What's the most important quality in a BBEG?

[Talic]

A lot of people design their BBEG's in different ways, and everyone has their own idea on what makes a truly memorable villain. My question is, what's are the important qualities in a multi-session boss? Feel free to give examples from your current campaigns to illustrate the qualities you bring to the table.


For me? The casual disregard for others. Whether it's a minion, a partner, an enemy, or a small town downriver from his leaky poison factory, the true villain doesn't care about the consequences of his actions, as long as they don't affect his own personal goals.

[Bag_of_Holding]

Being Big, Bad AND Evil.

[squishycube]

The BBEG should inspire some kind of negative emotion in the PC's. She can be disgusting to look at, be very frightening (this one can be very hard to pull of), do things truly vile and wicked (instead of just wanting to get power), etc.

For an evil party facing a BBEG this works to, maybe with other emotions (fear still works, obviously), jealousy is a good one

[Talic]

The BBEG should inspire some kind of negative emotion in the PC's. She can be disgusting to look at, be very frightening (this one can be very hard to pull of), do things truly vile and wicked (instead of just wanting to get power), etc.

For an evil party facing a BBEG this works to, maybe with other emotions (fear still works, obviously), jealousy is a good one

Oh, most certainly. Evil can very easily be convinced to fight evil... All the BBEG needs to is interfere with the evil group's plans. Even accidentally.

[Diakos]

Self loathing is one of the most unpleseant feeligns around, so if the antagonist, can invoke that in them, make them draw parrallels between them and he antagonist, or even better manipulating them into doing his/her "dirty work", than s/he is sure to earn their antagonism.

For maximum efficiency if you know a really good experienced RP'er, make him join the group either at start or somewhat and then after several big events, have him betray them, possibly having planted evidence to make them seem guilty of crimes, tuning the authortities/citizens against them and ideally themselves against each other.

That gives a lot of tension and loathing towards the antagonist (maybe even have him be manipulated from further up...)

[stainboy]

Presence. The most memorable BBEGs are the ones whose presence is felt throughout the game, not just the guy you know is going to be in the last room of the last dungeon sublevel. You don't have to have him constantly show up to taunt the party, but his personal touch should be evident throughout the story. The PCs should know his methods, his motivations, and at least a little of his personality before the final confrontation.

The archvillian is the closest thing the DM gets to a PC, and the challenge is expressing his character without having him in the room most of the time.


Oh, and crunch-whise, he should be immune to every save-or-die ability, save-or-suck ability, and cheap spell combo the party has access to, as well as being protected or out of reach to the point that the party's damage dealers can't just burn him down in a round or two. His tactics should be threatening without relying on abilities that quickly kill or incapacitate party members and thus remove them from the fight early. Every character should have an opportunity to contribute to the fight in a unique way.

[Fuzzy_Juan]

The capability to hold their own against the PC's...without that, he may be bad and evil...but not really 'big.

Goals that are far reaching in scope...things that require many minions to accomplish, lots of intrugue. Without that, it is not a multi-session vilian since he will reveal himself right away and likely get stomped unless vastly superior to the PC's.

A damn good reason for said goals...without a reason, the BBEG is just a random lunatic...with nothing really bad or evil, just inconvenient. The terrasque is big, and very 'bad' in the sense that it will destroy and devour everything...but it is not malicious, nor does it give a rat's ass what it does so long as it feeds. It is a force of nature, no more 'evil' than a hurricane...it simply is. It doesn't have to have a sensible reason...BBEG often have an overdeveloped sense of revenge and take disproportionate revenge for even the slightest insults...like deciding to eradicate an entire race because 2 guys of that race picked on him as a kid and he always wanted revenge...

Try to avoid 'glass cannons' like Babylon 5's Cartagia...he was bad...insane...evil...he had purpose...a grand psychotic design that would allow for the world to burn for his own ascention to godhood (in his own mind). But he was just a schmuk in the end...If Vir can kill him alone...it just is pretty lame...While it can be 'fun' to have the real mastermind be a 1st level commoner with a silver tounge and delusions of grandeur...in a DnD world, this just means that no matter what beefy people follow him or protect him, he is just dead...and fast too.

Someone who is a BBEG must inspire fear and terror in those who oppose him...and in those who follow him. And not just the PC's...but the players. They must be truely horrified of what might happen if they continue opposing this guy. maybe not just because of the BBEG alone, but of the power and minions he has at his disposal....moving against this person should be a daunting feat which must be carefully done to avoid being squashed or overrun.

(In a Council of Wyrms game in 2nd ed DnD...the BBEG I created was a dragon named Flashfire, a bastard homebrew half red-half blue dragon (how I hated when they called him purple...he was striped damnit! ) The story was that this dragon was cast away when he was born as an abomination but he survived and returned to take over. His immunities and unique dual nature alowed him immunity to the two strongest dragon's breath and also allowed him to combine lightning and fire in a single blast of immense power. Even though he wasn't a great wyrm, his 'flashfire' was strong enough to floor any dragon who was not red or blue...Also, due to his red heritage, blue couldn't stand against him and niether could reds due to the blue in him...later it was revealed that he had started his own dragon eugenics program where his followers would cross breed and with the aid of magics try and ensure more hybrid dragon offspring...(all to bring the dragon races closer to Tiamat and IO). The players were a few dragon PC's and a couple of Dragon Slayer PC's who had to team up and stop his plans since if left unchecked it looked like he would take over all the chromatics and then who knows what the crossbred evil dragons would do to the good dragons. It was a grand battle of the old guard against the young dragons (many young dragons joined since hybrid dragons could typically defeat much older dragons...they wanted to make their heirs stronger than the elders who would be in power forever otherwise in the era of current peace)

The real kicker was (according to my backstory for him) that Flashfire had survived by polymorphing into an elven form and joined the dragonslayers, learning from them and studying wizardry as well...when the PC's and their helpers finally faced off against Flashfire...it was against his elite core of adult hybrids, his red dragon mate, 5 fairly high level humanoid 'slaves' and Him...all who had recieved dragonslayer training...it was brutal...but awesome...

[CASTLEMIKE]

Generating experience points by dying or being defeated so the PCs gain experience along with treasure. A memorable BBEG is frosting on the cake.

[Tyrmatt]

Cutting it close. When the PC's drive him off, leave them within an inch of their life and have him depart with a soul splitting scream and the promise to get them and their little dog too. No one remembers a battle where they walked all over the enemy, nor do they remember a crushing defeat. A narrow victory by a razor thin margin where skill or luck won the day is a truly lasting victory.

[warmachine]

For me, the BBEG must believe he's doing good rather than out of selfishness. It's just that his methods or philosophy are atrocious. For example, Redcloak is fighting for his downtrodden race. Or Magneto from X-Men who forms the Brotherhood of Mutants. The lieutenants believe in this cause too, fight hard for it and have answers for the PC's accusations.

[Telonius]

He's gotta be evil, and he's gotta do it with style. He's gotta be, not just badass, but really badass.

[Kompera]

A lot of people design their BBEG's in different ways, and everyone has their own idea on what makes a truly memorable villain. My question is, what's are the important qualities in a multi-session boss? Feel free to give examples from your current campaigns to illustrate the qualities you bring to the table.

A slow unfolding of understanding for the players. Drama, suspense. The first interactions between the players and the more epic BBEGs doesn't even require that the players see or learn of the BBEG. They only need to have enough information to put it together somewhere in the middle, a la "Hey! Remember the smuggling ring we busted up 8 sessions ago? Well, one of the smugglers said <foo>, and we saw some <bar> in their lair. That must mean that the guy we're after now was their organizer!" Or something to that effect.

And the truly epic story arcs are definitely "multi-session" Bosses.

[Reinboom]

Not actually evil.
Really.
I don't like playing with alignments. It makes for some really interesting BB'E'Gs.
Just has a different goal from the party that the party may or may not exactly agree to.
Oh, and multiple BB'E'Gs helps in this. Let the party choose who is more evil.


For the encounter itself? They should be designed in such a way as to test all of their abilities. Something that allows every character to shine.

[TimeWizard]

I for one am incredibly against "I'm a crazy psycho with no care or sympathy for anything, so let's kill 'em all, mwahahaha" because it's cheesy and nobody really gives a damn. It's like a villian cop out. Memorable characters are defined by the perfect flaws- why is the BBEG doing this? Maybe he doesn't want to, but he has to for reason outside his control (i.e. to stop the ascent of an even greater BBEG for long running campaigns/ dead wife/ or the trite but tried and true revenge). Really, Kefka was cool in Final Fantasy 6, but crazy psychos make much better lieutenents or enforcers then they do BBEGs. Let's try the Simple Story Well Told approach to the villian X.

• X the Villian
• What is X's past before s/he turned evil?
• Why did X turn evil?
• Was anyone else involved?
• What is the main flaw of X?
• Now that X is evil, what are X's immeadiate goals?
• What does X consider to be his/her final goal?
• What other things does X need to accomplish the final goal?
• How many risks does X take? Is X a chessmaster villian knowing every move the PC's make in advance, or does X like to gamble with plans and try to speed up his/her final goal?
• How does X react when PC's screw up his plan? Furious anger or cold calculation?
• Does X fight his/her own battles? Why?
• What ends would X go to to save his failing plan? Outsiders?
• What do you want the PC's to feel when they think about X? Hatred? Betrayal? Sorrow?

The best villians have some characteristic people can identify with, some impulse or weakness that they feel in their own lives.

[Jayabalard]

believability. Realistic motivations, goals, strengths, flaws, etc.

[Saph]

I think squishycube nailed it. Ability to inspire negative emotions, the big ones being fear and anger. You want the PCs to hate the guy's guts, but also be terrified of him.

I don't think good intentions, a long character backstory, or realistic motivations are important at all. If you make the BBEG scary enough, the PCs will be way too busy running away or fighting for their lives to ask themselves "Now, what does this guy really want?"

If you look at the most successful villains from books and movies, you usually find they're neither sympathetic nor well-intentioned. Sauron isn't made out to be a remotely sympathetic character in LotR. Darth Vader might have been well-intentioned once, but he isn't by the time of Episodes IV and V (and the Emperor never was). Sephiroth's an insane killer with delusions of godhood and yet one of the most popular game characters of all time. And the Xenomorphs from Alien can't even talk, much less express their motivations. Didn't hurt any of their successes as BBEGs.

- Saph

[Reinboom]

Following up to Saph's...
I think it actually might depend what type of campaign you are running - as well as mood.
Sauron makes a great villain.
Jon Irenicus from baldur's gate 2 wouldn't of done well for me at all if I didn't get intent, motives, etc. on the other hand.

[Falrin]

A Flaw that 'prevents' him from killing the PC's.

Arrogant: Nice for a starter. Attacks the PC's, but overestimùates his forces.

Sadistic: Makes a DM feel warm and fuzzy. Watching them suffer is more important then killing them, can go from relatives to 'dopplgangers serial killers'.

Agressive: Relatives ressurected, Dopplegangers killed. Send in to much without thought. Great for a 'tactical' PC-victory.

Deadly Calculated: What got him in his position takes over again. When going face to face he'll use deadly spells, Coup-de-grace without mercy and use his most vicious minions and abuse every weaknesses he can find.

[valadil]

Recurring - I know you said long lasting BBEG, but I wanted to emphasize this. I want my character to hate the same evil throughout the game. I've been in a bunch of games where you kill the bad guy, only to have it revealed that he was but a puppet and the real evil is another castle. Storywise you're much better off fighting one guy over and over.

Make it personal - In my first game ever I failed at giving the players a reason to hate the BBEG. When it came time for them to fight him they decided they should join him instead. I'm all for choice, but I wasn't prepared for this at the time.

Justifiably Evil - Sure you can have a being of pure evil that kills as easily as he breathes, but that's boring. I find characters like that are easily dismissed. I'd rather have something that the players can relate to, but is terribly misguided. Nobody ever sets out knowing that they're evil - in their own head all their actions are justified to their own idea of a greater good. Players will resent your BBEG more if he actually believes he's right.

[AKA_Bait]

Presence. The most memorable BBEGs are the ones whose presence is felt throughout the game, not just the guy you know is going to be in the last room of the last dungeon sublevel.

Agree. This is why having some signature thing, a tattoo on minions, a particular article of clothing, or some other style is massivley important. When the PC's are being screwed with they should know who is responsible.

Oh, and crunch-whise, he should be immune to every save-or-die ability, save-or-suck ability, and cheap spell combo the party has access to, as well as being protected or out of reach to the point that the party's damage dealers can't just burn him down in a round or two. His tactics should be threatening without relying on abilities that quickly kill or incapacitate party members and thus remove them from the fight early. Every character should have an opportunity to contribute to the fight in a unique way.

And this is why I love liches.

[Attilargh]

Being a Magnificent Bastard never hurts. See also the Villain tropes from TV Tropes.

[Emperor Demonking]

He should have something memorable about him. He should be smarter than the players.

Most of all he should iether be cool or magnificent.

[Prometheus]

Realistic Motive: Being evil for the sake of evil is not a good enough reason. Although harmful to the world, the BBEG should have a vision for the world that he controls. Most of the time this has been power, but has also been revenge, hatred, religious fanaticism, desire for immortality, communism, imperialism, order.'

Success: The most powerful BBEG must be successful at what he does, and loved by his allies for it. He must have some part of him that is absolutely an indispensable resource - making it all the worse when he doesn't use for the right side.

Complicated Combat: Whether it involves a slew of allies, a strange setting, homebrew abilities, or multiple forms (that have to be defeated consecutively), the battle should be long and present some unusual tricks to it. One had to be stopped before he flew to the ceiling and then transformed when defeated. Another moved so fast he could be anywhere as a five-foot step and had multiple arms with reach.

[Snadgeros]

A really good laugh and memorable personality. See: Kefka, A.K.A. The Best Villain Ever

[Lady Tialait]

I like BBEGs you feel pity for..and they know it!

Maldor Cyrenian Fallen Palidin who lost his palidanhood when he turned into a vampire.

Lady Misilus A powerful Wizardess who learned how to summon feinds to help her plauged contry and got turned into a Sucubus

things like that..the party (if good) will want to help them not kill them.that makes it harder

barring that I like the Means and power to distroy the party...and totally willing to do so.

[Seffbasilisk]

I prefer BBEG's that convince the PCs to work for them (either by pretending to be good, offering a good reward, training, etc etc) then turn on them when they fail to complete the task they were given (often when they find out all the details of the plot.)

[Kompera]

I don't think good intentions, a long character backstory, or realistic motivations are important at all. If you make the BBEG scary enough, the PCs will be way too busy running away or fighting for their lives to ask themselves "Now, what does this guy really want?"

They are. Or at least, they should be. The implacable evil dude is so one dimensional that it's cliche.

If you look at the most successful villains from books and movies, you usually find they're neither sympathetic nor well-intentioned. Sauron isn't made out to be a remotely sympathetic character in LotR. Darth Vader might have been well-intentioned once, but he isn't by the time of Episodes IV and V (and the Emperor never was).

Sauron is an example of an implacable and one dimensional BBEG. Darth Vader, in contrast, was a BBEG whose background and familial connections to the good guys led to his conversion to good right when it mattered the most.

I like my BBEGs to be like comic book villains rather than literature villains. The best villains in comic books are those who have some motivation other than simple destruction or evil doing.

The Silver Surfer: Forced into the role of Herald to Galactus. A good man with a good heart who had led Galactus to world after world for Galactus to feast upon. Heroes freed him from this destiny.

Magneto: An ultra powerful mutant who hates and wishes to destroy all humanity. Why? Because humanity has treated his kind with fear and loathing, and he wishes to champion their cause. Magneto would be a good substitute for many civil rights champions, were they to have had his power.

The examples can be endless...

Good villains love someone or something very much. A person, a country, a class of beings, a cause. These are not two dimensional villains. This love shapes their actions, and the heroes can possibly use this love to end a fight or change the actions of the villain.

[Lyinginbedmon]

I've had a couple of effective BBEGs. The first was Meredith Nussulheim, 1st High Maester of Grimdolf. She's a Pixie Loremaster, who specialises in the use of Telekinesis...on Small longswords of wounding...50 of them. Now, this isn't her only terrifying quality, she's also extremely emotionally messed up. She has relationship issues because she's pretty much a sadist, with the perspective that anything that isn't a threat is a potential new toy to do with as she pleases.

After that was the BroShaCho Trio, specifically their "face": Alabaster Bronislav. He wasn't exactly "evil, vile, and horrid" per say, in fact despite being a Blackguard Lich his aim was to take over the world to unite it and make it better. However, the players just kept on loathing him because inevitably they would get tangled up in his plans and be treated like puppets, he was really hated when he stole one of the players' mucho-expensive magically-enchanted boat.

[Moofaa]

I had a recurring telepath villian that the party was pretty much scared to death of.

Probably cause during one encounter he mind controlled another PC who was about to vent everyone out of the airlock of their own ship so they had to gun him down. (he did survive tho, I think)

They were trying to figure out what this guy was up to, since he had done some pretty evil things and apparently was trying to track down and kill the party.

Anyways, while exploring an abandoned ancient alien facility they ran into him in this lab room. He was undergoing some sort of brain surgery. They kill his bodygaurds without too much trouble when the main villain stands up. Now, the top of his skull had just been re-attached, and he wasn't obviously prepared for a fight. ( I actually didn't expect the PCs to be where they were at that time).

One of the players decided to rush forwards, kick him in the nuts, and shove him backwards over a table. And with their typical luck managed to roll 20s doing just that.

They could have finished him right there. Don't get me wrong, this guy was pretty strong but 5 PCs with heavy automatic weapons could easily have burned him down in a single round or two.

Apparently I did such a good job of making this guy frightening through my decriptions, they all turned tail and ran...

Best moment ever in one of my games I think.

[Saph]

Good villains love someone or something very much. A person, a country, a class of beings, a cause. These are not two dimensional villains. This love shapes their actions, and the heroes can possibly use this love to end a fight or change the actions of the villain.

What if you don't want the heroes to end the fight or change the villain's actions? Personally I find the "I'm a good guy really" villains much more cliched than the evil ones. It feels like the writer (or DM, in this case) is trying to preach to me. Listen, I know you spent ages creating this guy and I know you find his backstory really fascinating, but right now I'm much more concerned with the fact that he's trying to kill me!

This is the reason comic book villains get so silly after a while. Because the writers are so invested in keeping them around and making them tragic characters, they have to keep on coming up with convoluted and not-very-convincing reasons for the heroes to team up with them or let them go or put them on a bus, rather than just killing them off, even when it makes absolutely no sense. (So Magneto has just murdered another few thousand people and we've captured him? Let's put him back in prison, I'm sure there's no way he's going to escape a fifth time.)

- Saph