Animal Messenger (and how to use it wrong)

[Tanarii]

They don't. Why would they attack adventurers? In any sane campaign, tiny creatures are going to flee, hide, etc. unless... (a) attacked themselves, (b) protecting lairs or young, (c) summoned, compelled, charmed, etc., (d) specifically trained to do so, or (e) unable to flee and obviously threatened. I see none of this. However, if the DM is going to rule that they attack anything on site... they would immediately attack you when you released them, every animal (dog, wolves, badger, crane, etc.) on the way (likely all dying over a half-mile), or each other (they certainly aren't all liter mates, same species, etc.)

I've met lots of tiny snakes. I find them in my backyard all the time. I pick them up and toss them into a nearby bush. They attack spiders. Even poisonous ones... you push away with a rake and they slither off.


Any good DM would see you nearly kills yourselves trying to collect the snakes -- both from being attacked by the snakes, or from random encounters in wilderness areas likely to have lots of poisonous snakes. Then spending vast amounts of time feeding, transporting, and caring for hundreds of snakes. Then, upon release... they go deliver their message and then fly/slither away. Probably summons hundreds of hawks, eagles, and other predators around the areas. A poor (or annoyed) DM who is willing to rule that 1' long snakes suddenly become aggressive lunatics... would immediately have them attack you upon release, or other animals or each other (most getting themselves killed).

Rattlesnakes other vipers are all Tiny. They can and will bite humans if they are distressed and/or cornered.

I'm not agreeing with the OP that such creatures should attack anyone automatically. But a hundred of them in a room or cave with you, assuming they somehow get there, are a pretty serious threat that no sane person would dismiss as something that can be pushed away with rake.

[RickAllison]

Rattlesnakes other vipers are all Tiny. They can and will bite humans if they are distressed and/or cornered.

I'm not agreeing with the OP that such creatures should attack anyone automatically. But a hundred of them in a room or cave with you, assuming they somehow get there, are a pretty serious threat that no sane person would dismiss as something that can be pushed away with rake.

And all it takes is one person unknowingly pissing one off to cause nearby ones to become hostile, who residents must beat back which causes others to become hostile, and so on. All it takes is one bad move and the entire thing will become madness.

[Tanarii]

And all it takes is one person unknowingly pissing one off to cause nearby ones to become hostile, who residents must beat back which causes others to become hostile, and so on. All it takes is one bad move and the entire thing will become madness.

With that many in one place, would they already be hostile due to the presence of other?

I don't really know that much about viper snakes, I was just commenting on the silliness of dismissing a hundred or more in the same room as you. Are they combative amongst themselves? Does being in the presence of females make the males agressive?

To the researchtorium!

[ATHATH]

So what we need then is a tiny beast (perferably flying) that more inclined than not to attack larger creatures.

What we need to do is get a few hundred stirges...

I think this is a much better idea- we don't have to debate about the aggressiveness of snakes, and, IIRC, stirges tend to come in large swarms, which makes collecting them easier.

[SharkForce]

I think this is a much better idea- we don't have to debate about the aggressiveness of snakes, and, IIRC, stirges tend to come in large swarms, which makes collecting them easier.

well, easier in one respect, anyways.

i can imagine some... complications that could arise from trying to collect a horde of giant mosquitoes.

[Segev]

well, easier in one respect, anyways.

i can imagine some... complications that could arise from trying to collect a horde of giant mosquitoes.

Can you imagine the size of the malaria they'd inflict? >_> <_<

[smcmike]

I'd just like to say that, irrespective of my relative lack of fear of snakes, this thread has me wanting to play an evil Druid. I don't think animal messenger is a very good assassination spell, but it's a heck of a good spell for terrorizing people. You think a pile of snakes is scary? How about random animals, including venomous snakes, just randomly showing up day after day and threatening you?


Also, maybe biting. Catch yourself a really aggressive viper and send it to the baths at just the right time....

[RickAllison]

I'd just like to say that, irrespective of my relative lack of fear of snakes, this thread has me wanting to play an evil Druid. I don't think animal messenger is a very good assassination spell, but it's a heck of a good spell for terrorizing people. You think a pile of snakes is scary? How about random animals, including venomous snakes, just randomly showing up day after day and threatening you?


Also, maybe biting. Catch yourself a really aggressive viper and send it to the baths at just the right time....

Send a plague of pests through ritual casting from the dump. Rats who fulfill the spell won't return, they will hunker down in nice and warm places in the new area.

Send sick and dying creatures. Spread disease and disgust as streets become filled with dying fauna. Send insects to start destroying crops as they reproduce, omens due to things like black cats. The possibilities are endless!

[SpawnOfMorbo]

I leave 5e for a while, well mostly, and I come back to this?

Nice.

Can we give the snakes hats?

http://imgur.com/gallery/g0pzP

[RickAllison]

I leave 5e for a while, well mostly, and I come back to this?

Nice.

Can we give the snakes hats?

http://imgur.com/gallery/g0pzP

"Why are you running from me? I'm jussssst a cute little bunny. How nicccccce to ssssssee you!"

[SpawnOfMorbo]

"Why are you running from me? I'm jussssst a cute little bunny. How nicccccce to ssssssee you!"

"kissssses for all"

[BW022]

Rattlesnakes other vipers are all Tiny. They can and will bite humans if they are distressed and/or cornered.

I'm not agreeing with the OP that such creatures should attack anyone automatically. But a hundred of them in a room or cave with you, assuming they somehow get there, are a pretty serious threat that no sane person would dismiss as something that can be pushed away with rake.

Assuming a rattlesnake isn't small-sized.

Again... lets assume the animal is insanely vicious. Why doesn't it attack the druid when released? Ok... lets assume the animal friendship makes it docile but only during the trip. Fine. The magic ends and the animal suddenly thinks the best thing to do is to attack something -- ignoring that even rattlesnakes will flee. Fine. Why isn't the nearest or most frightening creature... another snake? I'm pretty sure the other snakes would be a much more frightening than some human 15-20 feet back. And... I have never seen a video of a rattlesnake knowingly attacking someone with a torch held in front of them, let alone someone with five torches laying on the ground.

All 100 aren't likely to arrive at once. However, even if a dozen or so arrive... why aren't they attacking each other? Why the human -- likely holding a torch? Is the human blocking their way out?

[SpawnOfMorbo]

Assuming a rattlesnake isn't small-sized.

Halfling sized rattlesnakes? 45lbs snakes??? Are you kidding me????

Their average weight, for the big type, is like 10lbs.

We don't need to multiply that by a factor of 4, no thank you.


*****

As for the rest of your post, you really are just glossing over a lot of stuff. I can't take your posts seriously.

[Tanarii]

Assuming a rattlesnake isn't small-sized.

Rattlesnakes & Vipers are Poisonous Snakes, which makes them Tiny. Nice try with the attempting to cast doubt where there is none to be cast though.

Again... lets assume the animal is insanely vicious.

No, lets not. Let's instead assume it behaves like a perfectly normal poisonous snake and bites when it feels threatened / cornered.

All 100 aren't likely to arrive at once. However, even if a dozen or so arrive... why aren't they attacking each other? Why the human -- likely holding a torch? Is the human blocking their way out?

Who says they aren't attacking each other? And what's holding a torch got to do with anything? Do you think snakes are afraid of light or something?

Actually, let me rephrase that. Are snakes afraid of light? I honestly don't know.

[SpawnOfMorbo]

Rattlesnakes & Vipers are Poisonous Snakes, which makes them Tiny. Nice try with the attempting to cast doubt where there is none to be cast though.

No, lets not. Let's instead assume it behaves like a perfectly normal poisonous snake and bites when it feels threatened / cornered.

Who says they aren't attacking each other? And what's holding a torch got to do with anything? Do you think snakes are afraid of light or something?

Actually, let me rephrase that. Are snakes afraid of light? I honestly don't know.

As someone who has been almost bit multiple times by snakes, they do not fear light.

Though, if you spray gasoline (mix with water in a spray bottle) around they will slither away like crazy because that sets off their senses and they hate it.

[RickAllison]

Halfling sized rattlesnakes? 45lbs snakes??? Are you kidding me????

Their average weight, for the big type, is like 10lbs.

We don't need to multiply that by a factor of 4, no thank you.


*****

As for the rest of your post, you really are just glossing over a lot of stuff. I can't take your posts seriously.

Technically, the largest venomous snakes do reach around 45 pounds. Of course, that is far from typical, just like how atypical, massive halfling a would fit into the lower end of the Medium pool were it not for proportions, and how exceedingly large humans reach sizes that would be Large for weight.

[SpawnOfMorbo]

Technically, the largest venomous snakes do reach around 45 pounds. Of course, that is far from typical, just like how atypical, massive halfling a would fit into the lower end of the Medium pool were it not for proportions, and how exceedingly large humans reach sizes that would be Large for weight.

I was thinking of specifically rattlesnakes, I've seen some long ones but they would never get that big or weigh all that much.

Of course it doesn't matter what they are in real life, in 5e they are tiny

[Safety Sword]

The ultimate plan... except for doors.

[RickAllison]

I was thinking of specifically rattlesnakes, I've seen some long ones but they would never get that big or weigh all that much.

Of course it doesn't matter what they are in real life, in 5e they are tiny

Eastern diamondback rattlesnakes. Not the largest, but the heaviest. Greatest measured weight was 34 pounds, though longer specimens have been reported but not scientifically verified. Not quite halfling-sized, but fairly close!

[Tanarii]

The ultimate plan... except for doors.

And needing to sneak in and visit the place first.

And know a general description of someone in the place to trigger the message delivery.

[RickAllison]

And needing to sneak in and visit the place first.

And know a general description of someone in the place to trigger the message delivery.

Really a better spell for terrorizing a populace than infiltrating a hideout.

[SpawnOfMorbo]

The ultimate plan... except for doors.

I don't know about you, but I have doors and windows in my house and yet I still find a snake or two every year in my basement.

And I'm pretty sure my doors seal up better than what the doors during the middle ages did.

[Safety Sword]

I don't know about you, but I have doors and windows in my house and yet I still find a snake or two every year in my basement.

And I'm pretty sure my doors seal up better than what the doors during the middle ages did.

The only animals in my house are the humans and the insects.

Then again, I live in Australia, so if you find a snake in your house you just concede and move out.

[ATHATH]

Assuming a rattlesnake isn't small-sized.

Again... lets assume the animal is insanely vicious. Why doesn't it attack the druid when released? Ok... lets assume the animal friendship makes it docile but only during the trip. Fine. The magic ends and the animal suddenly thinks the best thing to do is to attack something -- ignoring that even rattlesnakes will flee. Fine. Why isn't the nearest or most frightening creature... another snake? I'm pretty sure the other snakes would be a much more frightening than some human 15-20 feet back. And... I have never seen a video of a rattlesnake knowingly attacking someone with a torch held in front of them, let alone someone with five torches laying on the ground.

All 100 aren't likely to arrive at once. However, even if a dozen or so arrive... why aren't they attacking each other? Why the human -- likely holding a torch? Is the human blocking their way out?

Well, if we go with the Stirge plan, a Warforged (presented in that Eberron UA) Druid could be their handler.

[RickAllison]

Well, if we go with the Stirge plan, a Warforged (presented in that Eberron UA) Druid could be their handler.

The real question is whether he is a Maximal or a Predacon

[SharkForce]

The real question is whether he is a Maximal or a Predacon

clearly predacon. anyone possessed of basic decency would not permit giant mosquitoes continue to exist :P

[R.Shackleford]

clearly predacon. anyone possessed of basic decency would not permit giant mosquitoes continue to exist :P

We all must all be predacons then, as we have the means to eradicate mosquitos but haven't yet.


http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-35408835

[Kurt Kurageous]

Luzl. Great theory. Joe wins by suggesting stirges, which you can harvest, control, and count on to attack. Plus, they suck!

[R.Shackleford]

Just realized that a lot of people are terrified of spiders and snakes.

[Safety Sword]

Just realized that a lot of people are terrified of spiders and snakes.

I'm not, but thought it played better to pretend to be...