Non-monk unarmed combatant?

[skeeter_dan]

I'd like to make an NPC for a campaign I'm DMing soon that uses unarmed fighting extensively but is not in any ways a monk. Are there any good builds around for that or am I going beyond the limits of the Wish spell?

[Rachel Lorelei]

Why not try the Unarmed Adaptation of the Swordsage, from the Tome of Battle? It's like a monk, only better at everything in every way.

[ByeLindgren]

Haven't had a chance to look at it too much, but there's the Reaping Mauler from CWar. It's a grapple-focused 5 level PrC which describes itself as more of a fighter progression than a monk progression.

Looking over it now, most of the abilities are WIS-dependent and, honestly, not that good. It's a 5-level PrC, and the saves scale with the PrC level. So the capstone ability makes Mr. Rogue make a DC what, 18 Fort save or die if he remains grappled for three rounds? You better have killed him already...

[Rachel Lorelei]

Haven't had a chance to look at it too much, but there's the Reaping Mauler from CWar. It's a grapple-focused 5 level PrC which describes itself as more of a fighter progression than a monk progression.

Looking over it now, most of the abilities are WIS-dependent and, honestly, not that good.

The class is horrible. It's for grappling, which is bad enough--but grapplers want to be *big*, for the bonuses.
As soon as you get bigger than Medium, you stop qualifying for the Clever Wrestling feat, and thus for Reaping Mauler, losing all of its abilities.

[ByeLindgren]

Yeah, I'd go with the Swordsage.

[Zeful]

The only thing I can think of is a high strength high wiz psychic warrior with the powers dissapperating touch and hammer along with the other touch powers and maybe a dip in monk to get wiz bonus to ac.

[Zincorium]

Frostrager from frostburn and Fist of the Forest from complete champion are both good, short prestige classes for a barbarian-ish starting point.

Wouldn't be too hard to take one of those and reaping mauler to show the monks exactly how nerfed they are.

[lord_khaine]

there is a feat in ToB that increases your unarmed damage based on your lv, its called superior unarmed strike or something like that.
if you take that feat you can make a unarmed combatent out of just about anything.

[Inyssius Tor]

Actually, it increases your unarmed damage based on your monk level. Still very useful, but it doesn't scale unless you're almost a monk (Unarmed Swordsage is close enough).

EDIT: And, as the person below me pointed out, I got the above statement exactly wrong. Oops.

[Swooper]

Nope, based on character level. Go check. I'm at work so I can't quote the exact wording, but I remember a sentance that was along the lines of: "If you're a monk, this feat instead changes your base unarmed damage to that of a monk four levels higher."

[Fixer]

Ok, so, wait, if the character I am building for my son (Fighter/Swashbuckler) has that superior unarmed strike he can deal unarmed damage as a monk equal to his character level?

AWESOME! I was hoping to find something to fix that.

[Artemician]

Ok, so, wait, if the character I am building for my son (Fighter/Swashbuckler) has that superior unarmed strike he can deal unarmed damage as a monk equal to his character level?

AWESOME! I was hoping to find something to fix that.

Not.. really. If it did, it'll be terribly overpowered. Instead, you deal Unarmed Strike damage as a small monk equal to your character level. Less twinky, but still pretty decent.

[Fixer]

What if he was already small sized?

[Roog]

What if he was already small sized?

There is no mention of what happens then,

but the obvious result is that you would reduce the damage as normal (for smaller sizes).

[JEntropy]

The class is horrible. It's for grappling, which is bad enough--but grapplers want to be *big*, for the bonuses.
As soon as you get bigger than Medium, you stop qualifying for the Clever Wrestling feat, and thus for Reaping Mauler, losing all of its abilities.

I think you could do both with a goliath. They have discretion of being medium or large based on which is better for them (Races of Stone, for those interested).

But I haven't looked into reaping mauler, and if it sucks, there's no point anyway

[Artemician]

After rereading the ToB, i realize I have made a factual inaccuracy in reporting. Superior Unarmed Strike does NOT state that it grants you damage as a Small monk of your level. Instead, it supplies a table, with damage values identical to the damage for a small monk's Unarmed Strike.

If you are not medium, the damage value remains the same.

[Darrin]

After rereading the ToB, i realize I have made a factual inaccuracy in reporting. Superior Unarmed Strike does NOT state that it grants you damage as a Small monk of your level. Instead, it supplies a table, with damage values identical to the damage for a small monk's Unarmed Strike.

If you are not medium, the damage value remains the same.

If you compare the unarmed damage of small monks vs. medium monks, you may notice that the damage of a medium monk is pretty much identical to a small monk 4 levels higher (essentially, it moves your damage up a step). So, Superior Unarmed Strike gives a small monk the unarmed damage of a medium monk.

Unfortunately, there's a discrepancy if you're only dipping monk for a few levels, and have a character level that would give you better damage had you not taken any monk levels. As I recall, the feat description doesn't allow you to take the better of the two.

I'm still pondering if Fist of the Forest is worth the two damage steps... gotta rework my Grippli build, see if I can get his unarmed damage up to suitably frightening levels. Superior Unarmed Strike + Improved Natural Attack + Giant's Stance (ToB) + Fist of the Forest + Enlarge Person = don't piss off the frog.

[FireSpark]

Depending on the books you are allowed to use, your choices can vary. I say try a fighter for your unarmed build. My wife has assembled a terribly frightening bare handed warrior that is sure to end most fights before they begin. For starters, she chose to be a half-ogre (from savage species), so right off the bat she's got big STR bonuses and she's Large. For feats, she has chosen to start with taking Improved Unarmed Strike and Superior Unarmed Strike. Then she has Flying Kick (ComWar), Powerful Charge (Ebr), and Improved Powerful Charge (Ebr). These three feats will ensure that when she makes an unarmed charge attack, and hits, she'll be unloading 2d6+3d6+1d12+STR, all by 6TH LEVEL!!!! THrow in the Two-weapon fighting tree (and her crazy STR bonuses) and her half-ogre has gained a new nickname. The Squisher!

[Shhalahr Windrider]

There is no mention of what happens then,

but the obvious result is that you would reduce the damage as normal (for smaller sizes).

By Common Sense anyway. By the RAW, it just says, "You deal more damage with your unarmed strikes, as shown on the table below." And they give a table that references character level and unarmed damage without any mention of size—Medium, Small, or otherwise.

[Person_Man]

Frozen Dwarf Hulk Smash!!!

[Curmudgeon]

Items will help with your unarmed attacks. A Fanged Ring will, among other things, grant these feats:

• Improved Unarmed Strike
• Improved Natural Attack (unarmed strike)

Then you can throw in a Monk's Belt and you've got 2d6 unarmed damage (if medium size) with no feats or class levels expended.

[Ramza00]

There is a binder vestige that gives you a monk's unarmed damage equal to your binder level.

[Tellah]

Frozen Dwarf Hulk Smash!!!

That link goes to the edit dialog for that build--which is a rad build, by the way, as usual.

[Person_Man]

That link goes to the edit dialog for that build--which is a rad build, by the way, as usual.

Whoops, thanks. I fixed it. Here's the correct link again.