Collegiate Wizard

[BardicDuelist]

Out of curiosity, is there really any reason to not take this (except for the obvious RP reason of not having gone to a wizarding colledge)?

[Fax Celestis]

IIRC, it prevents you from specializing.

[Manave_E_Sulanul]

Care to explain, Fax? I don't have my book on hand, and I don't recall that.

[Fax Celestis]

I r le wrong.

Looks like the only downside is that you don't get any opener metamagics.

[Ulzgoroth]

I don't see any indication of that...

Um, there's the usual reason. It costs a feat. The same reason as you'd have for not taking weapon focus. Though it's certainly better.

[bosssmiley]

Collegiate Wizard



Looks pretty good, 2 extra spells known/lvl, and the Knowledge(Arcana) buff is a nice little fillip. Nothing about it being restricted to generalists though...

[Manave_E_Sulanul]

Whew. But yes, Collegiate Wizard really is one of those things you really just ought to take if you are role playing something appropriate. I'm not as much of a fan of Precocious Apprentice though.

But then, I tend to have bad luck rolling the check for that, if I recall.

[Recursive]

Out of curiosity, is there really any reason to not take this (except for the obvious RP reason of not having gone to a wizarding colledge)?

Since you ask for reasons not to take it, I'll play devil's advocate:

If magic scrolls are freely available for purchase, then you could just buy and scribe two extra spells per level...so essentially you've traded a feat slot for some cash. That might be really convenient when your wizard is going through a cash-starved phase, but in the long run money is replaceable and feats aren't.

Granted, you also get a watered-down version of Skill Focus: Knowledge (arcana), but it can't be used as a prereq for prestige classes like an actual Skill Focus feat could.

Now, with devil's advocate mode turned off, let me say that I actually love this feat. Great flavor for any research-oriented wizard, college-educamated or not. The knowledge bonus stacks with skill focus, so a real know-it-all scholar can take both...and the extra spells are highly valuable in campaigns where magic is mysterious and not available at your corner spell shop.

[Fax Celestis]

It also means you have one feat less with which to qualify for PrCs.

[Tellah]

Assuming that you'd be filling up your spellbook by copying them (for a fee) from other Wizards' spellbooks, the feat saves a Wizard 58,800 gp by the time he hits 20. That's pretty decent, I think.

[Pink]

Assuming that you'd be filling up your spellbook by copying them (for a fee) from other Wizards' spellbooks, the feat saves a Wizard 58,800 gp by the time he hits 20. That's pretty decent, I think.

It'd be a foolish wizard who doesn't get a blessed book as soon as possible to reduce that fee.

[Morty]

It'd be a foolish wizard who doesn't get a blessed book as soon as possible to reduce that fee.

Or a wizard who doesn't want to buy ridiculous magic items just to be even more overpowered.
As for Collegiate Wizard, it's seriously overpowered feat. It saves a lot of money and effort, and is even stronger if your DM is stingy about scrolls.

[Saph]

That's not even the best thing about the feat. The best thing is that it makes the wizard no more dependent than any other class on getting to town.

Many campaigns feature long stretches in dungeons/the wilderness/other hostile areas where you can't go shopping. Wizards are normally at a disadvantage doing this, because they only get two spells with each level up and can't develop the big spellbook which gives them so much of their effectiveness. But with Collegiate Wizard, they get four, which is enough to cover most bases.

- Saph

[Pink]

Hmmm...If this somehow stacked with the elf generalist wizard, that'd be overpowered. Course no possible way for it to stack like that by it's wording, just a thought.

I actually like that generalist wizard variant, so upon hearing about this, I like this feat as well. More spells is always good. It's a power boost sure, however knowing spells only does so much in the long run. You still need to prepare them, to pick only a handful of them to memorize.

[Fax Celestis]

Hmmm...If this somehow stacked with the elf generalist wizard, that'd be overpowered. Course no possible way for it to stack like that by it's wording, just a thought.

I actually like that generalist wizard variant, so upon hearing about this, I like this feat as well. More spells is always good. It's a power boost sure, however knowing spells only does so much in the long run. You still need to prepare them, to pick only a handful of them to memorize.

And why doesn't it stack?

[Pink]

Well, the feat doesn't stack so much as replaces it. The feat doesn't say double the spells added to spellbook each level, it says it bumps up to four, specifically. The only thing that'd remain of the variant is that bonus highest level spell slot.

[psychoticbarber]

The only question I have is "Why didn't somebody tell me about this feat sooner?"

[Tellah]

Well, the feat doesn't stack so much as replaces it. The feat doesn't say double the spells added to spellbook each level, it says it bumps up to four, specifically. The only thing that'd remain of the variant is that bonus highest level spell slot.

I'm running an elf generalist with Collegiate Wizard right now, and we've ruled that it stacks. He gets five spells each level--two for being a wizard, one for elfism, and two for Collegiate Wizard. Is this not the correct interpretation?

[Arbitrarity]

Wrong order if you want that to work. 2 base, switch to 4 for collegiate, add one for elven generalist.

Cause Collegiate sets spells/level at 4, instead of 2, not adds 2, or doubles.

[Pink]

My mistake. I thought elf wizard had it set as three instead of 2. In reality it's one bonus.

I really need to stop working from memory.

[Fhaolan]

Wow. That's a seriously good feat. I never noticed that one before.

It really points out that the various officially published feats do vary a lot in the cost/benefit analysis, though. I've got a weird idea... I'm going to start a new topic for it, though, so as to not completely derail this one.

[TheOOB]

It's a nice feat, but it doesn't really let you do anything you couldn't do, or make you more powerful then you could be without the feat. It's a nice feat, saves lots of money, but the feat could also be a metamagic feat or spell focus or something.

[Seatbelt]

The Wizard in my Ravenloft game is using it, because I dont give out much in the way of loot. My players are equiped as 6th level characters, are 10th level characters, and adventure as if they were 12th level characters, and they do ok.

[Clove]

Eh, I wouldn't take it.

You'll find enemy spellbooks on the corpses of evil spellcasters anyways, right? Cost=Free

And if you aren't spoon-fed an evil spellcaster, your party can always seek one out. You would do this to slay and evil-doer of course... with the added benefit of getting the wizard some new toys.

The only campaign that I see this being useful in would be an extremely low magic campaign where magic is truely rare.

And if it is that bad, you might consider just being a Sorceror instead.

[Pink]

You'll find enemy spellbooks on the corpses of evil spellcasters anyways, right? Cost=Free

Actually, first you have to decipher, then you have to copy (which costs time) and then there is the 100 gp per page cost.

[ClericofPhwarrr]

You'll find enemy spellbooks on the corpses of evil spellcasters anyways, right? Cost=Free

Sure, unless they're a cleric, or a druid, or a sorcerer, or a warmage, or...

[CasESenSITItiVE]

Sure, unless they're a cleric, or a druid, or a sorcerer, or a warmage, or...

ya, but the subject is saving money for the wizard for not having to copy spells

[Manave_E_Sulanul]

I ran a Loremaster with this feat. The skill bonus was nice and what is said about being out in the wilderness is very true. Those extra spells saved my life.

[Jack Mann]

I'm playing a gestalt wizard//archivist. Only needing to purchase spells for one side helps out immensely.

I wish I'd had it in other games, where there was a dearth of downtime and ability to purchase new spells.

[EndgamerAzari]

I too am beginning a gestalt wizard, though mine is a shadowcaster. The odd thing, though... I saw this feat, thought: "Cool, I'll show the DM this, he's got Complete Arcane".... guess what? It's not in there.