Stalwart Battle Sorcerer- Gish Beast or Terrible?

[Godofallu]

Hey everyone,

I must confess. I am in love with the spell Alter Self. Being able to add 6+ NA and gain natural attacks and movement modes ect. All in one lvl 2 spell?! It's just so good and so fun! In addition I quite like Polymorph and Draconic Polymorph ect.

The main issue with spells like that is the poor HP that comes from the low HD of the Wizard ect. And the poor Bab which comes from the poor 1/2 Bab of a Wizard ect.

Now my thought it is use a Battle Sorcerer or if possible (rules is iffy so IDK) a Stalwart Battle Sorcerer to gain essentially 3/4Bab + D12 HD. All while casting the admittedly crippled arcane spells.

I am wondering on your take on ruling of combining Stalwart and Battle sorcerer together. As well on your opinion of if this is better than the typical gish ideas of mixing wizard and fighter or sorcerer and paladin and then using prestige classes. Assuming we're talking about the typical leveling experience from lvl 1 to 12 or so.

In addition any advice on feats for something like this? I know I want Precosious apprentice-Alter Self as one of them but I play with flaws as well. I would probably trade familiar away for animal companion and take natural bond for another 1st lvl feat. Beyond that I am not sure what would be grabbed. Thoughts and suggestions welcome on spells as well.

[Troacctid]

They don't conflict, so I don't see any reason why you couldn't combine them unless you think battle sorcerer can't take any ACFs at all.

The main reason stalwart sorcerer is great is because if you use it with weapon familiarity + dragonborn it's just two bonus feats. But, you know, outside of that, it's okay, I guess. It's kind of like if you spent one of your highest-level slots each day on a 24-hour buff spell.

Battle sorcerer is generally weaker than normal sorcerer. You already get so few spells known; giving up one of each level is a higher price to pay than that BAB is worth. But of course there's plenty of room to be worse than a normal sorcerer and still be worth playing—just ask the bard.

[Fouredged Sword]

It works well if you have a really specific thing you are going after and don't care about being a caster outside of that. You get the one or two specific spells you need and don't care about anything outside of that.

Monk 2 / Stalwart Battle Sorcerer 8 / Enlightened Fist 10 beast strike battlefist warforged is a solid build. You punch things for 32d6 damage.

[Godofallu]

The main reason stalwart sorcerer is great is because if you use it with weapon familiarity + dragonborn it's just two bonus feats.

Can you explain that thought in more detail? Not understanding the comment.

[Troacctid]

Can you explain that thought in more detail? Not understanding the comment.

Okay so it grants you Martial Weapon Proficiency and Weapon Focus of your choice as bonus feats. Because of your gnomish weapon familiarity, you can treat hooked hammers as martial weapons, so you choose the hooked hammer. Then, you undergo the rite of rebirth and become a dragonborn. As part of the process, you lose your racial abilities, including weapon familiarity. Oops! Your feats are now illegal, which means as per the rules of rebirth, you can now replace them with any other feats of your choice. Bam, two bonus feats.

[Anthrowhale]

Abjurant Champion might be a useful prestige class to pick up since it will allow you to reach BAB+16 and the AC bonuses are nice as well.

Illumian + Sacred Exorcist would allow you to persist a small number of spells making them function in something more like a wildshape mode (and Sacred Exorcist is a gish prestige class).

Unseen Seer, if you can manage the skill prereqs is also a solid gish prestige class.

In terms of spells you might want to consider Greater Mighty Wallop at 3rd level.

At second level, persistent wraithstrike is a great combo with power attack.

[Godofallu]

Okay so it grants you Martial Weapon Proficiency and Weapon Focus of your choice as bonus feats. Because of your gnomish weapon familiarity, you can treat hooked hammers as martial weapons, so you choose the hooked hammer. Then, you undergo the rite of rebirth and become a dragonborn. As part of the process, you lose your racial abilities, including weapon familiarity. Oops! Your feats are now illegal, which means as per the rules of rebirth, you can now replace them with any other feats of your choice. Bam, two bonus feats.

Interesting thought. My first issue is that Dragonborn are still considered a member of their original race. So a gnome that goes through a dragonborn transformation still is counted as a gnome. Rule "You still count as a member of your original race for the purpose of any effect or prerequisite that depends on race."

So i'm not convinced you can just swap those feats out for anything else. Being a gnome gives you access to gnome hooked hammer and you still count as a gnome. Plus if you lose weapon proficiency now we're back to only a simple weapon. Which isn't actually much worse than martial but still not great.

[Darg]

A stalwart battle sorcerer's familiar has really good HP values that can rival an animal companion. They get to cast spells in up to medium armor. They can get an animal companion along with a familiar that is combat capable. You get 4 free feats in proficiency and focus.

You aren't going to WOW anyone yourself, but you can be extremely capable as part of a group.

[Troacctid]

Interesting thought. My first issue is that Dragonborn are still considered a member of their original race. So a gnome that goes through a dragonborn transformation still is counted as a gnome. Rule "You still count as a member of your original race for the purpose of any effect or prerequisite that depends on race."

So i'm not convinced you can just swap those feats out for anything else. Being a gnome gives you access to gnome hooked hammer and you still count as a gnome. Plus if you lose weapon proficiency now we're back to only a simple weapon. Which isn't actually much worse than martial but still not great.

You lose all your gnome racial abilities except for ability scores, size, and movement speed. That means no racial weapon familiarity.

Unless you believe the hooked hammer itself grants a redundant benefit by restating the gnomish weapon familiarity with it, in which case, gnome is just an example; you probably really wanted to be a kobold anyway, and you can use the greatpick instead.

[Gruftzwerg]

The Stalwart Battle Sorcerer definitively has a few arguments on his side, but it also has a few shortcomings. It all boils down to the situation, party and/or build. Imagine a scenario where you are the parties sole melee build. In this chase you really want the extra HP (btw, d8+2= effectively a better d10 not d12). Even if your party has melees it helps to not be to squishy. This is also true for the familiar if you intend to share combat spells with it (e.g. Alter Self/Polymorph..) since it only has half your HP. Being an HP monster himself as S.B. Sorcerer thus also helps your familiars HP.

In the early levels this can be a bigger difference than in the late game (since other build may find other ways to compensate for that: e.g. PRC). The more limited spell selection can be a lil headache, but if you know what you are doing and what you want it can be good trade imho.

BTW, a lil bit offtopic, but since you expressed your love for Alter Self: Did you have considered Tattooed Monk? It can get a Chameleon Tattoo that gives Alter Self with a duration measured in hours per class level. We recently had a Iron Chef competition around the Tattooed Monk. Maybe you'll get some inspiration there. I did participate myself and the builds there are really nice (mines is "G.R.8"). (LINK the builds start at #106)

[JNAProductions]

The Stalwart Battle Sorcerer definitively has a few arguments on his side, but it also has a few shortcomings. It all boils down to the situation, party and/or build. Imagine a scenario where you are the parties sole melee build. In this chase you really want the extra HP (btw, d8+2= effectively a better d10 not d12). Even if your party has melees it helps to not be to squishy. This is also true for the familiar if you intend to share combat spells with it (e.g. Alter Self/Polymorph..) since it only has half your HP. Being an HP monster himself as S.B. Sorcerer thus also helps your familiars HP.

In the early levels this can be a bigger difference than in the late game (since other build may find other ways to compensate for that: e.g. PRC). The more limited spell selection can be a lil headache, but if you know what you are doing and what you want it can be good trade imho.

BTW, a lil bit offtopic, but since you expressed your love for Alter Self: Did you have considered Tattooed Monk? It can get a Chameleon Tattoo that gives Alter Self with a duration measured in hours per class level. We recently had a Iron Chef competition around the Tattooed Monk. Maybe you'll get some inspiration there. I did participate myself and the builds there are really nice (mines is "G.R.8"). (LINK the builds start at #106)

What's the average of d8+2 and d12? You'll find them to be 6.5.

If your DM uses max HP at level one (as most do, far as I know) you lose 2 HP compared to a d12 HD class with your d8+2.

[TotallyNotEvil]

As far as I recall, adding Stalwart to your Battle Sorcerer is a free upgrade, which is nice, but the Sorcerer is already pretty gimped for spells known. You'd have a single first level spell known for levels 1-3, which seems pretty painful.

It bears reminding that 3.5 does have a ready-made Gish: the Duskblade.

It might not be as brilliant as the Magus, but it does bring some decent integration between the arcane and martial side beyond "buff up and swing", besides some sweet perks the Aorc doesn't get like full BAB and good Fort.

The Duskblade is much more committed to fighting things than the Sorcerer, and I think would be better to level. You could add Alter Self to your spell list by picking Arcane Disciple (Transformatiom Domain). It plays very well as a "magic warrior" with emphasis on "warrior".

Come to think of it, I suppose if the campaign is trying to imitate the very classic sword-and-sorcery feel where everyone can fight at least a little, and magic is like one or two supernatural tricks you know, the Stalwart Battle Sorc could mimic that well.

[Rebel7284]

So to answer the title: Stalwart Battle Sorcerer- Gish Beast or Terrible?

Neither.

It's a solid gish-in-a-can class and has everything you need to gish in a low to mid optimization game especially at low to mid levels. However, it doesn't get any class features, and taking ANY prestige class means you keep the drawbacks of the diminished casting but without any of the benefits.

A regular sorcerer with gish-focused prestige classes will almost certainly be better in the middle to late levels due to actually getting class features on top of more spells.

Both approaches will work just fine for most games.

On a side note, +2HP per level is pretty nifty in gestalt on, say, a sorcerer warblade

[DMVerdandi]

It's definitely one of the best gishes in the game out of the box for sure.

I think if the intent is not to be a sorcerer with a better chassis, but to actually be a martial sorcerer, it far outshines some other classes like, monk or rogue or as troacctid states the bard. Focused on buffs and the odd blast spell, it's a thing of glory.

Still not as good as say the cleric or druid in many MANY ways, but it's definitely not just in tier 3.
Is it cheaper finding a way to get divine power on a wizard or wizard esque class, yes. absolutely, but at the same degree, heck, you can get the arcane disciple feat, war domain, and voila. You have divine power.

A monk dip for ascetic mage could also have you drop the need for armor altogether.


Things to be said. Big spells for this build

>HEROICS
lets you use a fighter feat for the duration of the spell. Delicious.

>Wraithstrike
Hits become touch attacks

>Shadow Evocation and Conjuration
So you won't have to worry about getting a bunch of blasty spells.

>Greater Mighty whallop.
Damage is HEAFTY.

>wind wall

[Fizban]

Now my thought it is use a Battle Sorcerer or if possible (rules is iffy so IDK) a Stalwart Battle Sorcerer to gain essentially 3/4Bab + D12 HD. All while casting the admittedly crippled arcane spells.

I am wondering on your take on ruling of combining Stalwart and Battle sorcerer together. As well on your opinion of if this is better than the typical gish ideas of mixing wizard and fighter or sorcerer and paladin and then using prestige classes. Assuming we're talking about the typical leveling experience from lvl 1 to 12 or so.

I generally don't support the stacking of ACFs that are obviously meant to do the same thing, or feats, as it's one of the main ways you get wildly inconsistent power levels: char-op digs up six versions of the same thing that all stack by default, when none of the original writers intended them to.

Additionally, I find Stalwart Sorcerer fishy to begin with. It reads like something written with entirely self serving interests, someone who wanted to "lose" fewer hit points on their Sorcerer levels for their gish build and deal with prerequisites that want a marital weapon and/or weapon focus - oh hey look, it's the completely broken Abjurant Champion, which just so happens to want one martial weapon proficiency and remove all pretense of limiting "gish" builds. And/or it was crammed in there because they couldn't think of anything for the Sorcerer but had to do something that looked sufficiently powerful compared to the absurd "Focused Specialist" erasing any remaining claim that Sorcerers actually have higher spells per day, and +2 hit points per level on a d4 class looks big even if the cost hits the Sorcerer right in the one place they can't really afford if they're actually the Sorcerer.


All of that said, when used together properly, the result is a 3/4 BAB, d12 class with only one spell known for each of its highest two levels- somewhat as if the Bard traded their skill points and music for swole hit points and the ability to upgrade their highest level spells known. Alternatively, consider the Divine Crusader, which has 3/4 BAB, d8, and 9th level spells, but only form a list of one spell per level via a domain (which could potentially be expanded by getting bonus domains) and has several levels of something else before entering the PrC.

Ultimately, I still find the combination unsuitable. Spellcasters are not supposed to have d12 equivalent hit points. The Battle Sorcerer already goes up to d8 immediately, Stalwart is to me an obviously slapdash ACF that is meant to do the same thing, and even if the two writers accidentally wrote a pair of things that can stack that doesn't mean they should. Both comparable examples have immediate comparison problems: a Bard with d12s and higher level spells? A PrC that is restricted to a pre-made domain, but instead more hit points and picking spells freely?

If a Battle Sorc wants more hit points, they can take Improved Toughness like anyone else- their spellcasting is reduced enough to pay for what they get, but applying Stalwart after that is a diminished cost for a benefit that stacks to being more valuable than it was before (too much synergy). In order to convince me to allow a Stalwart Battle Sorc, the player would have to build say a Psychic Warrior that could match it and prove that they fit within the expectations of the rest of the game (as I once built a Battle Sorc to prove to myself a homebrew class character was legit, and found it was, for a much higher power level than half the party).

Of course, I also look down on 3.5 Alter Self abuse (I use the 3.0 version, which was a disguise spell with minor physical benefits, not "find the most obscure book" mini-Polymorph), and laugh at the idea of "Flaws" (read: free feats), so my power level is probably not the same you're looking for. If your table accepts that use of Alter Self, and is okay with it at 1st level, and allows Flaws, then I doubt they would have any problem with stacking those ACFs- though I would be amused if all of them together did suddenly get a reaction.

In addition any advice on feats for something like this? I know I want Precosious apprentice-Alter Self as one of them but I play with flaws as well. I would probably trade familiar away for animal companion and take natural bond for another 1st lvl feat. Beyond that I am not sure what would be grabbed. Thoughts and suggestions welcome on spells as well.

3.5 Alter Self gives you access to decent flight with the right books, so Flyby Attack is obvious, though I doubt you would want to bother with Swim-by-Attack (but that would let you say more resources are focused on Alter Self, and be a heck of a surprise for a water adventure when you show you've had Swim-by-Attack the whole time). Mostly the spell gives you access to massive AC boosts from natural armor, so you can either get away with ignoring X points of AC, or use it to boost your AC to ridiculous levels. You could take Multiattack to improve natural weapon use, having three attacks with only a -2 penalty on some of them is also an obviously major boost at 1st level.

Beyond that, well Alter Self isn't going to carry you forever so you'll eventually want to take whatever spells or feats are required to reach an appropriate level of "gish" for your table. If you use Wraithstrike, that will support both ubercharging and natural weapon spam with Rapidstrike or if you went Warshaper. You very specifically don't want to enter most PrCs, so you don't have any prerequisites to work towards, and I doubt you'd want the limited uses of Sudden metamagic. Combat Expertise is the shortest way to turn an AC that's +5 higher than normal into "just miss," and again if you're going to be using Wraithstrike or something then you can eat the penalty.

[TotallyNotEvil]

I think this is the first time I've ever seen someone say Stalwart Sorcerer is "fishy" in a "too good" way. Or talking about Improved Toghness as anything but a joke.

Just Stalwart is a tougher sorcerer who's worse at serious spells, but Battle Sorcerer being the basis of the build takes an enormous hit to its spell casting, which is literally the only thing the Sorcerer has going for it. You know a second 1st level spell by Sorc 4, a second 2nd level spell by Sorc 7, a second 3rd level spell by Sorc 9.

There are no class features to make up for it, you just go from "bad" to "ok" at whacking people.

Huh, you know what its casting reminds me of? The Ardent.

[Xervous]

I think this is the first time I've ever seen someone say Stalwart Sorcerer is "fishy" in a "too good" way. Or talking about Improved Toghness as anything but a joke.

Balance is relative. Start with a list of competencies a class should have at least some of at levels X Y and Z, you’ll note that fighter and others don’t keep up. Start with the idea that fighter is relevant at all levels and other classes look like gross outliers.

[Kaleph]

Besides confirming many of the things being said, after witnessing a stalwart battle sorcerer in action in an actual campaign, I can provide some personal consideration.

Globally and in terms of overall power, I would call the variant a downgrade of the sorcerer that is still tier two, but on the lower side of the spectrum.

It power/level curve is more continuous and stable in comparison with the typical PrC-based gishes, which is an advantage at lower level thanks to the decent to-hit bonus and the huge amount of HP; in a small party, it can even occupy the primary meleer slot, although it would mean stretching it a bit. Together with CoDzilla it's also the only gish-in-a-can with access to 9th level spells, and more than CoDzilla it can incarnate the archetypal gish with its arcane spells (actually my favored spell list).

Its routine is kinda fixed, but it's great: long term buffs, 1st round the most powerful spell it can afford, and then wade into melee. And its melee routine is nothing to sneeze at: wand of wraithstrike + power attack + arcane strike, and as soon as you have a bit more of money, spell storing weapon + combust. Without forgetting the privilege of jumping fearless (with all those HP) into the middle of an enemy party and casting wings of flurry! And all the things I've mentioned are kinda out-of-the-box, it's not that I'm inventing something special or seriously optimizing it.

Talking about builds, the one I've seen had an improved familiar that got boosted through alter self, but in retrospect a fear-based build would be a better archetype (dreadful wrath, metamagic specialist variant, fell frighten with Kaupaer's quickblast and wings of flurry means 3 cha-based fear effects in a round).

The weaknesses are kinda obvious. First, it doesn't mix up very good with PrC's, but that's still ok. The main issue are the known spells. Not counting 0-level, until level 3 you have only 1 known spell IIRC, which will likely be color spray or the like, so no self buff. At level 4 you finally know another spell, 2nd level, and it must be alter self, because you know, your AC sucks. So you have to wait some 3 levels more until you get glitterdust, and that's just a pain. And you are level 7 now, and you are still stuck with 1 melee attack/round. As I said, mixing a very limited number of extremely good spells with some decent melee prowess and a lot of HP is still good, but probably a bit less good as it may seem in the first place.

From this point on, though, you rapidly evolve towards your sweet spot, that - as for most gishes - you get somewhere between level 10 and 13; as I've mentioned, you'll likely get there slightly sooner than the others. So in conclusion, I would recommend the variant for the level range that you are mentioning (1-12), as long as you understand its strength and weaknesses.

[Fouredged Sword]

I think this is the first time I've ever seen someone say Stalwart Sorcerer is "fishy" in a "too good" way. Or talking about Improved Toghness as anything but a joke.

Just Stalwart is a tougher sorcerer who's worse at serious spells, but Battle Sorcerer being the basis of the build takes an enormous hit to its spell casting, which is literally the only thing the Sorcerer has going for it. You know a second 1st level spell by Sorc 4, a second 2nd level spell by Sorc 7, a second 3rd level spell by Sorc 9.

There are no class features to make up for it, you just go from "bad" to "ok" at whacking people.

Huh, you know what its casting reminds me of? The Ardent.

Stalwart Battle Sorcerer is a bad sorcerer.

They are a decent gish for how not complicated the build is. SBS is still a tier 2 full caster, but with the effective equivalent of a d12 HD and with prestige classes fully capable of being pushed to 18 BAB. It's closer to the tier 3 side of tier 2, but it has the distinctive win buttons that make it upper tier rather than mid tier.

It's not high OP, but it's a solid class to consider at a tier 3 table. It's going to play like a magical version of a warrior that self buffs rather than an arcane caster and should be judged accordingly. It is solidly more powerful than ether fighter or barbarian, capable of performing their primary combat role while having 9th level spells and access to the entire Sorc/wiz spell list via scrolls.

[Kaleph]

Huh, you know what its casting reminds me of? The Ardent.

The vanilla ardent (no mind's eye ACF) is definitely worse. If you consider the ACF they are more or less on the same tier level, but the sorcerer's spell progression is kinda like the wilder's.

[Godofallu]

This is also true for the familiar if you intend to share combat spells with it (e.g. Alter Self/Polymorph..) since it only has half your HP. Being an HP monster himself as S.B. Sorcerer thus also helps your familiars HP.

For the record I have never once used a familiar for anything other than the passive stats and occasional scouting. I never considered it for combat and this comment sent me down the rabbit hole googling around for familiar handbooks and jotting down cool feats and familiar options.

I have to say I always just assumed I would trade familiar for animal companion at 1/2 druid lvl. Now comparing the two I don't think it's worth it with how decent they can be in melee. Very cool.

[Gruftzwerg]

For the record I have never once used a familiar for anything other than the passive stats and occasional scouting. I never considered it for combat and this comment sent me down the rabbit hole googling around for familiar handbooks and jotting down cool feats and familiar options.

I have to say I always just assumed I would trade familiar for animal companion at 1/2 druid lvl. Now comparing the two I don't think it's worth it with how decent they can be in melee. Very cool.

There are a bunch of things that you can do with a familiar. Especially as a gish.

Share your combat buff spells. Alter Self is the most abused here, with Polymorph being the second place (due to lvl^^). Note that the familiar counts either as animal or as magical beast for the purpose of spells you share. This opens some nice options. Together combine with Enlarge Person if you can afford 2 rounds of buffing (or quicken one of em) for a pretty heavy early game strategy. Mirror Image is a great defensive tool that you should always share.

As for special feats, besides from the Improved Familiar and similiar options there are also a few other gems. Like the Shadowform familiar to get an incorporeal familiar. Abuseable either on combat familiars as defense or for buffing familiars (UMD +wands) to keep em out of sight from the enemies.
It scales (BAB, HP, Saves, Skills) with you, even if you only dip a single level into the class that gives it to you. The things that the familiar get for the class lvls are almost negligible compared to that.

Really, gish builds should try to keep their familiars. Or trade em for Animal Companion and get their Familiar via Obtain Familiar back to have a nice wombo combo. 1 personal spell = 3 targets benefiting from that. Could be a nice option for a Stalwart Battle Sorcerer imho.

[tiercel]

Presumably the point isn’t to compare SBS to a regular sorcerer, the point is to compare it to a more “traditional” arcane gish build; SBS is simpler, a functional gish from the start, and arguably at least comparable to a typical gish build in terms of spellcasting.

Also, Apprentice: Spellcaster seems pretty useful for SBS: helps get over the “only knows one spell at 1st level” hump, brings in UMD (which is always useful, and makes the SBS’s beefier familiar that much more awesome), which is presumably incentive to keep Apprentice around even if retraining is on the table.

On the flip side, “simpler” means your build is mostly a straight line: either straight SBS or perhaps a foray into Abjurant Champion (which is so ridiculously good that it’s worth it even for SBS), so not so much grabbing specific gish PrC builds. (Also, not weaponizing your Cha to saves like Sorcadins do, sorta thing.)

[TotallyNotEvil]

Well, something like Fighter 1/Wiz 5/Eldritch Knight 10/Wiz +3/Fighter +1 is about as simple as non-monoclass builds can get, being Core only even, and still achieves 9th level spells and BAB +16, but is also pretty damn playable throughout.

In the end, SBS (and that's a neat acronym for it) has sharp drawbacks: your spell choices are absurdly tight, and spells are still your only class features. But it can't be said that having access to even those very few, but appropriate in level for a full-caster, spells don't make it strong by the end.

One just has to be aware of things like "your spell repertoire is one level 1 spell until you hit level 4".

But by mid levels, as long as you think of your guy less like a sorcerer and instead like an ok fighter dude with some superpowers, it can be pretty sweet. By 8th, you can attack twice on a full attack like all the cool kids, but you can also become Greater Invisible while you Fly and hit people with Schorching Rays in between bouts of swording. Gishes tend to look really good in what 5E calls Tier 2.

I think that mentality of "I'm not a sorcerer, I'm a sword guy with powers" is important, so perhaps not walking around with the usual suspects of Wizard, Cleric and Druid would help. You should fit right in with Bards, Rogues and Warlocks tho.

[Kazyan]

Theoretically, yeah, it's okay. You have to be really good at the whole "picking spells that you'll actually use" thing, though, because if you get that wrong, you're trying to flex with little to show for yourself but 3/4 BAB and "d12" hit dice. I guess having a familiar would take you out of Tier 6.

[Particle_Man]

I am curious how it stacks up vs the psychic warrior, another simple gish build.

[Fouredged Sword]

I am curious how it stacks up vs the psychic warrior, another simple gish build.

SBS gets more spells know.
Psiwar's powers are more flexible within each power.

EDIT
SBS gets a lot MORE spells per day than Psiwar gets power points.
Did the math Psiwar and SBS get almost exactly the same number of spell/powers points per day.
Psiwar can spend ALL their power points ONLY on the few powers they care about.

SBS has 2 extra HP per HD.

SBS has a good will save
Psiwar has a good fort save, and their casting stat boosts will saves.

SBS has access to better prestige classes, even if it loses some of it's shine when you take them. Abjurant Champion is dead simple to qualify for and is so powerful it's hard to not take as a melee focused caster.

You could stick them both in the same party and they would play roughly the same power until later levels, when Psiwar would struggle when faced with 8th and 9th level spells.

The SBS is also potentially going to have more utility. You can build a gish around 3-4 spells of 1-4th level and have that carry you in melee until late game when melee becomes fairly meaningless. SBS gets more than 3-4 spells known. That means they CAN take bits and bobs of utility from the utility heavy sorc/wis spell list.
Psiwars are going to have to spend feats to get some of the more utility focused powers, though this is a point in their favor because virtually any power is merely a single feat away.

[Zarvistic]

I think its pretty good as an archer sort of gish, great synergy with manyshot + slippers of battledancing and you won't need many spells known.

[Godofallu]

Plan currently is Stalwart Battle Sorcerer with Sewerm Familiar.

Feats
Flaw, Flaw- Precosious apprentice-Alter Self, Lost tradition- Con to Spells
1-Enspell Familiar
3-
6-
9-Miser with magic

I have yet to figure out the missing feats, race+templates or spells. I do think I will shy away from all PRC's. Abjurant Champion is good but that PRC is best with shield + Luminous armor and I doubt I would have either of those on the spell list.

I'll be looking for some knowstones or Drake Helm play since we play in Eberron. Interestingly I wonder if you can just buy your own Siberys shards for the helm and get them enchanted yourself for less than the listed cost. Because listed cost is very high for the spell gems.

Weapon will probably be a greatsword and maybe power attack at lvl 3. Issue with power attack is a lot of alter self and polymorph forms have many natural attacks which power attack ruins. So maybe a great club or other two handed blunt weapon for mighty wallop fun. Undecided.

[Fouredged Sword]

Plan currently is Stalwart Battle Sorcerer with Sewerm Familiar.

Feats
Flaw, Flaw- Precosious apprentice-Alter Self, Lost tradition- Con to Spells
1-Enspell Familiar
3-
6-
9-Miser with magic

I have yet to figure out the missing feats, race+templates or spells. I do think I will shy away from all PRC's. Abjurant Champion is good but that PRC is best with shield + Luminous armor and I doubt I would have either of those on the spell list.

I'll be looking for some knowstones or Drake Helm play since we play in Eberron. Interestingly I wonder if you can just buy your own Siberys shards for the helm and get them enchanted yourself for less than the listed cost. Because listed cost is very high for the spell gems.

Weapon will probably be a greatsword and maybe power attack at lvl 3. Issue with power attack is a lot of alter self and polymorph forms have many natural attacks which power attack ruins. So maybe a great club or other two handed blunt weapon for mighty wallop fun. Undecided.

Shield is a spell you pick up as a spell known around level 7. It's a solid AC buff that becomes a swift action with abjurant champion, so it's basically a free way to use your swift action while charging into combat.

You are going to be wearing real armor, so mage armor / luminous armor are not needed.

As for weapons, I would point you in the direction of the heavy flail. Bludgeoning weapons are better for being viable targets for mighty wallop/greater mighty wallop. 2d8 19-20x2 is a solid damage base, and greater mighty wallop is an all day buff that could take it to 3d8 or higher as you level.