that weren't in the description of the classes themselves. Thus, it can generally be gathered that it's intended for similar class features(like energy resistance) to stack.

Take a look at this

When a paladin reaches 4th level, she gains the supernatural ability to turn undead. She may use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + her Charisma modifier. She turns undead as a cleric of three levels lower would.

Paladins count as clerics three levels lower for turning undead, thus it is extreamly strongly implied it would stack with a clerics ability to turn undead. A cleric 5/paladin 5 counts as a cleric 5/cleric 2 for turning undead, which is the same as saying cleric 7.

You'll see similar wording in the wizard and sorcerers summon familiar ability.

Examples are rarely (if ever) evidence of a point in RAW (as many examples, especially example chars are errorneous), but they can help to back up a point.

[Matthew]

Interesting question this. I never really noticed the change over between editions and I'm not sure I'm entirely satisfied with the RAW here. I can see it with individual blows, but not multiple simultaneous Fire Balls...

[MeanJoeSmith75]

Yes Paladin and Cleric stack as far as level of ability goes, but not in volume so to speak. A 5 Paladin/5 Cleric would not get 6 turn attempts without an Extra Turning Feat.