Large Scale DnD battles: Converting to Warhammer Statistics

[Rigel Cyrosea]

I like to run large scale battles occasionally in my Dungeons and Dragons campaign, but I've yet to find a satisfactory method to portray them in. I've tried Heroes of Battle, and found it annoying to run and unable to portray the "PCs as Strategists" idea. I tried the Minatures handbook mass battle rules. I found them clunky, restrictive, and unrealistic. Now, I've decided to try something else: Warhammer 40K rules.
First, the reasons why it's 40K over fantasy:
1. I don't know fantasy.
2. I feel Dungeons and Dragons combat, especially in high-magic worlds, is more similar to modern or futuristic warfare than traditional medieval warfare. Troops marching rank and file are just asking for a fireball or ice storm. Because there are many powerful weapons, troops would be better off in small, loose squads. 40K also allows for powerful characters and monsters that are the equal of entire squads, which is an important part of DnD.

I'm not going to go into the rules of Warhammer 40K here, so don't ask.
The scales are all pretty arbitrary right now, and I'm definately open to suggestions, as long as you have some logic behind them.

Converting Dungeons and Dragons Statistics to Warhammer Statistics

Wounds
Wounds are a function of HP. The scale is as follows:
1-25 HP = 1 wound
26-50 HP = 2 wounds
51-100 HP = 3 wounds
101-200 HP = 4 wounds
201+ HP = 5 wounds

Toughness
Toughness is determined through a combination of average hit dice size and size category. The scale is as follows:
Medium size and HD d8 or less = toughness 3
Medium size and HD d10 or more = toughness 4
Small size = toughness 3
Smaller than small = swarm, toughness 3
Large size, HD d8 or less = toughness 5
Large size, HD d10 or more = toughness 6
Huge size, HD d8 or less = toughness 6
Huge size, HD d10 or more = toughness 7
Gargantuan size, HD d6 or less = toughness 6
Gargantuan size, HD d8 = toughness 7
Gargantuan size, HD d10 or more = toughness 8
Collosal size, HD d6 or less = toughness 7
Collosal size, HD d8 = toughness 8
Collosal size, HD d10 = toughness 9
Collosal size, HD d12 = toughness 10
Damage reduction 5 – 10 = toughness +1
Damage reduction 11+ = toughness +2

Strength
Strength is a function of average melee damage and size. Do not factor in conditional damage covered by a special ability, such as sneak attack, power attack, charging, etc...
Average damage 1 = base value for size -1
Average damage 2-9 = base value for size
Average damage 10-19 = base value for size +1
Average damage 20+ = base value for size +2
Average damage 35+ = base value for size +3
Small size = 2, but average damage +5 for determining strength.
Medium size = 3
Large size = 4
Huge size = 5
Gargantuan size = 6
Collosal size = 7

Weapon Skill
Weapon skill is a function of total melee attack bonus modified by touch armour class.
Attack bonus <0 = WS 1
Attack bonus 0 = WS 2
Attack bonus 1-5 = WS 3
Attack bonus 6-11 = WS 4
Attack bonus 12-18 = WS 5
Attack bonus 19-25 = WS 6
Attack bonus 26-31 = WS 7
Attack bonus 32-40 = WS 8
Attack bonus 40-48 = WS 9
Attack bonus 49+ = WS 10

Touch armour class <10 = WS -1
Touch armour class 10-13 = WS +0
Touch armour class 14-18 = WS +1
Touch armour class 19+ = WS +2

Ballistic Skill
Ballistic skill is a function of total ranged attack bonus.
Attack bonus <0 = BS 1
Attack bonus 0-1 = BS 2
Attack bonus 2-5 = BS 3
Attack bonus 6-11 = BS 4
Attack bonus 12-18 = BS 5
Attack bonus 19-25 = BS 6
Attack bonus 26-31 = BS 7
Attack bonus 32-40 = BS 8
Attack bonus 40-48 = BS 9
Attack bonus 49+ = BS 10

Attacks
Attacks starts at a base 1 and improves through modifiers. Because two weapon combat is much rarer in DnD than Warhammer, the modifiers have been altered from that system. Attacks been split into two stats: ranged attacks and melee attacks. Ranged attacks is the number of attacks you get with a rapid fire weapon while standing still. You only get 1 attack with rapid fire weapons while moving. The number after the slash is the ranged weapon attacks.
Main weapon is a close combat weapon: +1 melee
Main weapon is a ranged weapon: +1 ranged
Each iterative melee attack possible on a full attack, including those with extra weapons: +1 each, melee
Each iterative ranged attack possible on a full attack: +1 each, ranged

Initiative
Initiative is function of, you guessed it, initiative.
Initiative <0 = initiative 2
Initiative 0-2 = initiative 3
Initiative 3-4 = initiative 4
Initiative 5-7 = initiative 5
Initiative 8-10 = initiative 6
Initiative 11+ = initiative 7

Save
Save is a function of armour bonus. This includes shields and natural armour.
Armour 0-1 = save –
Armour 2-3 = save 6+
Armour 4-5 = save 5+
Armour 6-8 = save 4+
Armour 9-10 = save 3+
Armour 11+ = save 2+

Leadership
Leadership lacks a quick, easy, conversion. Here’s a basic breakdown of the various values and what fits in where.
Leadership 5 – These are mindless and barely controllable, operating on instinct alone.
Leadership 6 – The scaredy-cats. Conscripts, cowards, and those completely devoid of loyalty.
Leadership 7 – Your average soldier. Not exactly famous for his loyalty and fearlessness, but not going to drop his weapons at the first casualty either.
Leadership 8 – Above average. These are battle hardened soldiers who’ve seen a few conflicts and know when to stay and when to go.
Leadership 9 – Something makes these people incredibly brave and courageous. Whether outstanding loyalty or simple foolhardy unwillingness to back down, these guys are going to stick it out, for better or worse.
Leadership 10 – Immune to fear, but rational enough to known you sometimes can’t win.
Fearless – Fanatical, never back down, insane people. These guys don’t know the meaning of the word retreat. Don’t fall into the trap of making every adventurer with immunity to fear fearless. This is only for the real fanatics- a fearless paladin fits better into leadership 10 or even 9.

New Stat: Penetration
Penetration has been added because effects in DnD that would simulate the ever common Warhammer “ignores armour” special rule are few and far between. To keep the game balanced, each model gets an ability to “penetrate”, or reduce the armour of an opponent by a number of steps equal to their penetreation score. Penetration applies to both normal ranged weapons and close combat. Special ranged weapons may have their own penetration value. Penetration is a function of base attack bonus.
BAB 0-3= penetration 0
BAB 4-6 = penetration 1
BAB 7-9 = penetration 2
BAB 10-13 = penetration 3
BAB 14-18 = penetration 4
BAB 19+ = penetration 5

Special Rules
Some examples:
Power Attack: This model may subtract one or more from its weapon skill to increase it’s strength by the same amount. The model using this may not reduce it’s weapon skill value below half it’s original value, rounded up.
Sneak Attack/Sudden Strike: Sneak attack is more difficult to apply on the battlefield than in a normal DnD combat situation. If the model with sneak attack charges and strikes first in the first round of combat, they gain a bonus to strength based on their number of sneak attack dice, as shown below. They may also gain this bonus on ranged attacks while in hard cover if their target is within 12”:
1d6 – 2d6 = +1
3d6 – 5d6 = +2
5d6 – 10d6 = +3
11d6+ = strength +4
Skirmish: If the model moves 2 inches or more on it’s turn, it gets a bonus to strength and possibly weapon skill. Use the scale for sneak attack above to determine what the strength bonus is and add the AC bonus to the touch armour class of the creature to determine if it gets a bonus to weapon skill while skirmishing.
Spell and Effect Damage and range: The average damage of a spell determines its strength. The range of a spell is determined by the scale of 1 inch = 10ft. When determining the blast template size, use the large blast template if the spell has a radius of over 25ft.
Average damage 1 = strength 2
Average damage 2-5 = strength 3
Average damage 6-12 = strength 4
Average damage 13-19 = strength 5
Average damage 20-27 = strength 6
Average damage 28-35 = strength 7
Average damage 36-43 = strength 8
Average damage 44-55 = strength 9
Average damage 56+ = strength 10

Equipment Coversions
Crossbow, Heavy Range 36” Str 4 Heavy 1
Crossbow, Light Range 24” Str 3 Heavy 1
Longbow Range 30” Str 3 Rapid Fire
Shortbow Range 24” Str 3 Rapid Fire
Longbow, Composite Range 30” Str 4 Rapid Fire
Shortbow, Composite Range 24” Str 4 Rapid Fire
Hand Crossbow Range 12” Str 3 Assault 1
Crossbow, Range 36” Str 4 Rapid Fire
Repeating Heavy
Crossbow, Range 24” Str 3 Rapid Fire
Repeating Light
Shuriken Range 12” Str 2 Assault 3
Sling Range 18” Str 3 Rapid Fire

[Sergeantbrother]

That looks pretty good. I've been using Warhammer to simulate D&D for years, though I usually used a less strict and more off the cuff method of converting attributes. I also pretty much did away with the standard armor save and just let Toughness represent that.

[Swordguy]

Dude...that's seriously impressive. It looks good.

My only quibble is using BAB for AP. I'd link it to the model's Strength score (or the effective strength of the attack for ranged weapons - accounting for Composite bows and the like).

[Rigel Cyrosea]

The thing is, in DnD you get through armour by having a high attack bonus, not doing lots of damage. The rogue in my party has BAB +6 and +15 to hit, but he has a strength score of 8. He should still be able to get through armour, but if I based it only off of strenght score, he wouldn't.

[Belkarseviltwin]

A couple of issues:
Your "penetration" system harks back to old 40k editions (and still exists in Fantasy). I like it. However, it's usually written as a Save Modifier (-1, -2, -3, -4 etc.)

Small creatures need a base Strength in 40k terms of 2- look at Ratlings or Gretchin, for example.

Spells: The scale in 40k is dodgy, I'd say around 1 inch to 2 squares. Act accordingly for spell effects. If it's a major spell, use the D&D rules to adjudicate its effects- for example, if you used a Disintegrate, the target gets the same sort of save they would in D&D, though if they take damage it's treated as a hit in 40k. You may also want to have some hits doing d6 wounds, to represet death by massive damage.

[Rigel Cyrosea]

I didn't know that penetration was a real stat once, but I think I'll keep it as penetration, just because I prefer using positive numbers.
You're right about small creatures, I forgot that there are some with 2 strength. I think I'm going to change the scale a bit so it's easier to get str 3. I don't want to end up with all those halfling rogues that rely on sneak attack for damage to always have strength 2.
For distances, I've been using the scale of 1 inch to 1 square, because 6 inches then = 30ft, the average speed of most creatures. However, for ranged weapons it's been closer to 1 inch = 2 squares, otherwise a heavy crossbow would have a range of 60". I've been toying with whether to make heavily armoured and small creatures move less inches, but I think it might unbalance things a bit, so I've so far left it out. Also, I've been thinking of using leadership for saves, but it might be better to just use real DnD saves.

[tyckspoon]

The thing is, in DnD you get through armour by having a high attack bonus, not doing lots of damage. The rogue in my party has BAB +6 and +15 to hit, but he has a strength score of 8. He should still be able to get through armour, but if I based it only off of strenght score, he wouldn't.

Warhammer, however, operates more like using an 'Armor as DR' variant rule. Bypassing armor with skill would be something more like a Rending weapon, which ignores armor if you roll a 6 to hit. Or maybe a special ability along the lines of "Compare the character's WS to the figure he is attacking. If the character's WS is higher, subtract the difference from the victim's armor rating."

[Rigel Cyrosea]

Warhammer, however, operates more like using an 'Armor as DR' variant rule. Bypassing armor with skill would be something more like a Rending weapon, which ignores armor if you roll a 6 to hit. Or maybe a special ability along the lines of "Compare the character's WS to the figure he is attacking. If the character's WS is higher, subtract the difference from the victim's armor rating."

I agree that warhammer normally operates on an "armour as DR" basis, but that's not how DnD works, and I'm more interested in making this compatable and balanced with DnD stuff than with warhammer stuff. It's not intended to be balanced with real warhammer 40K units, just with itself. Using rending to represent bypassing armour presents two problems: first, how do you determine who qualifies and who doesn't? Second, rending has no scale- you either have it or you don't, and you either roll a six, or you don't. DnD isn't that clear cut. Comparing the WS's means that having a high base attack bonus makes people less able to get through your armour, which makes no sense.

[Dalboz of Gurth]

I use real world combat statistics to simulate AD&D battles, but this is a neat system too ^_^