Why no evil dwarves?

[Storm Bringer]

Is it me, or are genuine, outright evil dwarves a real rarity in campgain settings? Off hand, I can think of a grand total of two major settings that have evil dwaves, niether of them part of DND:

1) Warhammers chaos dwarves, with a sumerian theme (and hats as big as they are)

and

2) Guild Wars, where the xenophobic dwarves form the mook brigades in the games winterland.

in every other well known setting i can name, the dwarven culture is always a paragon of lawful good behavior. I struggle to think of any dwarven culture that is evil in the way drow are evil. There is the duergar, but they appear to be unfailingly self centered netural.

hell, i can't even think of a single memorable evil dwarf, let along a culture.


what is it about dwarveness that makes them so infallibly good alinged?

[SoD]

It's some sort of conspiricy! They slip something into the Ale, I tell you...THE ALE!!!!!

[Keld Denar]

Ummmm...core D&D has both Derro and Duergar. Derro tend to be very chaotic and almost exclusively evil. Their more powerful cousins, duergar, tend more toward law, forming a rather mock dwarven culture similar to drow. Fear a pre-combat enlarged deurgar strike team suddenly coming out of invisibility around you, hitting you from all sides, properly reinforced by a duergar battle-cleric. Their racial spell-like abilities put drow to shame as far as combat usefulness.

I dunno about any other settings, but both of these races are pretty core to D&D, as far back as 1st or 2nd edition.

[-Cor-]

what is it about dwarveness that makes them so infallibly good alinged?

Work ethic?

Obsessive compulsive stoicism?

Santa Claus Beards?

[Mr. Friendly]

See Duergar (AKA Gray Dwarves)

For literature involving them, see Streams of Silver and other Drizzt novels. They are typically found enslaved to or working for more powerful evil stuff.

[hobbitguy1420]

I think it may be because, in the literature the archetypal dwarf was drawn from (Lord of the Rings and its ilk) the Dwarves are part of the League of Really Good Guys trying to stop That One Bad Guy And His Minions. There are exceptions, even within associated literature (there're nasty dwarves in the Silmarillion, for example), but they tend to be the exception, rather than the rule.

'Sides, if the culture were evil, the Dwarves wouldn't be as viable as a player race (as the game seems to have been built with the assumption that most parties will be good or neutral).

[Ralfarius]

Traditional Scandinavian mythology has dwarves as not necessarily evil, but very vindictive and often shady individuals. They craft all the best weapons and other items, live underground, and collect wealth. However, cross one and you'll have a curse on you that'll end with your entire family killing each other down to the last generation.

Also, Dueregar and Derro. They're extremely prominent in any setting with an Underdark (i.e. where all the evil humanoids live).

[Swordguy]

Amusingly, before Tolkein, Dwarves in literature were almost unfailingly evil - or at least heavily neutral greedy (Snow White being a major, major exception). See the the Ring Cycle for more detail.

[Toliudar]

I'd also refer you to the Scarred Lands setting, and the enslaving-and-warmaking Charduni dwarves.

Evil dwarves have a VERY long folkloric tradition, going back (at least) to Alberich in the Norse/Wagnerian Siegfried saga. In D&D terms, the dark side of all dwarves is represented by Laduguer, the god of greed, gold-lust and other things that make you snigger and rub your hands together.

[Morty]

The best way is to throw the racial alignments out of the window and never think about them again. Seriously, alignment system is preety bad when applied to individuals, but when it's applied to whole races it's ridiculous. After getting rid of it, DM can actually make dwarven societies and individuals belivable.
As for why dwarves are LG, I have no idea. Especially since dwarven stereotypes tend to present them like worst kind of either LN or CN.

[Larrin]

In computer game-land both Baldurs gate 2 and neverwinter nights 1 had evil dwarves, the BG2 one was a blood thirsty, wench bottom slapping, ale drinking murderer, very dwarfy, the NWN1 one was kind of not really a dwarflike evil dwarf.

RA salvatore has a nicely evil dwarf, Athrogate, that shows up in the sellword trilogy.

Evil dwarves are bawdy drunkards that kill things first and never even ask questions.

[Wraithy]

Dwarves are one of the major good aligned races in the game, like elves. unlike elves however, they have far fewer people who play them.
Dwarven characters tend to either be archetypal (sorry about the spellig) clerics of *insert dwarven patron deity here*, or characters that go against the grain, eg: the many dwarven rogues that can be found if you look hard enough, this type of character is generally made quite lovable to make up for their non-traditional proffession (so basically you get a halfling dwarf).
So in the end you get the people who want to play a proper traditional dwarf, and the people who think they are being different by playing dwarven halflings, leaving very few people who play as dwarves left over to occupy all of the remaining dwarven characters that could be played.
In the end, evil dwarves have to fight over miniscule table scaps with all of the unmentioned dwarf characters, the odds just aren't in their favour.

[Sleet]

Dragonlance has a couple of evil dwarf subraces, the... uh... Klar, I think is the name of one, and there are at least one or two others.

[Roderick_BR]

It's some sort of conspiricy! They slip something into the Ale, I tell you...THE ALE!!!!!

Yeah, more alcohol
The bastards are usually too drunk to think about being evil!

Technically, there's very few evil elves other than drows, also. And evil halflings or gnomes? Unheard of (I really scared my party with an evil assassin halflling npc once.... lol)

[Azerian Kelimon]

There's always Jerren for evil halflings. Those + Vashar = Evil races full of win.

[Alex12]

The best way is to throw the racial alignments out of the window and never think about them again. Seriously, alignment system is preety bad when applied to individuals, but when it's applied to whole races it's ridiculous. After getting rid of it, DM can actually make dwarven societies and individuals belivable.
As for why dwarves are LG, I have no idea. Especially since dwarven stereotypes tend to present them like worst kind of either LN or CN.

We just play that culture can nurture evil over good, but the ultimate choice is up to the individual.
On a side note, mindless undead should be TN (as we play), and sentient undead have as much choice as any living being of the same intelligence. NEGATIVE ENERGY ISN'T EVIL, DAMMIT!

[Azerian Kelimon]

According to the PHB, it is.

[Toliudar]

Evil halflings? How about the Dark Sun setting (shudder).

[Closet_Skeleton]

Evil dwarves have a VERY long folkloric tradition, going back (at least) to Alberich in the Norse/Wagnerian Siegfried saga. In D&D terms, the dark side of all dwarves is represented by Laduguer, the god of greed, gold-lust and other things that make you snigger and rub your hands together.

Alberich as an evil Dwarf was invented by Richard Wagner in 1848. He isn't even in the Volsung Saga.

[Alex12]

According to the PHB, it is.

Perhaps I should rephrase that. Negative energy shouldn't be evil. It's just a form of energy that happens to animate certain types of creatures and be harmful to other kinds.

[Azerian Kelimon]

Agreed on that. Negative energy SHOULDN'T be evil, no other energy gets that distinction, and for a reason.

[Swooper]

Dwarves are one of the major good aligned races in the game, like elves. unlike elves however, they have far fewer people who play them.

I beg to differ - I remember taking part in very, very few games that had no dwarf PC (and occasionally we've had two), but elves are much rarer in my group. And then, it's usually me playing the elf. Of course, that might not be the norm, but that's what I'm used to.

On the alignment of dwarves, I've always seen them as the LN types as a whole rather than LG. Individuals, of course, tend to be anything from LG to TN, but as a norm they're LN.

Evil dwarves exist, as others have pointed out, but both Duergar and Derro are really underused most of the time because they live very deep underground, or in the Underdark if the setting has one. And players don't go there very often.

Now I must put a duergar villain in my next campaign...

[Mordokai]

Herein be spoilers.

'Nuff said.

[Toliudar]

Alberich as an evil Dwarf was invented by Richard Wagner in 1848. He isn't even in the Volsung Saga.

Thanks, CS! I learn new things every day.

[Inyssius Tor]

Perhaps I should rephrase that. Negative energy shouldn't be evil. It's just a form of energy that happens to animate certain types of creatures and be harmful to other kinds.

Ah, I love the Tome of Necromancy. It's just so cool.


As for evil dwarves: hm. Are there any actual options for the derro or duergar--like the kuo-toa stuff in the MMV? Because it seems like an evil race of dwarves, as the actual villains instead of just short mooks for the real villains, would be pretty awesome if it had any details.

[....]

Anyone else think that the Duregar are GIANT dwarves?

Just stop a moment and think about it.

Giant dwarves.

Giant invisible dwarves.

[InfiniteMiller]

Dark Iron dwarves from Warcraft are evil. Enemies to both the Alliance and Horde. And the world around them generally.

[BRC]

Dark Iron dwarves from Warcraft are evil. Enemies to both the Alliance and Horde. And the world around them generally.

ACtually, though they have been evil for awhile, they are enslaved by ragnaros.

[Inyssius Tor]

ACtually, though they have been evil for awhile, they are enslaved by ragnaros.

Y'see that? Short mooks, I tell ya!

[Arioch]

If dwarves were evil, the trees would get them.

While we're on the subject of dwarf stereotypes, why are dwarves always Scottish (or what directors and game designers think is scottish)?
Humans have different accents, but all dwarves can understand one another perfectly, even if from different worlds, because they speak the same language with the same accent.