Clerics and 4.0

[Tor the Fallen]

Am I the only one who really wants to see a domain cleric?

For me, it really seems like, mechanically, every cleric is the same, which is one of the reasons that makes them so goddamned powerful. They have no limitations to what they can do, regardless of what god they worship.

I'm hoping that 4.0 will give us a cleric that matches the god he worships- why does a worshipper of the god of thieves automatically get heavy plate prof and turn undead?

A cleric is a caster in plate, ideal for buffing, decent to awesome at combat, with a bunch of juicy goodies thrown his way in the form of turning and domains.

[reorith]

that would be pretty cool. they should also give granted powers more weight.

[Human Paragon 3]

I kind of agree. In 2e your access to spells was much different, or at least it was in my games. Clerics had to be of a specific god and then each god granted a certain granted power (one of which was turn undead) and granted access to certain spheres (like schools). Each sphere could be major (spells up to 7th- the highest divine spell level at the time) or minor (spells up to 3rd).

When I switched to 3e, I was relieved to get the versatility of the 3.x cleric, but at the same time, they are all basically alike, mechanically anyway. They hardly get enough feats to differentiate themselves that way. Maybe something in between would be good.

[Ailurus]

I'd like to see some more differentiation as well.

One way that might work is just keeping a handful of spells (like cure X wounds and inflict X wounds, dispels, restoration) available to all clerics, and have each domain give 3-4 different spells per level to the cleric, keeping the amount of spells roughly the same, but making clerics of different domains distinct, and different deities especially distinct.

[Tor the Fallen]

I'd like to see some more differentiation as well.

One way that might work is just keeping a handful of spells (like cure X wounds and inflict X wounds, dispels, restoration) available to all clerics, and have each domain give 3-4 different spells per level to the cleric, keeping the amount of spells roughly the same, but making clerics of different domains distinct, and different deities especially distinct.

I was thinking something more like the PHBII's druid variants, with shifter and caster and companions types.

Maybe call them archetypes, or visages, or faces of the deity. You could be a weak caster, but wear plate, a good buffer, but weak controller, a good controller but weak blaster, etc. Different deities would have better or worse or different visages/faces/whatever.

For instance, Hextor would have some really sick guys in plate (full BAB, perhaps), but his healers wouldn't be all that great. Olidarmma would be sneakers with clerical spells; those in plate might not have a full BAB, but would get sneak attack. And so forth.

[martyboy74]

That's a really good idea; have a buffing cleric, a holy warrior with a few self-buffs, a healer, an curser (debuffs), and maybe a couple others. Not only would that suitably weaken that cleric, it would also eliminate the paladin, or at least make a PrC.

[Draz74]

I'd totally be in favor of all of this. Yay for the Ardent, blazing the trail as an example of what a priest character should have been like!

[Stormcrow]

I'm pretty sure the reason this doesn't exist in core D&D already is because it needs a nigh chapter worth of each class.

Which there is in my setting. But I can understand why they don't want to explode the length of their book with a chapter worth of cleric etc.

[Tor the Fallen]

I'm pretty sure the reason this doesn't exist in core D&D already is because it needs a nigh chapter worth of each class.

Which there is in my setting. But I can understand why they don't want to explode the length of their book with a chapter worth of cleric etc.

I was thinking tables. You could buy the splatbook w/ fluff later.

[GunMage]

I'm hoping that 4.0 will give us a cleric that matches the god he worships- why does a worshipper of the god of thieves automatically get heavy plate prof and turn undead?

This gave me a great mental image:Turn Law Enforcement!

[Hario]

This gave me a great mental image:Turn Law Enforcement!

What about an eastern adventure god, I don't want to see any clerics in 4.0 ed. Turning Japanese.

[Jack Mann]

Don't forget the god of chastity whose moralistic clerics Turn Tail.

[Reel On, Love]

Don't forget the god of chastity whose moralistic clerics Turn Tail.

Wouldn't that be the god of cowardice? I'd think the God of Chastity's clerics would tend to Turn Red And Stammer.

[Green Bean]

Wouldn't that be the god of cowardice? I'd think the God of Chastity's clerics would tend to Turn Red And Stammer.

Nah. The God of Cowardice's clerics Turn Yellow. Now, the clerics of the fertility goddess Turn On.

[Tor the Fallen]

Don't forget the god of chastity whose moralistic clerics Turn Tail.

I was thinking that would be more along the lines Turn Off.

[shaddy_24]

I was thinking that would be more along the lines Turn Off.

No, that's the power of the gods of death, disease, and uglyness.

[Reel On, Love]

Does that mean the clerics of a god of farming would Turn Ip?

[Jack Mann]

Clerics of the god of slumber Turn In.

[Solo]

What about an eastern adventure god, I don't want to see any clerics in 4.0 ed. Turning Japanese.

I'd like to Rebuke Japanese myself.

[Green Bean]

Clerics of the god of slumber Turn In.

Clerics of the Agriculture god Turn Up...

Okay, that was bad.

[Jack Mann]

Clerics of the Agriculture god Turn Up...

Okay, that was bad.

Also late. Check Reel's post above mine.

Of course, then there's Phrunk, the god of sporting events, who loathes mentha plants. Doesn't have too many followers.

After all, who wants to be known as the cleric who can turn a mint?

[Reel On, Love]

Better than serving the God of Practical Jokes. After all, that means you've got to Turn a Trick.

[TheOOB]

Considering that they are going to limit the amount of spells all spell casters know, clerics are going to be quite different from eachother by virtue of their spell list alone.

[Green Bean]

Also late. Check Reel's post above mine.

Curses, foiled again!

Okay, how about: Do the God of Sports' clerics Turn Ament?

[Reel On, Love]

Curses, foiled again!

Okay, how about: Do the God of Sports' clerics Turn Ament?

Fail again. Jack covered that right in his post.

[Jack Mann]

Y'know what? Let's just get them all out of the way now.

There's the god of traitors, whose clerics can Turn Coat.

The god of gaolers, whose clerics get Turn Key.

The god of rotating barriers, whose clerics can Turn Style.

The god of toll booths, whose clerics get to Turn Pike.

The god of imitation, whose clerics get to Re Turn.

The god of first aid, whose clerics get to Turn a Kit.

The god of folks, whose clerics can Turn, Turn, Turn.

The god of backtracking, whose clerics make You Turn.

There, did I miss any?

[Ralfarius]

I might favour a cleric of a baker's god, rolling to make a delicious Turn Over.

[Jack Mann]

Two more.

Clerics of the God of Audiences make for a good Turn Out.

Clerics of the Cigar God get to In Turn.

[Ivius]

Clerics of Nerull Turn All Pale.

Clerics of Olidamara Turn a Profit.

[TheOOB]

Clerics of the god of hip hop use a Turn Table