How to maximize survival of a mount?

[amatulic]

I'm building a character (not a Paladin) who has Ride as a class skill.

This isn't a combat character, but more of a party-support character. She's a small race, so her mobility on foot is slow. She needs a higher speed for her function in the party, and can't afford magical boots.

So, I'd like to give her a mount such as a riding dog, donkey, or war pony - all of which would give her a higher speed and let her keep up with the party.

A mount works fine for characters up to about 3rd level. AC doesn't really grow much past AC 20 or so, and AC begins losing effectiveness after about 5th level, where you start taking more hits. After that point it's more important to have high hit points than high AC, so you can absorb more damage, because you will get hit more often.

So my questions are:

• Does my mount, who shares the same experiences with me that gain me XP, also gain HP as I gain levels? Or is a war pony stuck at 13 HP his whole (short) life?
• If not, does it make sense for a race like a human or gnome to be able to absorb far more damage at higher levels than his horse??
• Is there any way to avoid the mount becoming essentially a single-use item that's unlikely to last through 1 encounter at 6th-7th level? It's hard to rely on something that won't last. And I'd rather avoid bringing a whole herd of spare mounts into the dungeon, although the other party members may find this useful for riding and carrying loot.
• Are there any rules covering leveling-up of mounts for non-Paladins?

Thanks. In the years I've been playing, nobody in my gaming group has ever brought a mount into the game. This would be something new, if I can make it work. But it seems that mounts are only effective at low levels of play.
-A

[Benejeseret]

One option is the Wild Cohort feat from the Wizards page (just google).

This one feat wonder gives you a cohort animal that gains levels almost like a druid companion (+11HD by lvl 18ish). This would give the extra HD, skills, abilities and feats you are looking for.

[Benejeseret]

I have said what I was thinking....and it posted about 4 times.

Ignore the rest. If I think of new things I will add them in.

Also, to compliment Wild Cohort in the Silverwood Outrider PrC that is a 5 level (only 1 dip is really worth it) advancement that bonds you more with the animal. Maybe 3 level into it to get +2Str with mount if you are planning on having it melee.

[martyboy74]

• No.
• Sort of. Think of hit points as the ability to roll with hits, dodge, and luck. It is an abstraction, after all.
• No.
• No.

The best thing to do by that point probably is to just buy a Bridle of Phantom Steed (or something to that effect), which for 16,200 gp can get you a steed that has a 100' movement speed, can be summoned 3 times per day (command word), and lasts for 5 hours per level. Admittedly, it's health sucks, but that why you can summon it 3 times per day. 27,000 will get you unlimited summonings per day.

[amatulic]

No. The best thing to do by that point probably is to just buy a Bridle of Phantom Steed (or something to that effect), which for 16,200 gp can get you a steed that has a 100' movement speed, can be summoned 3 times per day (command word), and lasts for 5 hours per level.

Well, if I had 16K gp to spend, I'd probably spend them on Boots of Speed - since the main purpose of having a mount is the extra speed it gives my Small-race character.

I'll look into the Wild Cohort feat that Benejesseret suggested (several times). Thanks.

-A

[tahu88810]

I think you can make a ride check to let the mount negate damage? I'm not sure though. Because that would probably be a lot more cost effective.

[Arbitrarity]

Bene: There's an option in the edit post function that allows deletion of posts. It's near the top.

[horseboy]

Name it, if you give it a name, it's a party member.

[amatulic]

Name it, if you give it a name, it's a party member.

Good idea! But my DM wouldn't agree. -A

[Fax Celestis]

I think you can make a ride check to let the mount negate damage? I'm not sure though. Because that would probably be a lot more cost effective.

That's wit h the use of the Mounted Combat feat.

[martyboy74]

What level is this starting at? For 2000 gold you could use Summon Monster I to get a Fiendish Monstrous Centipede for a mount.

[de-trick]

If you don't have a class yet take ranger than at 4th level have your mount your animal companion and take natural bond at 6th level

natural bond increases your effective druid level by 3

[Runolfr]

Take the Mounted Combat feat and maximize your Ride skill. That should allow you to negate one hit on your mount per round.

Beyond that, you'll have to discuss the option of "leveling" your mount with your DM. Mounts that improve alongside the character are generally associated with druids, rangers, and paladins, so anything you get for another class should be inferior to what they get, but you might get something.

You can also look for monstrous mounts with superior attributes as you go up in level, trading up as opportunity and money allow. You can also look into spells or items that improve your mount's survivability as you level up.

There's also the question of how much your DM will actually target your mount with monster attacks. If monsters typically ignore your mount and attack you directly, your main worry will be area-effect spells.

[amatulic]

What level is this starting at? For 2000 gold you could use Summon Monster I to get a Fiendish Monstrous Centipede for a mount.

Starting at level 4. But if I had a spare 2000 gp, the DM would allow me to buy Boots of Striding (like Boots of Springing and Striding but without the springing) which would increase my speed by 10'. The speed increase is really the only reason I wanted the mount (riding dogs and war ponies move at 40' speed). This isn't a melee character. I just want her to have better mobility while in combat, for a few hundred gold if possible.

If you don't have a class yet take ranger than at 4th level have your mount your animal companion and take natural bond at 6th level

That's a nice idea, but I've already set the classes for this character. Marshal / Dragon Shaman mix. Marshal has the Ride skill.

Take the Mounted Combat feat and maximize your Ride skill. That should allow you to negate one hit on your mount per round.

Beyond that, you'll have to discuss the option of "leveling" your mount with your DM. Mounts that improve alongside the character are generally associated with druids, rangers, and paladins, so anything you get for another class should be inferior to what they get, but you might get something.

The Wild Cohort feat at http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/20031118a would do the trick too.

There's also the question of how much your DM will actually target your mount with monster attacks. If monsters typically ignore your mount and attack you directly, your main worry will be area-effect spells.

Yes, that's a problem. I can just buy a riding dog that has 16 HP and not take any feats, but the monsters we're encountering could kill it in one hit. One of my fellow players suggested I could just keep buying mounts because they're cheap enough, but that can't happen as long as we don't see a town. I can certainly play the character without a mount, but she'll be a bit hobbled by slower speed. The mount was an idea to enhance the character at a low cost.
-A

[Inane-Fedaykin]

Talk with your DM about having monsters more or less ignore your mount if you're riding it. It doesn't really help against area spells or the like but every little bit ya know?

[kpenguin]

If you want your horse to improve along with you, try Awakening it. It can then gain class levels. If you don't have a friendly druid in your party, then you can pay 1700 gp for an NPC druid to do it.

[JackMage666]

The most common way I've seen to fix the mount problem for Fighters/Barbarians/Knights/Anything that doesn't get an animal/special mount, but wants one, is the Leadership feat. Use it to get an intelligent Magical Beast (there are a number of options, look for LA +X (co-hort) in the monster entry) as a co-hort. A few I can think of a Blink Dogs, Griffons, and Worgs, for example. The co-hort more than likely can't speak to you, but will grow with your level, just like a regular co-hort. Give it Barbarian levels (Scout works alright as well, though HP is lower), whenever it levels up, and you're set. A sturdy mount, that will grow with you.

Most DMs seem to allow this form of Leadership, because it's not nearly as cheesy as a Wizard 10 with a Wizard 8 co-hort, ect.

Oh, and Griffons make AWESOME mounts, especially for lance using Knights as such. You always stay just outta reach, flying overhead.

[Stephen_E]

If you do take the Wild Cohort feat, and it is the best of suggestions IMO, while you can't really "swap out" your wild cohort, you can replace it with another if it does get killed.
If this happens after 7th level I'd suggest you take a Dire Bat. The 40' flight with hover is the perfect mount for a small non-combat support PC.

Other tricks to keep your mount alive.
Mounted Combat is nice, but frankly, for someone intending to stay out of combat, not worth it.
Get armour or bracers for you mount. Yes, this costs cash, but look at it as if you're investing money in your own mobility. Also keep in mind that enemies may attack your big mount rather than you. The longer your mount stays up, the longer before they get to you. Most people consider having their mount die is better than dieing themselves.
Given what an wild cohort can do for you in both movement and defense, consider spending upto 20% of your personal wealth on your mount. Simple +2 stat bonus items are cheap useful items - Headband of intellect +2, costs 4000gp and gives it 6 more tricks and the ability to have limited understanding of a language. Con, Str and Dex are all worthwhile. As are NAC increases and speed boosts.
If you stick with the ground mount get Horseshoes (boots whatever) of Zephyr for your mount. Been able to walk on any semisolid substance (including water) leaving no tracks and avoiding most movement penalties (and been immune to grease) is well worth it.
If you're going down dungeons buy a wand of Spiderclimb for your Wizard to use on your mount.

Don't forget to buy that masterwork military saddle.

Stephen

[silvadel]

You could always pick up a barbarian level... Rage is always kind of cute in a run away moment.

[Citizen Joe]

I've been working on a set of horseshoes that summon a mount as Mount spell at Caster Level 1. It would probably cost 720 gp each, and a set of 4 for 2880 gp. If you're willing to give up a ring slot, you could get a ring with 4 uses per day for half that price. You could then summon a pony for 2 hours, four times per day for a total of 8 hours, a standard day's travel. In addition, you can hustle your fresh pony for one hour, which doubles the distance covered. Since you get a fresh pony each use, you can hustle 4 times giving you a net 50% increase in overland travel. This doesn't help if the rest of the party can't keep up though. You also need to change mounts every two hours.

On the plus side, if your pony is killed, you can summon another.

Other options are:
A use activated ring unlimited uses per day for 2000 gp (presumably only one mount at a time). Uses a ring slot.
A use activated saddle, unlimited uses per day for 4000 gp (again one mount at a time). If one dies, you summon another. You could probably dismiss/summon a fresh one relatively easily. No body slot used.

[amatulic]

I appreciate all the suggestions. I wanted a mount only for the speed benefit, and have already built the character with the feats she needs. So here's what I decided to do:

• Change my race from Chaos Gnome having exactly the stats I want but a base speed of 20', to a Mephling with lower Int and Dex but a base speed of 30'. Both have +1 level adjustment. (Why these? I need the Charisma bonus, and all races with Charisma bonuses have a level adjustment.)
• Exchange my magical Handy Haversack for a plain backpack, giving me back 2000 gp. This also means I must now bear the weight of all my items, burdening me to the point where I can hardly move (my light load limit is 19 lb).
• Buy a donkey and pack saddle, call him "Nobby" and give him a hat, and load him up with other equipment I don't constantly need (shovel, pot, bedroll, rope, etc.). Also load him up with water and food for him. Total cost is a negligible 14 gp.
• Use the 2000 gp I saved by selling my magical storage, and buy Boots of Striding (my DM allows this custom item, created using only the Longstrider spell, and not the Jumping capability). This increases my base speed to 40' - the same as if I had a riding dog or war pony. Voila! Speed problem solved.

This is Nobby:

Then I convince the DM to consider Nobby as part of my equipment, no different than a cart. Nobby will pretty much stay where I leave him, like a cart, and follow me when I pull him along. He won't take turns in a round or participate in combat, but stand passively, just like any other equipment.

-A

[martyboy74]

Combine the boots with either nodwic...er...'nobby' the donkey or the party meatshield.

[Drider]

you can be a monk or scout, with speed increases. (scouts are better)

[amatulic]

Combine the boots with either nodwic...er...'nobby' the donkey or the party meatshield.

Hey, I like that name! Nodwic... has a ring to it. Problem is, putting magic shoes on what is essentially 'adventuring gear' converts him to more of a PC, making him more vulnerable. As long as participates in the game just like, say, a pushcart, I probably have less risk of losing him. Riding him, I have more risk of losing him.

I need the speed for myself, and some way to carry my load so I am no more than lightly burdened. Originally I thought the best way was to store my heavy things in a Heward's Handy Haversack and ride a mount for speed. After thinking about everyone's suggestions, now I think it's best to trade the haversack for magic boots and bring along a beast of burden to carry my heavy items. I could bring along a cart and push it myself, but I thought a donkey might be more fun.

you can be a monk or scout, with speed increases. (scouts are better)

Well, my character is a Dragonborn Water Mephling Marshal/Dragon Shaman, who uses Entangling Breath and 3 active auras (2 from Marshal and 1 from Dragon Shaman) to support the party in combat. She also has high Charisma-based skills to act as the party "face" in negotiations and such. I already have a penalty from the +1 level adjustment. Multiclassing with a monk or scout would introduce even more penalties to XP, because none of my classes are the favored class of my race.
-A

[Talya]

(Why these? I need the Charisma bonus, and all races with Charisma bonuses have a level adjustment.)

Star Elf. Subspecies of elf in "Unapproachable East" forgotten realms sourcebook. They do NOT get elven weapon proficiencies, but they get +2 cha, -2 con, and any weapons they weild or armor they wear is considered "Ghost Touched" for the purpose of attacking or defending against incorporeal creatures. They are also native outsiders. No level adjustment.

[Shisumo]

There's also the Savage Progressions "base" aasimar, which is a LA +0, +2 Cha race.

[Fax Celestis]

Star Elf. Subspecies of elf in "Unapproachable East" forgotten realms sourcebook. They do NOT get elven weapon proficiencies, but they get +2 cha, -2 con, and any weapons they weild or armor they wear is considered "Ghost Touched" for the purpose of attacking or defending against incorporeal creatures. They are also native outsiders. No level adjustment.

Funny that they don't get elven proficiencies, since as an outsider they're automatically proficient with all simple and martial weapons.

[BDEYE]

One simple solution would be to take at least one level of an arcane spellcasting class and learn Mount. If you want to increase the duration you can pick up the Practiced Spellcaster feat, but even at first level you get it for two hours.

[dyslexicfaser]

This is somewhat off-topic, but if you were going for a mounted combat build, what class would be best? I've heard 'knight' before, and 'paladin' is a natural because of the excellent mount. Are there other good options?

[Fax Celestis]

This is somewhat off-topic, but if you were going for a mounted combat build, what class would be best? I've heard 'knight' before, and 'paladin' is a natural because of the excellent mount. Are there other good options?

Fighters do well because of their plethora of feats. Just make sure you have a really nice mount (like a rhinoceros or dire rhinoceros). Remarkably, druids do well too, for their animal companions.

I'm also partial to the Skylord and Algarondan Griffinrider PrCs.