My Hero Academia 3: Villainous Interlude

[Rater202]

Nighteye's power isn't a prophecy though.

We have no reason to believe that he's actually seeing "fate." And personally... This might be my existentialist leanings talking, but the very idea of Fate offends me something fierce. At best it says that your wants, needs, and choices don't matter. At worst, it's saying that free will doesn't exist.

For all we know, he's just seeing 1: The most likely future out of several and 2: The most likely manner by which that future might occur.

In this case, Deku succeeding by just trying that much harder than Nighteye himself ever did makes perfect sense.

Edit: On the movie with Shion, Shion was lying about foreseeing Naruto's death becuase she was trying to scare him off: People who help her tended to get murdered.

Ergo, it doesn't have any bearing on this conversation.

The only prophecy of Nighteye's that I expect is utterly, totally never gonna be subverted is that All-Might has maybe a year to live(subtracting the time since it was made) and that's becuase it's fracking obvious that he's gonna keel over any day now.

I mean, look at him: Without using the dredges of OFA to bolster himself, he is almost literally just skin and bones. He is missing like half of his internal organs. He walks slowly and carefully, as though he's not sure if he can go faster than that and isn't even sure if it's safe for him to walk as fat as he does.

And he regularly vomits large quantities of blood. We can't forget that.

You don't need to see the future to know that he's not long for this world. Nighteye's prediction "you have a year or two to live" is actually a pretty generous prognosis.

[Cozzer]

My personal theory is that the "Toshinori's going to die soon" part of the prophecy is not going to be subverted, but the "he's going to die a horrible death at the hands of a villain" will. So he'll die (probably as a climax of whatever's going to happen four months from now in-universe), but he'll die a dignified, meaningful death that won't satisfy Shigaraki.

[Traab]

My personal theory is that the "Toshinori's going to die soon" part of the prophecy is not going to be subverted, but the "he's going to die a horrible death at the hands of a villain" will. So he'll die (probably as a climax of whatever's going to happen four months from now in-universe), but he'll die a dignified, meaningful death that won't satisfy Shigaraki.

I think it will be more of a dual victory. He will die, but he wont die broken. Shigaraki will be more or less satisfied at the time, but it wont have the effect he was aiming for on the good guys. It is a standard bad guy trope from all settings that they dont fully understand how good guys think so he will feel like it happened in a good enough way for his purposes, but it wont break the good guys in any way. Think mel gibson in braveheart how he died. It was a terrible bloody pain filled public death, but he died crying out for freedom for his people so it inspired them despite being a public torture and execution of their heroic figurehead.

[John Cribati]

Thats just unfortunately not how his powers work.
He would not have been able to do the things he do, like calculate a route based on someone's movement.
Unless it was actual prediction.

What exactly about "The guy walks up to this plant, pushes these buttons in this order, goes down the steps, takes the first left, then the third right, etc." Doesnt line up with "sees the actions and decisions that a person will take in the future?"

[Lord Raziere]

What exactly about "The guy walks up to this plant, pushes these buttons in this order, goes down the steps, takes the first left, then the third right, etc." Doesnt line up with "sees the actions and decisions that a person will take in the future?"

Spoiler: On nighteye's Quirk

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True.

where the "future psychic" theory doesn't make sense in his actual fight with Overhaul, where he is constantly using it to see a few seconds into the future without touching Overhaul or anyone else. so....doesn't really fit with that, as it means that he can use his Quirk in more ways than just touching a guy and seeing for one hour- which makes sense, Quirks tend to be flexible to a degree and Nighteye's seems to have a few different modes: few seconds mode, one hour touch mode, and years mode.

[lord_khaine]

What exactly about "The guy walks up to this plant, pushes these buttons in this order, goes down the steps, takes the first left, then the third right, etc." Doesnt line up with "sees the actions and decisions that a person will take in the future?"

Nothing. Because the argument is that he -does- see into parts of the future.
And -does not- just make a educated calculation.

[Cozzer]

Regarding Nighteye's fight with Overhaul, I think he did touch him once to activate the power (notice how Nigheye avoids the first attacks just thanks to his experience, without predicting them). Then, for a while, he kept predicting Overhaul's moves, choosing to stop the prediction before seeing whether he could avoid the attacks or not, therefore keeping his options open.

Then he got spiked, and in a last, desperate effort to at least go out with a smile he pushed his prediction further, hoping it would show him the others succeeding. That's how I interpret things, at least.

[LaZodiac]

Regarding Nighteye's fight with Overhaul, I think he did touch him once to activate the power (notice how Nigheye avoids the first attacks just thanks to his experience, without predicting them). Then, for a while, he kept predicting Overhaul's moves, choosing to stop the prediction before seeing whether he could avoid the attacks or not, therefore keeping his options open.

Then he got spiked, and in a last, desperate effort to at least go out with a smile he pushed his prediction further, hoping it would show him the others succeeding. That's how I interpret things, at least.

This is entirely correct, and also Nighteye's dialogue makes it explicitly clear that's what he's doing, more or less.

[Rater202]

What exactly about "The guy walks up to this plant, pushes these buttons in this order, goes down the steps, takes the first left, then the third right, etc." Doesnt line up with "sees the actions and decisions that a person will take in the future?"

That's not what is being argued against.

I stated my theory that Sir Nghteye's power, rather than literally showing the future, gather all available, relelvant information from the past and present in order to create a 99.99999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999 99999999999999999% accurate guess of what someone will be doing in the future.

Mostly becuase this makes more sense than him actually looking into the future does.

Lord Kaine seems to think that this somehow means that Nighteye's predictions wouldn't be able to be used to figure out what someone is doing in the present, which I honestly don't understand.

If I'm correct, then he reason Sir Nighteye's experiments with his power never deviated from what he saw is becuase the fact that he intended to act differently in the short term was taken into account by his power ahead of time when it showed him those futures, and the reason why he was wrong about Deku is becuase 1: His power is less reliable than he thinks it is and 2: Deku just got really lucky.

I think that "Nighteye's power is less reliable than he thought becuase he never ran into certain factors" makes more sense than "Nighteye's power didn't or couldn't take Eri's rewinding power into account."

[lord_khaine]

Mostly becuase this makes more sense than him actually looking into the future does.

Lord Kaine seems to think that this somehow means that Nighteye's predictions wouldn't be able to be used to figure out what someone is doing in the present, which I honestly don't understand.

Yeah thats about it. I wont argue that in a more logical world it would make more sense than him seeing into the future.
But a large part of the powers in My Hero Academia, are for lack of a better term, very dumb.

And my argument was that its only him actually seeing into the future that explains some of the things he does.

[Rater202]

If he was actually seeing the future, then the mere fact that he's seen it would mean it wouldn't happen. Alternatively, he'd be seeing potentially dozens of futures with each use.

If he was seeing fate, then Deku would have died.

Thus, he is seeing neither the future nor fate.

The fact that 1: His predictions are almost 100% accurate and 2: They can be wrong makes it clear that the most likely course of action is that his power is gathering ifomation and showing the most likely future and the most likely way that future can come to pass.

[LaZodiac]

New chapter!

Spoiler

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... well. We got some interesting information and fun little details about the past. As you'd kind of expect, most holders of One For All died young, and had quirks that were not actually all that exceptional. Nana's only ability is that she could float! It makes sense, and establishes pretty clearly that these really are only meant to be support. It also answers, once again, why someone like Todoroki and Bakugo couldn't get this power. Combining it with their own would be too big a target for All For One.

We then get a wonderfully cute scene of Class 1A and 1B hotpotting together, getting ready for the next semester, all having a rather swell time. We get this wonderful joke where Midoriya is so caught up in his personal feelings that he kinda loses track of things when Todoroki asks him for some ponzu. It's cute.

and then we end the chapter with the ominous call that... by the end of this arc, heroes will be gone from this city.

[lord_khaine]

If he was actually seeing the future, then the mere fact that he's seen it would mean it wouldn't happen. Alternatively, he'd be seeing potentially dozens of futures with each use.

If he was seeing fate, then Deku would have died.

Thus, he is seeing neither the future nor fate.

The fact that 1: His predictions are almost 100% accurate and 2: They can be wrong makes it clear that the most likely course of action is that his power is gathering ifomation and showing the most likely future and the most likely way that future can come to pass.

If he is seeing the future, thats by the way the explanation the person who knows most about the quirk (nighteye) says is the case,
then saying that the mere fact he has seen it means it wont happen, is circular reasoning, since its only supported by the idea that he isnt seeing the future.
And disproven by the uses we have seen of his power.

When he has only ever been wrong a single time, then that time is an outlier that should be discarded.
That leaves us with him being 100 % correct unless under special circumstances. And support the idea that he sees the future.

When we then look at the one case where he were wrong, then the thing standing out is that there were someone there with time manipulation powers.
So the most likely explanation is then that a) he does see the future. b) he is 100% correct. and c) that some quirks can mess with his ability to see what will happen.

... well. We got some interesting information and fun little details about the past. As you'd kind of expect, most holders of One For All died young, and had quirks that were not actually all that exceptional. Nana's only ability is that she could float! It makes sense, and establishes pretty clearly that these really are only meant to be support. It also answers, once again, why someone like Todoroki and Bakugo couldn't get this power. Combining it with their own would be too big a target for All For One.

It was in the past, where AfO were still in his prime, that OfA could not be given to someone powerful like Todoroki because he were already going to be targetet by AfO because of his quirk.
After All Might finally managed to defeat him he could basically have given his quirk to anyone he pleases. If anything, someone like Todoroki or Bakugo, or better yet Mirio, would have been a much safer pick.
Because they had their own quirks to fall back to and escape with until they had grown into OfA.

[Traab]

If he is seeing the future, thats by the way the explanation the person who knows most about the quirk (nighteye) says is the case,
then saying that the mere fact he has seen it means it wont happen, is circular reasoning, since its only supported by the idea that he isnt seeing the future.
And disproven by the uses we have seen of his power.

When he has only ever been wrong a single time, then that time is an outlier that should be discarded.
That leaves us with him being 100 % correct unless under special circumstances. And support the idea that he sees the future.

When we then look at the one case where he were wrong, then the thing standing out is that there were someone there with time manipulation powers.
So the most likely explanation is then that a) he does see the future. b) he is 100% correct. and c) that some quirks can mess with his ability to see what will happen.



It was in the past, where AfO were still in his prime, that OfA could not be given to someone powerful like Todoroki because he were already going to be targetet by AfO because of his quirk.
After All Might finally managed to defeat him he could basically have given his quirk to anyone he pleases. If anything, someone like Todoroki or Bakugo, or better yet Mirio, would have been a much safer pick.
Because they had their own quirks to fall back to and escape with until they had grown into OfA.

Personally I would have considered someone with a quirk that boosts physical strength and durability because it gives them a stronger base to work from. Like that guy with the sugar rush quirk, his quirk actually seems tailor made for an activatable strength and durability quirk like one for all. He would already have experience with pushing his limits as he gets stronger and tougher the more sugar he devours. Heh, he could do all mights flex trick with a little effort I bet. Although we also have to realize that this isnt something to be done through math and logic. All Might wasnt primarily looking for someone who could channel his quirk without exploding, he was looking for someone with the right mentality to not misuse it and be the right type of hero. The strength to handle it could come later.

[Rater202]

New chapter!

Spoiler

Show

... well. We got some interesting information and fun little details about the past. As you'd kind of expect, most holders of One For All died young, and had quirks that were not actually all that exceptional. Nana's only ability is that she could float! It makes sense, and establishes pretty clearly that these really are only meant to be support. It also answers, once again, why someone like Todoroki and Bakugo couldn't get this power. Combining it with their own would be too big a target for All For One.

We then get a wonderfully cute scene of Class 1A and 1B hotpotting together, getting ready for the next semester, all having a rather swell time. We get this wonderful joke where Midoriya is so caught up in his personal feelings that he kinda loses track of things when Todoroki asks him for some ponzu. It's cute.

and then we end the chapter with the ominous call that... by the end of this arc, heroes will be gone from this city.

Spoiler

Show

I don't know.

we still know nothing about the second and third wielders, who appeared in shadow when Deku met them all. Either they're somehow very significant to the setting--historical heroes we've heard of before--or there's something very big and important about their Quirks.

Also, "not all that exceptional" is certainly one way of describing Float, but the power to levitate, even if it's just "not falling" is actually hella useful. The worst-case scenario is that throwing him off a building or damaging the floor below him isn't an option anymore. Which combined with Blackwhip's maneuverability abilities gives him a lot of utility.

The other option is that its proper Levitation allowing the user to move in three dimensions to some degree, which even if it was relatively minor with Nana would mean full-fledged flight supercharged by One For All. Deku would be a proper Flying Brick and...

Oh My God. I know what's gonna happen.

The author is a clear fan of Western Style superheroes. You can see allusions to Marvel and DC heroes with certain characters.

The Quirk's within One For All... Deku's gonna end up some kind of composite between Superman(Most Famous DC hero) and Spider-Man(Most Famous Marvel hero.)

One For All by itself provides both strength and airblasts, which analog to super breath.

Float provides the flying.

The Other Four quirks will be some kind of combat precognition or clairvoyance, some kind of enhanced speed, reflexes, or flexibility, some kind of enhanced durability, and some kind of heat or energy related ranged attack.

[LaZodiac]

Spoiler

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I don't know.

we still know nothing about the second and third wielders, who appeared in shadow when Deku met them all. Either they're somehow very significant to the setting--historical heroes we've heard of before--or there's something very big and important about their Quirks.

Also, "not all that exceptional" is certainly one way of describing Float, but the power to levitate, even if it's just "not falling" is actually hella useful. The worst-case scenario is that throwing him off a building or damaging the floor below him isn't an option anymore. Which combined with Blackwhip's maneuverability abilities gives him a lot of utility.

The other option is that its proper Levitation allowing the user to move in three dimensions to some degree, which even if it was relatively minor with Nana would mean full-fledged flight supercharged by One For All. Deku would be a proper Flying Brick and...

Oh My God. I know what's gonna happen.

The author is a clear fan of Western Style superheroes. You can see allusions to Marvel and DC heroes with certain characters.

The Quirk's within One For All... Deku's gonna end up some kind of composite between Superman(Most Famous DC hero) and Spider-Man(Most Famous Marvel hero.)

One For All by itself provides both strength and airblasts, which analog to super breath.

Float provides the flying.

The Other Four quirks will be some kind of combat precognition or clairvoyance, some kind of enhanced speed, reflexes, or flexibility, some kind of enhanced durability, and some kind of heat or energy related ranged attack.

Spoiler

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That's a fascinating theory, and I could see it happening! I do find it interesting the second and third are so unknown, and am curious to see how that'll play out.

Also I say "not exceptional" because it's, and I'm saying this with extreme air quotes, "JUST" levitating. That's super damn useful and a utility basically anyone would ever want, but it's not like say... Bakugo.

[Rater202]

Spoiler

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I'd argue that Bakugo's power isn't really all that.

He can make his palms explode. it's powerful and destructive, but he also can't use it if he's not sweating and the non-combat applications of it are limited.

Something like levitation is useful in a wide variety of situations. There's a reason why it's one of the most common superpowers.

Another thing to consider is that, apparently, every wielder of One For all prior to All-Might was a professional hero who was working with the previous Torchbearer and was given its power as the previous was dying(presumably in battle with All For One.)

It might have been different in the old days, but you can't be a pro-hero without a quirk that is either powerful or useful. I doubt that anyone quirk Deku gets is gonna become his main power over his strength, but I wouldn't dismiss them all as just support powers.

[Ramza00]

This is me being silly.

Spoiler: Most Recent Chapter

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Get this man a shield! Wait, scratch that shield. Instead...

Get this man Mei's Jet Pack!


We already know Izuku can wield Mei's Jet Pack, and now he no longer needs Mei's Hover Soles if he can access the previous quirk of "Float." Float plus external sources of movement equals flight

Besides the fact air flicks or his black whip could also provide movement. Will this be used? Probably not

[Cozzer]

I really loved the quiet scenes of the latest chapter. Midoriya reflecting on how lucky he is really cements him as a foil of Shigaraki.

[LaZodiac]

New chapter!

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We get the... honestly kinda heartbreaking idea that Hawks has made himself so friendly to the League, and to Twice in particularly, that they actually like him. Twice really like, thinks Hawks is a good friend.

It's... kinda sad, honestly. Otherwise this chapter is mostly building stuff up, but that's cool!

[Dragonus45]

New chapter!

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We get the... honestly kinda heartbreaking idea that Hawks has made himself so friendly to the League, and to Twice in particularly, that they actually like him. Twice really like, thinks Hawks is a good friend.

It's... kinda sad, honestly. Otherwise this chapter is mostly building stuff up, but that's cool!

Spoiler

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It doesn't help matters at all that Twice is both the only genuinely sympathetic member of the League and also one of the most terrifying even with the addition of all the new allies in the whatever liberation group.

[Cozzer]

These chapters are doing an extremely good job of hyping me up for the big cluster**** that's about to start.

I wonder if Twice realizing the truth will be what pushes him from goofy anti-villain to genuine, terrifying menace.

[LaZodiac]

Spoiler

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It doesn't help matters at all that Twice is both the only genuinely sympathetic member of the League and also one of the most terrifying even with the addition of all the new allies in the whatever liberation group.

Yeah, that's a really good point.

These chapters are doing an extremely good job of hyping me up for the big cluster**** that's about to start.

I wonder if Twice realizing the truth will be what pushes him from goofy anti-villain to genuine, terrifying menace.

Yeah, I'm... super excited and a little scared, honestly. We'll see how things go.

Speakoing of scared; new My Hero Vigilantes and it's just this... entire huge bundle of "o h n o" and I love it.

[LaZodiac]

Updates!

The attack on Jakuu Hospital begins, with the bunny girl lady making a very big impression. Otherwise not a lot was missed.

Unless you read My Hero Vigilantes, in which

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THE SECRET REVEAL OF THE VILLAIN happens, with Popstep getting kidnapped AND INFECTED WITH THE BEE QUEEN!!!!!!! Oh **** son.

[bored_acel]

I think it will be more of a dual victory. He will die, but he wont die broken. Shigaraki will be more or less satisfied at the time, but it wont have the effect he was aiming for on the good guys. It is a standard bad guy trope from all settings that they dont fully understand how good guys think so he will feel like it happened in a good enough way for his purposes, but it wont break the good guys in any way. Think mel gibson in braveheart how he died. It was a terrible bloody pain filled public death, but he died crying out for freedom for his people so it inspired them despite being a public torture and execution of their heroic figurehead.

I am anticpating Toshinori's death to subvert our expectations and have it be the darkest part of Deku's journey. We've seen several moments of Midorya overcoming the odds, cheating fate, etc., and after establishing this tone, it would balance out the luck our heros have had so far. Midorya strikes me as a hero in need of an extreme personal crisis to become someone better than his mentor- such as losing his mentor in a gruesome, sudden way that genuinely breaks society's spirit. That's not to say that Deku wouldn't shine through and continue to set himself apart as an inspirational hero, but I'm honestly expecting All Might and at least one student from 1-A to have a double page spread dedicated to their untimely deaths... at the same time.

[Dragonus45]

Updates!

The attack on Jakuu Hospital begins, with the bunny girl lady making a very big impression. Otherwise not a lot was missed.

Unless you read My Hero Vigilantes, in which

Spoiler

Show

THE SECRET REVEAL OF THE VILLAIN happens, with Popstep getting kidnapped AND INFECTED WITH THE BEE QUEEN!!!!!!! Oh **** son.

Spoiler

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Hot damn that escalated quickly, i expected the plot to keep developing a bit more slowly. Also Pop really rocks the glam rock supervillain look. The entire situation is terrifying and awful I hope to god this doesn’t have a super sad ending. But. She really does rock that look.

[LaZodiac]

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Hot damn that escalated quickly, i expected the plot to keep developing a bit more slowly. Also Pop really rocks the glam rock supervillain look. The entire situation is terrifying and awful I hope to god this doesn’t have a super sad ending. But. She really does rock that look.

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Honestly the Bee version of her typical outfit is real good style wise, exudes an "evil counterpart" energy, and perhaps more concerning at all; no matter how this arc goes, she's lost an eye. Like, that's an established thing, Queen Bee digs into your brain case through the eye. That eye is gone. So no matter what, she's scarred for life on that one.

God Vigilantes is so good.

[Spacewolf]

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Honestly the Bee version of her typical outfit is real good style wise, exudes an "evil counterpart" energy, and perhaps more concerning at all; no matter how this arc goes, she's lost an eye. Like, that's an established thing, Queen Bee digs into your brain case through the eye. That eye is gone. So no matter what, she's scarred for life on that one.

God Vigilantes is so good.

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I'm glad we're done with the creepy guy taking advantage of a young girl part and onto supervillain business. The more grounded nature of his behaviour until now was honestly even creepier than bug pop.

[LaZodiac]

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Idol business is always super gross and scummy even when it's meant completely legitimately and nice, so honestly he actually came off as really well to me? Like, up until the reveal that he was Overclock, I thought he was just a regular nice guy helping Pop's solo career. Nothing he did was really that creepy up until the bar.

Also, I feel kinda bad it's ending. We allowed it to live long enough to give some necessary context for the main series most recent plot development, and then immediately push it into ending. That's actually kinda sad, thinking on it? But at least it's ending in a good way, it seems.

[Dragonus45]

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Idol business is always super gross and scummy even when it's meant completely legitimately and nice, so honestly he actually came off as really well to me? Like, up until the reveal that he was Overclock, I thought he was just a regular nice guy helping Pop's solo career. Nothing he did was really that creepy up until the bar.

Also, I feel kinda bad it's ending. We allowed it to live long enough to give some necessary context for the main series most recent plot development, and then immediately push it into ending. That's actually kinda sad, thinking on it? But at least it's ending in a good way, it seems.

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This was a series I think had a limited shelf life from the start though, and certainly benefits from not being stretched out to long. I am interested in seeing how this ending might give hints to how various characters might show up in the future of the main comic.