D&D a Cult

[BardicDuelist]

Now I thought this argument died back in the '80s, but aparently my friend's parents still think that D&D is some form of Cult. How do you deal with people like this (realy, no stupid "kill them" or w/e comments)?

The guy is interested in D&D, a good actor (we met through out theater group), and gets along with my other players, so I'd like to play with him. The thing is is trying to convince his parents that D&D isn't like a cult. To further complicate this, his Uncle (dad's brother) played D&D, so they feel that they know all about it.

[psychoticbarber]

Honestly there's not usually a lot you can do, except put on your best non-crazy face, and talk to them about. Tell them calmly and rationally what you like about it (preferably not the parts about killing monsters, more stuff like the triumph of good over evil and such), then offer to answer questions they have, and answer them as honestly and calmly as you can.

Appeal to their reason, if you can. If they're still not impressed, there's probably nothing you can do about it.

[kamikasei]

To further complicate this, his Uncle (dad's brother) played D&D, so they feel that they know all about it.

I think this bears elaboration. What do they think they know, based on this?

[doliemaster]

I would suggest pointing out the issues by having them read the books, its pretty hard to consider it a cult after reading all 3 of the huge rulebooks, since after reading those it seems alot like a game.

Point out the popularity of the game, and the fact that people from multiple walks of life, including of most major religions, play DnD, that is usually a good way.


Show them one of the Dead Ale Wives videos, I'm serious I won't tell you how hard it is to seriously think its a cult after seeing one of those.

Thats all I can think of.

[TheElfLord]

I second the above poster. If your group is mature enough for it to work, I would invite the parents to observe a session. (This is what I did with my parents, though they never took me up on it they liked the guesture).

[CthulhuM]

It kinda depends why they feel that way. If they're the sort of people who can read a Chick Tract and say "hey, yeah, that makes sense," then there probably isn't much you can do. If they just picked up the misconception somewhere along the way and never had anyone correct it (or didn't think much of the uncle you mentioned?), then just try to explain, from the ground up, what an RPG actually is.

Hell, show them a rulebook and point out all the mechanical bits. Once they've stared at enough tables and formulas they'll probably come around to the more common feeling on DnD players - "Good god these people are geeks."

[psychoticbarber]

Now I thought this argument died back in the '80s

Actually I was friends with what those in the biz call a PK (Priest's Kid. I'm one too), and her Dad wouldn't let her play with my group. Not because he felt the game was evil, but because he couldn't be seen to be even indirectly supporting it by his congregation.

There are a bunch of people who still have worries about D&D for various reasons.

[Dr. Weasel]

Ah, I remember first hearing about D&D when one of my friends' mother gave me a 'Dungeons and Dragons is the Devil' lecture.

Her words ingrained themselves in my mind; still as true as they were ten years ago: "D&D is bad for your soul. It's... it's like playing with a Magic 8-Ball; it's just something you DON'T DO."

[psychoticbarber]

Both my parents (Including my Priestly mother) are former gamers, I never had that problem. For them it wasn't a "Will Dylan play D&D?" but more "When will Dylan play D&D?" haha .

[Green Bean]

I recommend an intelligent and reasonable rebuttal. And when they leave, yell "Hail Satan!"


That guy never bothered me again...

[Telvos]

My wife and I are both Christians, and we love D&D.

It's just a game. You can't call it witchcraft anymore than you can call an actor a murderer because he killed someone in a play.

[martyboy74]

Her words ingrained themselves in my mind; still as true as they were ten years ago: "D&D is bad for your soul. It's... it's like playing with a Magic 8-Ball; it's just something you DON'T DO."

Tell me you're making up that bit about the magic 8-ball. Please...

[TheElfLord]

My wife and I are both Christians, and we love D&D.

It's just a game. You can't call it witchcraft anymore than you can call an actor a murderer because he killed someone in a play.

Quoted for Truth!

[Zeal]

Ugh, I've had to convince people that D&D isn't a cult, and that it won't inspire you to kill your family. The biggest issue I've run into is with people who've read a certain book, I'm not sure what it's called, but it talks about someone who killed their family 'because of D&D'.

My best advice is talk to them. Tell them exactly what D&D is. Break it down if needed. The role-playing, heck that's just acting, and they're fine with acting apparently. The other side of the game is a bit of math and a game of chance, pretty much non-threatening.

I agree with the idea to show them a Dead Ale Wives sketch, but other than that, there isn't much you can do aside from speaking to them about it rationally.

[Azerian Kelimon]

As long as you don't explain nanobots, H. I. V. E., or Pun-Pun to them in detail, they won't think it's evil or anything. But tell 'em of those, and you're screwed.

[technomancer]

I second just showing them the rulebooks. Some people might have issues with the whole 'spellcasting' thing, so specifically point out the section on casting spells, and the spells themselves.

[Arbitrarity]

As long as you don't explain nanobots, H. I. V. E., or Pun-Pun to them in detail, they won't think it's evil or anything. But tell 'em of those, and you're screwed.

And BOVD, and some of the stuff by Dicefreaks...

This book... explains the Nine Hells.

This book... contains the stats for an Old One.

This book... contains specific rules for torture, and has a spell involving the heart of a dwarven child as a material component.

[Azerian Kelimon]

SHOW EXALTED DEEDS! I mean, if anything I've heard 'bout it is true, it's the kind of thing to make sure D&D is loved forevah by someone who doesn't know about it.

[TheLogman]

Although I've never had to deal with this situation, (Thankfully) I read a book on the subject, and I have a few ideas.

1. The compromise: Run a monotheistic campaign, and invite them to watch. Although you could have problems getting them to come, they might lighten up when they see that YHWH, or Jehova, or Pelor, (or God, or whoever), the only god in your campaign empowers priests (Clerics) to heal, spread the word, and protect.

2. The numbers: Already suggested, but worth another mention. Show them the numbers, the dice, the tables and such, and show it's really just a nerd game of probability, number crunching, and other stuff, and show that all in all, there's more numbers and crunch then fantasy and cult (At least for some people. Even if you don't believe that, it would be easy to pretend it for a while.)

3. The intelligent adult discussion: Ask them to sit down, offer them a drink, (Skip this if you are their house, or a public place, but you get the point) and ask them politely why they believe the game is a Cult. Explain that it is just a game, and although some Morons take it to the extreme, you are not of those people, you are reasonable, you attend a number of excellent Extracurricular activities, (List some) and ask what if anything they find wrong with the game, and how you can make it suitable for their son to play (This may force you to change your campaign a la number 1, but some of this is just fluff).

4. The last resort: If you are desperate, these people are immune to both common sense and delicious drinks, and you can do nothing else, you may be forced to game in secret with your new friend, or to play another game. This of course is not desirable, but in some cases is better than nothing.

Hope I help.

[BardicDuelist]

How about this counter argument:
D&D improves acting. The way we play, it does because we roleplay and not roll play. THe number of parts in school plays I have gotten has increased since I started playing. He is an actor, so this might strike a chord.

D&D is owned by Hasbro. One of the leading toy manufactures in America would not buy any product that could be legitimally called a Cult. It would be bad for the bottom line.

My DM's father leads his church's youth group. He is a devout Chrisitian and has been playing D&D for 30 years.

I don't really know what else to say...

[TheLogman]

Be wary of the counter-argument, if it is too good, or annoys the adults, you may get the "What do you know you're just a Nerd/Kid/D&D Cultist" I hate that counter-counter argument. I really wanna know what their argument is though. If it's just that some people have done kind of terrible things that are kind of related to D&D once or twice, show that people are just stupid and that this kind of thing happens all the time, and anything can be "loosely related" to anything at all. People take things too far all the time, and even though D&D has spells and deities, you aren't actually Demon/Devil/Satan/Icon/Idol worshiping, and that all the spells and stuff can be interchanged easily into things they don't find offensive (if anything)

Oh, and by the way, I hope I'm not being rude. I often talk too much, and have a nasty habit of being rude by complete accident. The more I talk, the more of a chance there is of offending someone, so uh, please don't take it personally.

[BardicDuelist]

Be wary of the counter-argument, if it is too good, or annoys the adults, you may get the "What do you know you're just a Nerd/Kid/D&D Cultist" I hate that counter-counter argument.

Their argument I don't know completely, since I only recently found out that he is not allowed to play.

As far as the "What do you know..." thing, I am a respected member of our school's drama department which is headed by a man they respect. Also, I will have him show them the Hasbro site and all that stuff. Worst case is that I'm not allowed to hang out with him (which I may not be allready).

[Tor the Fallen]

f it's just that some people have done kind of terrible things that are kind of related to D&D once or twice, show that people are just stupid and that this kind of thing happens all the time, and anything can be "loosely related" to anything at all.

Yeah, if it comes down to it, pull out a history book and explain to them how the Crusades worked.

[Drider]

It's just a game. You can't call it witchcraft anymore than you can call an actor a murderer because he killed someone in a play.

"Did you ever see a show called "Gilligan's island?"
*Bows head*
"Those poor, poor, people. "
Cookie for who gets the referance


...If their christians, there is a d20 Christian game somewhere on the internet, that you can show them

[Tor the Fallen]

"Did you ever see a show called "Gilligan's island?"
*Bows head*
"Those poor, poor, people. "
Cookie for who gets the referance

What if I don't want a cookie?

[Drider]

What if I don't want a cookie?

Then rocks fall...and explode

[ocato]

D&D
Promotes Teamwork, reading skills, math skills, social skills, abstract thinking, and problem solving

Video Games
LOL t3h Haloz!!111!1!!!11 Kaboom! *blood and guts fly everywhere*

Let's let Jesus decide.

[BardicDuelist]

D&D
Promotes Teamwork, reading skills, math skills, social skills, abstract thinking, and problem solving

Video Games
LOL t3h Haloz!!111!1!!!11 Kaboom! *blood and guts fly everywhere*

Let's let Jesus decide.

Ocato, nearly every time I read one of your posts, you become my favorite person for about 15 seconds. Bravo.

[Chronos]

The way I explain it, D&D is fundamentally no different than those games of Cops and Robbers, or Cowboys and Indians, or whatever that you played as a kid. The rulebooks and dice are just to resolve the inevitable disputes of "I shot you!" "I shot you first!" "No you didn't, and besides, you missed!".

[Terraneaux]

And you could mention it improves math and critical thinking skills as these wrap nicely into making a more powerful character... that is, if you spend some time rollplaying and not just roleplaying.