Bard/Ranger, waste of time?

[SolkaTruesilver]

Hello all. I was wondering some things in my mind, and this combinaison struck me as.. somewhat odd at first (I was more into a Bard/Paladin idea, the kind of dashing duellist, defender of Love and Truth, Crusader for the Damsels), when I tough that maybe a Ranger/Bard was more usefull for a skill monkey (about Jump/Balance/Climb needed to have fun with the ambiant settings, duel on ramps and cross rooms with the luminary)

While the Paladin/Bard-appropriate feat (Devoter Performer) is easy to find, I wondered what was the best combination? More bard than paladin, or the other way around?

But back to the topic at hand, is there any feat that would make the combo Ranger/Bard useful? They are both light armor classes, in need of dexterity. Maybe you could take Favored Ennemy (Critics), if you have the Urban Ranger alternate class.

And no, I don't want Damage Reduction for broken glass, thank you

[JellyPooga]

Well, there's always the feats that imporve your Favoured Enemy and Bardic Music abilities that would make up for any loss of ability through multiclassing (e.g. Natural Bond to make up for lost Animal Companion abilities and Extra Music to get more Bardic Music uses per day...that sort of thing). However, I would not focus on the things that would suffer (like Bardic Music and Animal Companion), but would rather focus on the things that stack/corellate, such as spellcasting...though I don't know specifics, I'm sure that there must be some Ranger/Bard spellcasting combos that are pretty Bad-A. As a Ranger/Bard, you'll be a better combatant than a straight Bard and as such might be able to make good use of 'tactical' feats like Improved Trip/Disarm/Feint and Elusive Target, especially if you go down the TWF tree for Ranger.

I can't really think of any PrC's that particularly stack Bard and Ranger, though if you add in a couple of levels of Rogue or Master Thrower (for Evasion) and a Bard/Ranger/Thief Acrobat could prove a frustrating opponent, good for confounding foes whilst the rest of the party deals with them. Remember that Favoured Enemy applies to Bluff checks, which means Feint checks too, so Invisible Blade isn't out of the question (though again, you'll need a levels or two of Rogue, more than likely, for better effect). A slightly bizarre Bard/Ranger PrC to head for would be Geomancer...only need 2nd level arcane and divine spellcsating to qualify really...like I say, it'd be a bizarre one, but possible.

Hmm, can't really help you out much more than that...sorry

P.S. On the Paladin/Bard thing, you're better off with more Paladin than Bard (more BAB, better mount, more Smite, better Turning and better Paladin spells OR better bardic music/knowledge and bard spells...you choose)

[Everyman]

Complete Warrior has a martial bard PrC, which I believe is called warsinger. It gives you some skill points, bardic music, and a good HD/BAB progression. It might be right what you're looking for.

As far as feats go, I really can't think of much, other than perhaps some bardic music feats that improve combat (Ironsong chant comes to mind).

[Skjaldbakka]

Warchanter + 1 lvl 20 fighter + army of mooks = army of level 1 mooks with BAB of 20. Now that's an army, especially if you train them in power attack.

[adanedhel9]

One of my favorite characters of all time was a Bard/Ranger. The concept started as a guy who left town to live in the unforgiving wild, and came back some time later with grand stories to tell and a thirst for more adventure.

Mechanically, I did nothing to really integrate the two classes, beyond a few shared skills. I ended up taking levels in Horizon Walker and focusing more on the ranger side, but he still used his bardic abilities on a regular basis. I played him as a real generalist: I think there was one encounter, for two whole campaigns, where I felt unable to contribute anything significant to the party's success.

So... I guess I'm saying that if you're fine playing a generalist, there's no reason you can't go with a Bard/Ranger.

[Draz74]

Dip in Bard for Whip proficiency, take Oversized Two-Weapon Fighting, and start being a two-whip trip monkey?

Or get a two-level dip in Arcane Archer (too bad it has weak prereqs) so that you can start Imbuing your Arrows with Bard spells.

Or write a homebrew PrC that progresses both classes. It should be balanced if it progresses them both at about a 2/3 rate. Maybe full progression of Bardic Music and Animal Companion, plus alternating levels of spellcasting progression? With 6 skills/level, but leaves out some of the best bard skills that the ranger doesn't have, like UMD/Know (Arcana)? Either Medium BAB and all good saves, or Good BAB and a poor Fort save?

... Or just write a homebrew feat like Devoted Performer. Makes Ranger levels count for Bardic Music progression, and Bard levels count for Animal Companion and Favored Enemy. Simple enough, yes?

[Lemur]

Warchanter + 1 lvl 20 fighter + army of mooks = army of level 1 mooks with BAB of 20. Now that's an army, especially if you train them in power attack.

Heck, you don't even need the fighter. By that point, the War Chanter will at least be level 15, meaning that all the mooks can get BAB 15, which isn't shabby itself.

In any case, the War Chanter is a pretty nice class in terms of flavor and abilities for anyone desiring a combat oriented bard. Like bards in general, it goes better with someone they can work with, in this case, other melee combatants, but has potential on its own as well.

[BDEYE]

Rangers can pick up an animal companion and cast Nature's Ally, and there are PrC's that allow for additional animal companions. Your basic strategy could be to gether your horde together, start singing to boost their stats, and sent them into battle.

Or, if you wanted to take it solo, Ironskin Chant is a good used of Bardic Music for a two-weapon-fighting character that wants to jump right into the thick of things.

[ClericofPhwarrr]

Personally, I'd take the ranger variant in the PHB2 that swaps your animal companion for making any enemy hit by you be considered flanked for your allies' attacks. You won't keep having a weak, dead animal companion, and your party rogue will love you more than imaginable.

Combine with a trip/disarm whip build, and you could be quite the supporting character.