The D&D Rail Gun

[kentma57]

While rather unusual it is not all that unlikely in the D&D world. Magic can be used to melt down and craft most metals, and you could simply bind an elemental for a power source. The question is what kind of stats should it get...

EDIT: You would probably have to have a permanent spell, or another elamental to stop it from over heating.

[StickMan]

While rather unusual it is not all that unlikely in the D&D world. Magic can be used to melt down and craft most metals, and you could simply bind an elemental for a power source. The question is what kind of stats should it get...

EDIT: You would probably have to have a permanent spell, or another elamental to stop it from over heating.

I would have it deal 2d6-2d8 damage range 18-20/x4, 200 ft range incressment, Huge weapon so it needs a platform to work on. Might add fire damage to represent the heatedness of the thing. I'd say id cost about 5,500 GP minimum.

[EldritchExMachina]

We're talking about a rail gun here.

Insert a ridiculous amount of damage with a x3 critical.

[Nerd-o-rama]

I wouldn't be surprised to see someone invent this in Eberron using Air or Storm elementals, seeing as they already have a MagLev train (lol magic trainz). Regular spells probably couldn't manage it, since they deal very little with magnetism.

A pair of very large Khyber shards on either side of an armature/barrel assembly could do it. It'd have to be a siege weapon, probably one die size and let's say two dice numbers up from the heavy gunpowder bombards they have in FR, and a very long range increment. In the real world, railguns are designed for hitting things in the next country.

I can picture Lyrandar mounting one of these on a particularly huge Stormship, and calling it the Thunder Cannon. And then taking over the Lhazzar Principalities with it. Or possibly, it's Merrix d'Cannith's latest wacky supervillain scheme.

[Jack Zander]

I would have it deal 2d6-2d8 damage range 18-20/x4, 200 ft range incressment, Huge weapon so it needs a platform to work on. Might add fire damage to represent the heatedness of the thing. I'd say id cost about 5,500 GP minimum.

What are those stats for? A handheld mini version?

Heavy catapults deal 6d6 damage. Ballistas deal 3d8. I'm going to make up a number and say 10d8 with a X4 crit. Range would be 500 ft or more. I'd make the cost based on the spells used to create the thing. Some sort of gravity spell, wall of iron for the construction and ammunition, and whatever spell lets you bind elementals (gate?).

[StickMan]

What are those stats for? A handheld mini version?

Heavy catapults deal 6d6 damage. Ballistas deal 3d8. I'm going to make up a number and say 10d8 with a X4 crit. Range would be 500 ft or more. I'd make the cost based on the spells used to create the thing. Some sort of gravity spell, wall of iron for the construction and ammunition, and whatever spell lets you bind elementals (gate?).

Yes and you have to take more than one round to reload both of Ballistas and Catapults. This how ever this is an autofire like crazy weapon. And to be honest I would rather get hit by a Rail gun shot that a Catapult boulder. I personaly thing your dealing with an issue of scale. Its going to hurt less (Relative term) getting hit by a single shot from a rail gun that it is to have a balista bolt or bolder hit you. Getting hit by a large number of shots how ever would be devastating. The Rail gun should however have the ability to by pass armor, hardness and damage reduction anything other than adamantie should become swiss cheese I think.


Also are you basing this off real world Rail Gun or a video game/tv type thing?

3d8 damage may be appropriate but I think your over doing it by a lot if you go 10d8.

I suggest you look at what D20 modern has written up for it I'm sure they have a Rail gun in one of the books. Just for scale an M2A2 Bradley 25mm cannon does 4d12 damage and an M1A2 Abrams tank cannon, the mother of all heavy tank weapons, deals 10d12 damage a single shot from a rail gun is not going to be that close to that tank blast.

[Cuddly]

All you need is a few million commoners....

[Jack Zander]

I was basing it off of real world railguns and as such it was intended to be a siege weapon. Last time I checked you could only fire those once a round and they took time to reload.

You think a boulder is going to deal more damage than a large chuck of metal flying at incredible speeds? Have you ever taken a physics class?

And a railgun should deal more than any tank blast. Are you sure you know what a railgun is?

[Cuddly]

Yes and you have to take more than one round to reload both of Ballistas and Catapults. This how ever this is an autofire like crazy weapon. And to be honest I would rather get hit by a Rail gun shot that a Catapult boulder. I personaly thing your dealing with an issue of scale. Its going to hurt less (Relative term) getting hit by a single shot from a rail gun that it is to have a balista bolt or bolder hit you. Getting hit by a large number of shots how ever would be devastating. The Rail gun should however have the ability to by pass armor, hardness and damage reduction anything other than adamantie should become swiss cheese I think.


Also are you basing this off real world Rail Gun or a video game/tv type thing?

3d8 damage may be appropriate but I think your over doing it by a lot if you go 10d8.

I suggest you look at what D20 modern has written up for it I'm sure they have a Rail gun in one of the books. Just for scale an M2A2 Bradley 25mm cannon does 4d12 damage and an M1A2 Abrams tank cannon, the mother of all heavy tank weapons, deals 10d12 damage a single shot from a rail gun is not going to be that close to that tank blast.

Actually, the hydrostatic shock from being struck by aluminum traveling at those speeds would burst your heart and make your brain hemorrhage.

[Closet_Skeleton]

d20 future's railguns are crap (bottom of the table http://ca.geocities.com/spike_fightw...l7.html#ranged) and pretty flavourless.

That's the only officialy stated railgun. Nobody at Wizards can be a fan of them.

Then there's always the million commoners and a quarterstaff railgun.

Yes and you have to take more than one round to reload both of Ballistas and Catapults. This how ever this is an autofire like crazy weapon.

Not really, a railgun has no reason to make it autofire. You can't even use standard automatic fire with one since it has no recoil. Autofire is pretty pointless with a railgun since nothing could survive one shot.

One shot from either a railgun or a ballista would kill you. No buts.

[Blue_C.]

Yes and you have to take more than one round to reload both of Ballistas and Catapults. This how ever this is an autofire like crazy weapon. And to be honest I would rather get hit by a Rail gun shot that a Catapult boulder. I personaly thing your dealing with an issue of scale. Its going to hurt less (Relative term) getting hit by a single shot from a rail gun that it is to have a balista bolt or bolder hit you. Getting hit by a large number of shots how ever would be devastating. The Rail gun should however have the ability to by pass armor, hardness and damage reduction anything other than adamantie should become swiss cheese I think.


Also are you basing this off real world Rail Gun or a video game/tv type thing?

3d8 damage may be appropriate but I think your over doing it by a lot if you go 10d8.

I suggest you look at what D20 modern has written up for it I'm sure they have a Rail gun in one of the books. Just for scale an M2A2 Bradley 25mm cannon does 4d12 damage and an M1A2 Abrams tank cannon, the mother of all heavy tank weapons, deals 10d12 damage a single shot from a rail gun is not going to be that close to that tank blast.

The prototype railguns fire at rates of kilometers per second. There are issues with rail life, as the heat generated by fire any size projectile is enough to tear up the rails themselves, but they can fire. The damage of these guns is compared to that of cruise missiles, not cannon fire.

So, given magic's ability to work around the laws of physics, I think artificed railgun is going to beat a tank blast.

Edit: @Closet Skeleton. I think those rail guns are handheld versions, like a coilgun.

[Jack Zander]

Actually, the hydrostatic shock from being struck by aluminum traveling at those speeds would burst your heart and make your brain hemorrhage.

That and even if it misses a person (who the hell would fire a railgun at a person anyway?) if the projectile is close enough to the target the wind blast will rip their flesh and knock them over anyway.

[Closet_Skeleton]

Apparently I was slightly wrong about that being the only railgun as these two mecha weapons exist:

M-300 RHINO MASS CANNON (PL 7)

LT-5 LONGSHOT MASS DRIVER (PL 8)

Niether are electromagnetic, the first one works in the same retard techobabble way as the official "railgun" and the second is just a nondescript mass driver. You can find stats here (http://ca.geocities.com/spike_fightw...remecheq2.html) but they're not that useful.

[Jack Zander]

All you need is a few million commoners....

True, but that railgun only deals 1d6 damage.

[StickMan]

I was basing it off of real world railguns and as such it was intended to be a siege weapon. Last time I checked you could only fire those once a round and they took time to reload.

You think a boulder is going to deal more damage than a large chuck of metal flying at incredible speeds? Have you ever taken a physics class?

And a railgun should deal more than any tank blast. Are you sure you know what a railgun is?

OK yes a rail gun is going to have a incredibly great deal more physical force that a catapult your totally right there. How ever that is not the same as damage. I get hit by a Rail Gun odds are I'm dead yes and there is a large hole in me some were, I get hit by a Catapult odd are I'm dead and flat as a pancake. That for me is the difference in damage. However like I said the Rail gun should by pass a lot/all hardness, armor, and damage reduction which a catapult does not do, also I should keep going and kill more stuff behind me. Also I'm basing this off of more recently in testing fast firing Railguns but many up till now have only been slow fire so you are correct.


Now if we really want to talk up to date, still in testing, Railgun tec, lets talk about the Rail gun that converts its ammo to plasma the US military has been working on. That I'd say deals as much damage as you want cause well its plasma, kinda breaks the game however .

[Cuddly]

Can you imagine that in game though?

"Something streaks at you- all you hear is a thumping noise as the air splits with such force that it lacerates your flesh. (everyone here takes 4 damage). You turn back to see Hrothgar collapse, a hole through his chest the size of your fist. His eyes and ears bleed."


"What trickery is this, magician!?"

[Nerd-o-rama]

Apparently I was slightly wrong about that being the only railgun as these two mecha weapons exist:

M-300 RHINO MASS CANNON (PL 7)

LT-5 LONGSHOT MASS DRIVER (PL 8)

Niether are electromagnetic, the first one works in the same retard techobabble way as the official "railgun" and the second is just a nondescript mass driver. You can find stats here (http://ca.geocities.com/spike_fightw...remecheq2.html) but they're not that useful.

There's starship weapons too, but yeah they all suck. Actually, compared to starship HP, all of their weapons are pretty damn ineffectual, except for a few of the mines. But I digress.

Hm. Perhaps a railgun should deal physical damage in a (very long) line, reflex for none, rather than being an attack roll? With the ability to go through objects it destroys, like a Lightning Bolt spell. I mean, it'll cut through pretty much anything pre-modern like it was cheese.

V Edit ninja'd

[Jack Zander]

Can you imagine that in game though?

"Something streaks at you- all you hear is a thumping noise as the air splits with such force that it lacerates your flesh. (everyone here takes 4 damage). You turn back to see Hrothgar collapse, a hole through his chest the size of your fist. His eyes and ears bleed."


"What trickery is this, magician!?"

Freakin' awesome.

And yes Stickman, railguns should deal area damage in a line similar to lightning bolt. But I disagree that railguns should bypass DR and harness. Only energy weapons should have that ability. A railgun (not these newfangled plasma cannons) are still just a really big chunk of metal and the reason they bypass DR and harness is simply from the massive amount of damage they deal, not any special ability. If a material was hard/thick enough, it could stop a railgun projectile. I dunno if we have any material like that in the real world though.

[Xefas]

"Something streaks at you- all you hear is a thumping noise as the air splits with such force that it lacerates your flesh. (everyone here takes 4 damage). You turn back to see Hrothgar collapse, a hole through his chest the size of your fist. His eyes and ears bleed."

"What trickery is this, magician!?"

The only people who would say that are those with wisdom as a dump stat.

Everyone else is already running away.

[Closet_Skeleton]

There's starship weapons too, but yeah they all suck. Actually, compared to starship HP, all of their weapons are pretty damn ineffectual, except for a few of the mines. But I digress.

The Starship gargantuan railgun deals 6d12. d20 Future criticises tehm for having no explosive charge yet the scientific article I read said that once you get to the level of energy transferal you get in a useful railgun explosives don't increase the damage at all (partly because they would be atomised but even then it's a waste).

I get hit by a Rail Gun odds are I'm dead yes and there is a large hole in me some were, I get hit by a Catapult odd are I'm dead and flat as a pancake. That for me is the difference in damage.

No. You just don't get it.

You get hit by a railgun, you do not get a hole in you. Your body is atomised.

The force of the collapsing Twin Towers (to use a not so palatable example) was enough to blast concrete into dust.

Arrows put holes in you. A bullet (from a firearm or a railgun) is not comparable to an arrow. An arrow has a sharpened head. A bullet is effectively blunt. You can stab yourself with an arrow, a bullet outside a gun is safe to sell on keychains. What does damage with bullets is pure transferal of force. Guns are infact energy weapons, the bullet just transfers the energy. When you get hit by a high callibre bullet, the bullet itself is just a malformed bit of lead that by itself is would hurt less than an elastic band. However the energy transferal liquifies your insides.

When you launch a projectile from a railgun, that projectile contains the energy you put into the railgun (minus any you wasted from inefficiency). You cannot compare being hit by a railgun slug to being hit by a stone since that slug can easily have the same energy as a lightning bolt. Being hit by such a weapon is more like being hit by a lightning bolt.

[StickMan]

Honestly I'm just trying to make things work in DND terms. I mean if we want to be realistic basically any thing a Rail Gun hits in the DND universe should just die. Maybe the largest of Red Dragons would not, can't be sure here but, for the most part you hit something with a real world railgun its gone I know. You don't need to explain how a Railgun works I basic physics, but like I said real world does not translate to fantasy world.

[Jack Zander]

Honestly I'm just trying to make things work in DND terms. I mean if we want to be realistic basically any thing a Rail Gun hits in the DND universe should just die. Maybe the largest of Red Dragons would not, can't be sure here but, for the most part you hit something with a real world railgun its gone I know. You don't need to explain how a Railgun works I basic physics, but like I said real world does not translate to fantasy world.

Sounds like you need to get a new fantasy world mechanics, or learn how DnD mechanics mirror the real world then.

[StickMan]

Sounds like you need to get a new fantasy world mechanics, or learn how DnD mechanics mirror the real world then.

Um not at all? My favorite example just look at archery in the game, its the most unrealistic thing every. Mechanics and real life don't add up in DND every. Most things are abstract at best (Example the HP system). How about the Commoner Rail Gun yea thats how the real world works.

[Jack Zander]

Um not at all? My favorite example just look at archery in the game, its the most unrealistic thing every. Mechanics and real life don't add up in DND every. Most things are abstract at best (Example the HP system). How about the Commoner Rail Gun yea thats how the real world works.

Glitches are true of any system. As for the archery thing, only past level 6 can you fire 3 shots in under 6 seconds, and that's getting into superhero physics then.

HP is not abstract.
Relative HP may be though. For example, an attack that does 5 damage to a level 1 fighter is a nice wound, but to a level 5 fighter tis merely a scratch as he was able to roll with the blow. If you actually break the system down (not taking into account glitches) you'll find it does a damn good job of realism for most things. And damage happens to be one of those them.

[StickMan]

Glitches are true of any system. As for the archery thing, only past level 6 can you fire 3 shots in under 6 seconds, and that's getting into superhero physics then.

Being able to fire more than once in a round is insane a good archer in the real world would have a hard time firing more than one in 6 seconds with any degree of accuracy. Also look at the Range on a long bow, if you have ever in your life fired a bow you know that your not accurate out to 100ft. You sure as heck don't have any chance to hit at 300ft, in DND you have a good chance, if I take 20 shots at some thing 1000ft away from me I'm not going to hit it unless its a barn.

Relative HP may be though. For example, an attack that does 5 damage to a level 1 fighter is a nice wound, but to a level 5 fighter tis merely a scratch as he was able to roll with the blow. If you actually break the system down (not taking into account glitches) you'll find it does a damn good job of realism for most things. And damage happens to be one of those them.

How is that not abstract? That seems like the definition of an abstract system to me


Science and DND don't ever mix, yes some times the guys at wizards do something right but over all its just a game it does not have to be realistic and its not. We can talk about physics, Biology, what ever and I can give you examples of how unreal DND is but that is to be expected when your wizard character is telling the laws of physics to sit down and shut up.

[Jack Zander]

I guess most people do not take rapid shot as their first level feat then. Makes sense to me. If you aren't skilled (read proficient) with a bow you don't have a good chance of hitting things farther away. Also, most bows people use today are shortbows. Longbows are massive.

If 'having more HP means being able to roll with blows better' is abstract to you, what's your definition of concrete? It's like having a higher BAB means you are more accurate.

[MagFlare]

I thought the D&D equivalent of a railgun was a line of 1st level commoners, each of which has prepared a (free!) action to pass a spear from the person behind him to the person in front of him. The distance the spear travels in one round is limited only by the number of people in the line - and while I'm no physicist and therefore unable to comment authoritatively on things like friction coefficients, it occurs to me that the person at the end of the line should probably be wearing some sort of gloves.

[Jack Zander]

I thought the D&D equivalent of a railgun was a line of 1st level commoners, each of which has prepared a (free!) action to pass a spear from the person behind him to the person in front of him. The distance the spear travels in one round is limited only by the number of people in the line - and while I'm no physicist and therefore unable to comment authoritatively on things like friction coefficients, it occurs to me that the person at the end of the line should probably be wearing some sort of gloves.

I think cuddly covered that for you already.

[Jayabalard]

A Glitter Boy's Boom gun deals 4d6 MDC; that sounds about right to me.

[Zeal]

Can you imagine that in game though?

"Something streaks at you- all you hear is a thumping noise as the air splits with such force that it lacerates your flesh. (everyone here takes 4 damage). You turn back to see Hrothgar collapse, a hole through his chest the size of your fist. His eyes and ears bleed."


"What trickery is this, magician!?"

But really, who would be shooting Beowulf with a railgun anyways?