4e - Asking for the Giant's or any professional opinion!

[Mesfens]

Well, we have seen them all. Pro- 4e, anti- 4e, and anti-anti 4e threads. And we have seen bombardments and midnight assasinations by both sides of the argument.

Well, what about the Giant?

To quote the Forum Rules, "it's HIS sandbox, after all." So what's his opinion on this hotly debated topic?? Is he pro-, anti-, or just trying to avoid the flames? If you want to hear the Giant's opinion, or anyone else who has ever worked at WotC, post on this thread and add your support! Thank you!

PS: I hope I didn't break any forum rules by posting this, but I'm curious.

[Mr. Friendly]

Well, we have seen them all. Pro- 4e, anti- 4e, and anti-anti 4e threads. And we have seen bombardments and midnight assasinations by both sides of the argument.

Well, what about the Giant?

To quote the Forum Rules, "it's HIS sandbox, after all." So what's his opinion on this hotly debated topic?? Is he pro-, anti-, or just trying to avoid the flames? If you want to hear the Giant's opinion, or anyone else who has ever worked at WotC, post on this thread and add your support! Thank you!

PS: I hope I didn't break any forum rules by posting this, but I'm curious.

I don't know what the rules say, to be honest. I think on most Forums it would be defined as "calling someone out" for good or ill.

I will give you my prediction of his answer - No Comment.

I think if he were prodded he would give, at the very least, luke warm praise for it.

Essentially he has to walk a tightrope though, since if he says he likes it, he may lose readers and customers since the hardcore anti-4e people border on psychotic. On the other hand he can't say he hates it since he might lose readers and customers since the hardcore pro-4e people border on psychotic.

He also has the additional weight of being unable to give a really negative review of 4e: He still has friends working at WotC and he also wants to avoid any "imperial entanglements" between his comic and WotCs legal department. Like Lando Calrissian, he has to do what Lord Vader commands or risk getting force choked, but he also has to help Han, Chewie and Leia as much as he can also.

My 2 CP anyway.

[kamikasei]

I would expect that if the Giant has any knowledge of 4e on which to base a judgment, it'd be NDA'd; and if he doesn't have any special knowledge, he will find it prudent not to comment. Baseless speculation is fun and all, but the guy does get paid by Wizards now and then, and it's probably not good to run your mouth off for little reason.

[Dan_Hemmens]

I also find it interesting that you consider the Giant "a professional" - surely he's a professional webcomic author, making his opinion about game design no more or less valid than anybody else's.

Of course to be honest, given the number of really sucky RPG systems out there, I'm not convinced that a professional game designer's opinion counts for much either.

(Although for what it's worth, I'd bet most are pro-4E, game designers tend to see the positive in other people's systems, and they tend not to have the investment in current editions that makes some people hostile)

[AKA_Bait]

I also find it interesting that you consider the Giant "a professional" - surely he's a professional webcomic author, making his opinion about game design no more or less valid than anybody else's.

He did co-author Dungeonscape... I'd say writing a WotC suppliment makes you a professional. Especially since it was a pretty good suppliment.

[Ominous]

He did co-author Dungeonscape... I'd say writing a WotC suppliment makes you a professional. Especially since it was a pretty good suppliment.

Wasn't he also a runner-up in the design a campaign setting contest that spawned Eberron?

[Kioran]

He did co-author Dungeonscape... I'd say writing a WotC suppliment makes you a professional. Especially since it was a pretty good suppliment.

He also comtributed to the Eberron Explorer´s Handbook - yeah, occasionally he gets paid to do stuff.

[Kol Korran]

...... (followed by a heavy deep sigh)

i realy don't understand all this discussion, about a product that still has months before it will be pulbished. this resembles discussing a movie of which you've seen only premiers:

- some will like it, some won't. just as it is with movies, and just as it has been with the former editions of D&D... why people try to persuade others to like it or not is beyond me. everyone makes their own judegment after they watch/ play the damn thing... or at least hear enough review from people who watched/ played the FINAL product.

- true, the designers need feed back. but if so, why do people keep directing their "observations" (for good and bad) here?

- as to the people who claims it's the end of the world, and that people should refrain from buying it: isn't it obvious that once the game is out, the vast majority of D&D players will buy (or procure in other means) the game? if you post enough of hate-hype about something, than some people will but it just to see if the hype was justified...

and as to the original question on this thread- i'm fairly sure Rich has far better things to do than involve himself in an utterly futile argument, when the product in question hasn't been finished yet, and especially since he is in contact with the designers (which would be interperted as "opinion bought by the board" by the 4e haters, if he says anythign nice, and "sucking up to the audiance" by 4e supporters, if he says something bad).

leave this subject allready. wait for the game to come out. play it, decides what needs to be altered or reinforced, report to the designers, and then play the 4.5e game...

[KIDS]

Essentially he has to walk a tightrope though, since if he says he likes it, he may lose readers and customers since the hardcore anti-4e people border on psychotic. On the other hand he can't say he hates it since he might lose readers and customers since the hardcore pro-4e people border on psychotic.

Hahaha, I loved this paragraph... well put :)
While I would personally like to see Giant's opinion and review, anything short of playing the game and finding it to suck myself can change my own overall (positive) opinion at this stage.

However, what do you mean as a "professional" opinion? Who is a professional, like Roger Ebert for movie critics? I don't think such a person exists. A bit of a weird wording there...

[Squash Monster]

I assume he meant somebody who's worked professionally in game design. A Spielberg, not an Ebert. Except people with names that aren't quite so big.


My credentials are much less impressive than you're probably looking for, but just in case, I'll ask: is a teaching assistant for a game design class professional enough? If it is, I'll share my thoughts here.

[AKA_Bait]

I assume he meant somebody who's worked professionally in game design. A Spielberg, not an Ebert. Except people with names that aren't quite so big.


My credentials are much less impressive than you're probably looking for, but just in case, I'll ask: is a teaching assistant for a game design class professional enough? If it is, I'll share my thoughts here.

I'd be interested to hear your thoughts regardless of your resume.

[Azerian Kelimon]

Indeed, most people will (rightly) take your thoughts and put them on a level higher than those of the game designers who, after all, are getting paid to do do the thing and some advertisin'.

[Mesfens]

Whoops, perhaps my first post was a tad arrogant. And badly constructed. Sorry! Truly am. I am personally interested in everyone's opinion, but, as mentioned before, there are other forums which have that. Didn't mean to call anyone out under a bad reason or anything, I just wanted to start a unique discussion!

[Azerian Kelimon]

...Sometimes, 'tis best to not say anything else and keep on truckin', head held high and confidence a-smile.

[EvilElitest]

I think the general advantage of what hte giant says is that people here generally trust his tastes (hence OOTS and why we are here) and so it will be like a reviewer you can trust. that being said, i doubt he will say anything until the game comes out
from
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[Little_Rudo]

I think that, no matter how the Giant feels about 4th Edition, no matter how well or how poorly the rules are, we can expect to see it mocked in some way, shape or form within OotS.

[Mesfens]

...Sometimes, 'tis best to not say anything else and keep on truckin', head held high and confidence a-smile.

Yeah. Guess so.

[Emperor Tippy]

From what I have heard (from people with the 4e PHB) its fairly well balanced and is pretty interesting.

I'm taking a wait and see approach to the whole thing, if I like it I'll upgrade. If not I'll stay with 3.5. And 3.5 is still going to be the base rule set for a few homebrew worlds of mine (because they depend on some of those rules to function).

[DementedFellow]

I think if he were prodded he would give, at the very least, luke warm praise for it.

Essentially he has to walk a tightrope though, since if he says he likes it, he may lose readers and customers since the hardcore anti-4e people border on psychotic. On the other hand he can't say he hates it since he might lose readers and customers since the hardcore pro-4e people border on psychotic.

Point for you.

Though to be fair, I don't think I would mind what his opinions are when it comes to the game. He helped create a number of things.

I just think it would hurt the comic if he switched horses midstream and went from 3.5 to 4e. Or at least if he did do this, wait until like 6-9 months for the players of that system to understand all the jokes.

The "Also Magic Missile" part of the first epic battle is something that just continues to tickle me. The thought of a lich just throwing magic missile is hilarious.

I responded mainly to sing the praises of Mr. Friendly for having a sense of humor and just being really cool in general.

[Xuincherguixe]

My unprofessional opinion involves questioning it's religious choices, gender preference, and going off on long rants that don't have anything to do with anything. I don't have any problems with those, but hey, I'm being unprofessional.

My professional opinion you would have to pay me for.

[Roland St. Jude]

Sheriff of Moddingham: There are plenty of threads for you to all share your opinions. When The Giant wants to share his opinion on 4e, he'll do so. I view this as a sort of "calling him out," albeit well-meaning, and not likely to be very productive. Thread locked.