32 attacks in one round...would this actually work?

[kemmotar]

In the last game a friend of mine(TWF+haste fighter) was very proud for having 7 attacks(lvl 10 or something) so i decided to make one that would make his 7 attacks look measly...so i came up with something interesting.

In Book of vile darkness there is a Prc(thrall to demogorgon) that has a very interesting ability, dual actions, which allows you to do two full rounds worth of actions in one round without any activation actions...plus you get this ability twice a day.

In magic items compendium there is the belt of battle, swift action activation, expend three charges to get an extra full round.

TWF and haste are no-brainers. Multiheaded template(two heads) and weapon grafts(fiend folio) are great. Multiheaded has the racial superior two weapon fighting thus removing the -2 for attacks and weapon graft gives you an extra +1 to AR.

One bad thing i tried to overcome was the chance of rolling natural 1 thus luck feats were also no-brainers. lucky start(1 luck reroll) unbelievable luck(2 luck reroll) better lucky than good(1 luck reroll) were the feats chosen since you can treat natural ones as natural 20s and reroll bad rolls.

To maximize all this since it is all done in one round you can add some feats for charge damage probably leap attack, power attack, power lunge and shocktrooper and ofc an item with psionic lion's charge.

Thus (assuming level 20 and full BAB progression):
main-hand: 4 attacks +1 (haste)
off-hand: 3 attacks (TWF feats)

round 1:activate psionic lion's charge(swift)+full attack+activate dual actions
round 1b:full attack+activate belt of battle(swift)
round 2: full attack+activate dual actions+activate chronocharm of the horizon walker(swift, if neccessary, to move to next enemy)
round 2b: full attack

I'm not sure whether belt of battle initiates a new round or if its the same round but you could just use another psionic lion's charge to charge the next opponent. Thus 8 attacks each round, 4 rounds, gives us 32 attacks.

Also one unconnected question, does the balanced ability in a weapon mean you can use a larger size weapon without penalty?

[Azerian Kelimon]

Easier way to get a lot of attacks, modify from here: get into Swordsage, or warblade, get raging mongoose and time stands still, and you get either 16 or 12 attacks right there. Combine with other things, and you might get 40 attacks or more. Combine with Girallon windmill Flesh rip, and you'll tack an extra 20d6 damage. Frightening and basic.

PS: last time I checked the updated description, Haste doesn't allows you to make extra attacks.

[kemmotar]

well It would be stretching it but you could fill out 10 levels of swordsage and ten levels of Thrall to demogorgon, max out the skill to use martial scripts. Then use boots of temporal acceleration use the script and ready time stands still and get an extra full round of attacks...thus 40 attacks...not bad
thx!!

But why would haste not give extra attacks?The spell in Phb clearly says so...havent looked at any updates...my group uses haste like that anyway so no prob there.

[Solo]

PS: last time I checked the updated description, Haste doesn't allows you to make extra attacks.

You get one extra attack on a full round attack

[Azerian Kelimon]

Gah, must've messed up. But last time I checked things were different. Oh, and If I haven't misunderstood, you add full PrC class levels to martial levels, even if you don't get maneuvers. So, you could take 7 swordsage levels, thrall, and have enough swordsage levels to take the 3 necessary maneuvers for the trick.

[Gralamin]

Gah, must've messed up. But last time I checked things were different. Oh, and If I haven't misunderstood, you add full PrC class levels to martial levels, even if you don't get maneuvers. So, you could take 7 swordsage levels, thrall, and have enough swordsage levels to take the 3 necessary maneuvers for the trick.

This Is Correct.

[wowy319]

Add a weapon with the speed enhancement to each hand, and you can make that 40 attacks a round. I'm surprised you didsn't include that. Also, add Girallion's blessing into the mix, and you can be golden.

[brian c]

Add a weapon with the speed enhancement to each hand, and you can make that 40 attacks a round. I'm surprised you didsn't include that. Also, add Girallion's blessing into the mix, and you can be golden.

Because Speed enhancement doesn't stack with Haste, iirc

[Skjaldbakka]

Add a weapon with the speed enhancement to each hand

Speed doesn't stack that way. It also doesn't stack with haste.

Edit- ninja'd, how appropriate

[Mavian]

What you need to add are some natural attacks, a bite and maybe some tentacles, tack them onto your weapon attacks

[Leicontis]

Now can we adjust this to allow 3 or 5 levels of Master Thrower? Having each attack throwing two shuriken that deal 1d2+10d6+10+1 Con damage each (critting 19-20) as touch attacks...

[Azerian Kelimon]

If thrall doesn't require full 10 levels to get the boost, sure. If not, forget it, you won't get enough maneuvers to qualify for requirements. Fact is, you'll even need to take Martial study once to get the 4 maneuvers needed for level 9 maneuvers.

Edit: no, wait, you need 3 for Girallon and raging, and 4 for Time. So no need for takin' Martial study. Also, add two wep rend for extra die, and great cleave to get MORE attacks and make sure you don't lose 'em all. Get some kind of way to create AoO's, and tack combat reflexes for extra attacks and you'll get frightenin'.


And if you can get some way to pile up AB bonuses (such as a dip in sorc for true strike), take Avalanche of Blades, diamond mind level 7, and you MIGHT be able to outgrow the previously suggested combo.

[SurlySeraph]

Add a level in Monk for Flurry of Blows to get another attack per round. You probably can't afford the 11 levels for Greater Flurry, though. Get Snap Kick (gives you another unarmed attack on a full attack) and Roundabout Kick (gives you another unarmed attack when you crit with an unarmed attack).

[Nowhere Girl]

I don't know how those other classes go, exactly, but if you can squeeze in 10 levels of Dervish somehow, that gets you A Thousand Cuts, which is a 1/day doubling of all your attacks for the round (minus haste, which won't double).

[Azerian Kelimon]

'fore nonepic, it's impossible. At epic, though......scaaaaary.

[Green Bean]

Well, according to the always helpful Character Optimization Board on WotC, the record for number of attacks per round with a single character is 1496.

[Azerian Kelimon]

That kills more catgirls than what is in Solo's sig.

[Arbitrarity]

Owww, Shadow pounce abuse. The easy way to use that as a swordsage is using all the shadow X manuvers in one round (Stride, blink, etc)

[Douglas]

Oh, and If I haven't misunderstood, you add full PrC class levels to martial levels, even if you don't get maneuvers. So, you could take 7 swordsage levels, thrall, and have enough swordsage levels to take the 3 necessary maneuvers for the trick.

No, that's only for PrCs that specifically say so, and all of the ones that do are in Tome of Battle.

[BardicDuelist]

The use of Factotum would help here. You can get an extra standard action at level 8. With some Font of Inspiration and the ToB maneuver that let's you attack as many times as you keep hitting, you could probably get pretty high up there. especially if you say that two standard actions = one full round action.

[Arakune]

That kills more catgirls than what is in Solo's sig.

just a little off topic, nothing can kill more catgirls than anti-mater damage.

[kemmotar]

Well, according to the always helpful Character Optimization Board on WotC, the record for number of attacks per round with a single character is 1496.

i want something i can actually use in a game(for fun yes), will not need to explain to the DM for more than half an hour and will not receive the "DM frown"...

Maybe taking four levels of thrall is enough just to take dual actions bu even so i cant see how one could take 18 levels of swordsage so that you can take the time stands still maneuver...even so it requires a round of preparation so unless its a boost that can be used in the two rounds of dual actions and the original round it can't pretty much fit in...

except with boots of temporal acceleration...though that would be useful only for time stands still...a build to include the PrC and 18 swordsage levels is non-existent for non epic...though for epic would a good idea be level 18 sworsage/4 thrall to demogorgon/10 dervish?

with time stands still, a thousand cuts and raging mongoos we get 6 rounds of attacks and 10 attacks a round=60 attacks

but i think that for maneuvers it would be easier to just get a martial script for time stands still and have 16 levels warblade for raging mongoose...
time stands still script martial lore check=38
23 ranks + 15(competence item)=38.

so:
round 1:activate boots of temporal acceleration(swift)
round 2BoTA:activate martial script time stands still(standard)
round 3BoTA:ready time stands still
round 1(continued):full attack+time stands still+raging mongoose(swift)
round 4:full attack+dual actions+raging mongoose(swift)
round 4b:full attack+belt of battle(swift)
round 5:full attack+dual actions+raging mongoose(swift)
round 5b:full attack+raging mongoose(swift)

5 full attacks
4 of them with 10 attacks and 1 with 8
thus 48 attacks

for epic purposes:
round 1:activate boots of temporal acceleration(swift)
round 2BoTA:activate martial script time stands still(standard)
round 3BoTA:ready time stands still
round 1(continued):full attack+time stands still+raging mongoose(swift)
round 4:full attack+dual actions+raging mongoose(swift)
round 4b:full attack+belt of battle(swift)
round 5:full attack+dual actions+raging mongoose(swift)
round 5b:full attack+raging mongoose(swift)+thousand cuts

this number of attacks increases to 58..not much of a development if you ask me though for 10 extra levels in the number of attacks..

[AtomicKitKat]

Well, according to the always helpful Character Optimization Board on WotC, the record for number of attacks per round with a single character is 1496.

Actually, it's something like 100k. Some BS abuse of "borrowing" turn attempts, and using it to power Divine Impetus.

I also don't agree with the Marilith one. The most number of attacks one can get without using shapeshift/mindswitch cheese(or the above-mentioned one involving combining turn attempts and Divine Impetus, which I guess qualifies as DMM/Divine cheese), is presumably somewhere in the vicinity of 40-60. Involving lots of tentacles. Of forced intrusion. Preferrably spiked ones.

[Jack Mann]

No, that's only for PrCs that specifically say so, and all of the ones that do are in Tome of Battle.

They most likely meant it to work that way. But the text in the book only says "Prestige classes work a little differently. In most cases, you add the full prestige class level to your martial adept level to determine your initiator level. See the prestige class descriptions in Chapter 5 for detail." Chapter 5 does not address non-ToB prestige classes.

Now, they may have clarified this somewhere (Sage Advice?), but the text in the book would imply that a prestige class would give full initiator level progression by default.

[Fizban]

Well if you're looking for extra attack cheese, you'll be wanting Wraithstrike (Sor/Wiz 2, Complete Arcane and Spell Compendium) to turn all those attacks into touch attacks so they actually hit. It'd cost at least 3 levels unless you can get some sort of magic item of it, but it's so worth it. (Normally considered massive cheese, but that's what this thread's looking for isn't it?)

One thing I'm wondering about: do you actually get to keep the bonus from True Strike for every attack with Avalanche of Blades? True Strike says next attack roll, but then I think avalanche says you keep all the modifiers from your first attack.

Fax Celestis had a thread for tons o' attacks that involved abberation wild shape and a monster that has 3 bites 6 claws and a slam.

[AlterForm]

Actually, it's something like 100k. Some BS abuse of "borrowing" turn attempts, and using it to power Divine Impetus.

I also don't agree with the Marilith one. The most number of attacks one can get without using shapeshift/mindswitch cheese(or the above-mentioned one involving combining turn attempts and Divine Impetus, which I guess qualifies as DMM/Divine cheese), is presumably somewhere in the vicinity of 40-60. Involving lots of tentacles. Of forced intrusion. Preferrably spiked ones.

The cheesiest part of Chuck isn't borrowing Turn Undead attempts (you can even check Hierophant in the SRD if you like), but rather Divine Impetus coupled with high numbers of TU attempts.

If you really have a problem with Gift of the Divine, just cut his # attacks in half (to about 70K-75K). Just remember, he could've gone for nightsticks!

[kemmotar]

For one thing I really dont think any of the 100k attack builds would ever be played by any sane player...even so...any DM in his right mind would never allow such a thing to happen in a game.

What i'm looking for isn't multiple attack cheese, but a way to increase your attacks in a build that one would actually play in a game.

Besides, so many thousands of attacks a confirmed natural one could defeat the purpose of having so many attacks. Thus a build that can do thousands of attacks in one round by expending everything he's got would be kinda useless in a real game short of a duel.

Btw, what's nightsticks?

[Green Bean]

Btw, what's nightsticks?

A magic item that gives you extra Turn Undead attempts per day. Popular with builds that use Divine Metacheese.

[AlterForm]

For one thing I really dont think any of the 100k attack builds would ever be played by any sane player...even so...any DM in his right mind would never allow such a thing to happen in a game.

What i'm looking for isn't multiple attack cheese, but a way to increase your attacks in a build that one would actually play in a game.

Besides, so many thousands of attacks a confirmed natural one could defeat the purpose of having so many attacks. Thus a build that can do thousands of attacks in one round by expending everything he's got would be kinda useless in a real game short of a duel.

Btw, what's nightsticks?

Oh, yeah, definitely. I mean, we have two sets of Commandments... "The Ten Commandments of Optimization" and "The Ten Commandments of Practical Optimization." And those other Ten...just so I don't accidentally piss someone off.

Of course, the definition of "setting a record" on the 'Op Boards is roughly "Pun-Pun. If Pun-Pun is disallowed, then let's see how ****ed up we can make it using no less than 5 different sources and 3 flavors of cheese."

[Chronos]

You can, in principle, get an even larger number of attacks, and it's possible at Fighter 4. Tiny or smaller creatures can occupy the same space on the battlefield, and the rules don't put any limit on the number that can fit in any given 5-foot-square. So drop your fighter in the middle of a few million tribbles, Great Cleave them all, and hope that the random number gods are crazy enough to prevent you from rolling any ones.