[3.5] Threatening 5' and 10'

[Epinephrine]

What easy ways are there to threaten adjacent and reach as a small/medium character? I was looking for something like a spear haft feat, but the short shaft only allows you to switch as a swift action, and I'd like to threaten both ranges at once.

[RTGoodman]

I think people usually wield a normal reach weapon and either spiked armor/gauntlets or natural weapons or something like that.

Or you could use a spiked chain, which threatens at 5' and 10'.

[Eldariel]

EWP: Spiked Chain. Reach weapon + Improved Unarmed Strike (+Monk for damage)/Armor Spikes/Natural Weapon (preferably non-Claw; many DMs may not allow using Claws while wielding two-handed weapons). Short Haft is usually good enough though - however, since it requires Weapon Focus, it's less than optimal.

Basically, either a weapon that threatens both or a separate weapon for adjacent and reach. I prefer latter since it gives me more choice in weapons and costs less feats (Armor Spikes, for example).

EDIT: I wanna become a ninja too, but mommy says it's too dangerous.

[Zeful]

Anything that would allow you to wield a reach weapon one handed would allow you to wield another one handed weapon.

So like Monkey Grip and TWF with a longsword might work. Well you don't need to attack with both weapons so you don't need TWF.

[Eldariel]

Monkey Grip doesn't work that way. In fact, there's nothing in the game that allows you to wield a two-handed weapon in one hand by 3.5 rules. It simply allows you to wield a two-handed weapon of a larger category with less penalties.

Speaking of which, I gotta make my Spiked Chain TWF Unarmed Swordsage (with Monk-dip for Flurry) that TWFs with Spiked Chain and Unarmed Strikes and Power Attacks to his heart's content while threatening 10'.

EDIT: Woohoo, seems like I made it to the ninja college after all!

[The Glyphstone]

Anything that would allow you to wield a reach weapon one handed would allow you to wield another one handed weapon.

So like Monkey Grip and TWF with a longsword might work. Well you don't need to attack with both weapons so you don't need TWF.

MONKEY GRIP DOES NOT WORK THAT WAY!

Monkey Grip only allow you to wield a Large creature's weapon when you are Medium, or Medium when you are small. It does not affect handedness in any way - you need Wield Oversized Weapon (Epic) to do that.

@Eldarial: In the back of Complete Warrior is that feat. It treats all weapons as one size smaller and one category lighter (two-handed, one-handed, light) for anyone who takes it. Ya ninja.

[Eldariel]

@Eldarial: In the back of Complete Warrior is that feat. It treats all weapons as one size smaller and one category lighter (two-handed, one-handed, light) for anyone who takes it. Ya ninja.

Epic feat called Wield Oversized Weapon it seems. No wonder I didn't know about it - takes a maniac to use weapons in Epic!

[Zeful]

Monkey Grip doesn't work that way. In fact, there's nothing in the game that allows you to wield a two-handed weapon in one hand by 3.5 rules.

Powerful build, you are treated as one size larger whenever it would be advantageous to you (roughly). A large creature can wield a medium two handed weapon as a one handed weapon. So unless I'm wrong about powerful build a medium character with powerful build can wield a longspear one handed.

[drengnikrafe]

I think if you have a natural attack (I read this in another forum), then you can have a longer distance weapon (I.E. a Ranseur, or whatever), and threaten both at once.

[Eldariel]

Powerful Build: "X can use weapons designed for a creature one size larger without penalty."

Doesn't seem to me like it says anything about being able to use two-handed weapons of any size as one-handed weapons. It worked differently in 3.0, so that might be what you're thinking about.

EDIT: Seems like I passed my first test in the ninja college!

[RTGoodman]

Powerful build, you are treated as one size larger whenever it would be advantageous to you (roughly). A large creature can wield a medium two handed weapon as a one handed weapon. So unless I'm wrong about powerful build a medium character with powerful build can wield a longspear one handed.

That's still not true, in 3.5 (though I think it was that way in 3.0). By RAW, you can't EVER wield a weapon made for a different size category than yourself to change the handedness. As far as I know, you can wield a Small Greatsword with a -2 penalty (I think - it could be -4), but it's still two-handed. "Handedness" never changes, as far as I know.

[The Glyphstone]

That's still not true, in 3.5 (though I think it was that way in 3.0). By RAW, you can't EVER wield a weapon made for a different size category than yourself to change the handedness. As far as I know, you can wield a Small Greatsword with a -2 penalty (I think - it could be -4), but it's still two-handed. "Handedness" never changes, as far as I know.

See also: Wield Oversized Weapon.

Epic is still RAW, crazy as it can get. Just go talk to that Cheesewrought Instabold over there.

[monty]

That's still not true, in 3.5 (though I think it was that way in 3.0). By RAW, you can't EVER wield a weapon made for a different size category than yourself to change the handedness. As far as I know, you can wield a Small Greatsword with a -2 penalty (I think - it could be -4), but it's still two-handed. "Handedness" never changes, as far as I know.

From http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/weapons.htm, under "Inappropriately Sized Weapons":

The measure of how much effort it takes to use a weapon (whether the weapon is designated as a light, one-handed, or two-handed weapon for a particular wielder) is altered by one step for each size category of difference between the wielder’s size and the size of the creature for which the weapon was designed. If a weapon’s designation would be changed to something other than light, one-handed, or two-handed by this alteration, the creature can’t wield the weapon at all.

[Eldariel]

This is true. Doesn't work with Powerful Build (because of the wording of the ability), but actually being Large (or wielding small Spiked Chain + whatever) would work.

[monty]

If you're Medium and humanoid, a simple Enlarge Person would do the trick nicely. Alternately, Inhuman Reach or a similar feat.

[Smeggedoff]

you could always move into warshaper, one of the levels in that gives you +5 foot reach while shaping and the class has deceptively easy prerequisites for what it is
(apart from the shapeshifting ofc)

[RTGoodman]

From http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/weapons.htm, under "Inappropriately Sized Weapons":

Huh, well then I concede defeat. I could have sworn that that particular section wasn't in the 3.5 PHB. Still, I think Spiked Chain or reach weapon + spiked gauntlets get my vote.

[Bayar]

Epic feat called Wield Oversized Weapon it seems. No wonder I didn't know about it - takes a maniac to use weapons in Epic!

There is Oversized TWF (not epic), it lets you wield a one-handed weapon in your off hand.


But Spiked chain is the best.

For max reach, go with whip, 15 reach, hit adjactent, great for duskblade's with inhuman reach and enlarge self. Especially if it is a Whirlwind whip .

[Eldariel]

OTWF doesn't increase your wielding capabilities though, only reduces the penalty for having a One-Handed weapon in the offhand.

[Chronos]

For max reach, go with whip, 15 reach, hit adjactent, great for duskblade's with inhuman reach and enlarge self. Especially if it is a Whirlwind whip

Great for channeling spells into dozens of targets at once, but whips don't threaten, which takes away one of the bigger advantages of reach.

And if you're going to use a weapon of the wrong size, then you don't need Monkey Grip: Just wield a halfling-scale longspear. But I think there's a FAQ entry that says that when wielding a weapon with the wrong number of hands, you don't benefit from the reach. And even if you do, you're piling on penalties.

[bosssmiley]

What easy ways are there to threaten adjacent and reach as a small/medium character? I was looking for something like a spear haft feat, but the short shaft only allows you to switch as a swift action, and I'd like to threaten both ranges at once.

Armour spikes + a 10' reach polearm. You now threaten every space within 10'.

[Curmudgeon]

You really want to command the spaces around you at medium size? Get a horse, armor spikes, and a lance. You threaten at 5' and 10' distances around the 10' x 10' space of your mount. Since you can use the lance one-handed while mounted, you could throw in an off-hand whip to reach (but not threaten) at 15' as well.

[Chineselegolas]

Two feat combinations (Each requiring two feats)

The first combination is from 'Heroes of Horror' requires you be evil:
Willing Deformity
Deformity (Tall)

The second is from 'Lords of Madness' and merely requires you to be humanoid
Aberrant Blood
Inhuman Reach


Interestingly these add 5 foot of reach, so for cheese take both. Then a reach weapon to double that. Nice with a spiked chain and everyone within 30ft being in your reach... Whirlwind Attack anyone?
Or cleric/wizard and touch spells from 15ft away...

[Epinephrine]

Wow, lots of replies!

Thanks, I hadn't thought of spiked armour, that fits the bill perfectly.

[The Glyphstone]

Anyone ever tried using the Awl Pike from Dragon? It was a pole-arm type weapon that threatened at 10' and 15', but not 5ft. Didn't do a lot of damage, though.

[Person_Man]

Spiked Armor
Spiked buckler
Spiked gauntlets
Improved Unarmed Strike
Any natural weapon (claws, bite, tentacles, etc)
Spiked Chain
Gnomish Quickrazor (can draw and sheath as a free action)
Willing Deformity + Deformity (Tall)
Aberrant Blood + Inhuman Reach + Extended Reach (Savage Species: adds another 5 feet for those with "nonrigid body or a nonrigid attack form such as a tentacle, feeler, or pseudopod." Inhuman Reach specifically states that your arms become like snakes or tentacles).

[Tokiko Mima]

Reach is wierd, and the weapon's size has nothing to do with the reach you obtain. For example, if you took the major Titan Bloodline in order to wield a gargantuan two handed warhammer without penalty you'd still only have a 5' reach despite the fact that your weapon is at least 30' long.

[olelia]

From http://www.d20srd.org/srd/equipment/...m#reachWeapons

Glaives, guisarmes, lances, longspears, ranseurs, spiked chains, and whips are reach weapons. A reach weapon is a melee weapon that allows its wielder to strike at targets that aren’t adjacent to him or her. Most reach weapons double the wielder’s natural reach, meaning that a typical Small or Medium wielder of such a weapon can attack a creature 10 feet away, but not a creature in an adjacent square. A typical Large character wielding a reach weapon of the appropriate size can attack a creature 15 or 20 feet away, but not adjacent creatures or creatures up to 10 feet away.

If the weapon size will only give +10 feet no matter what the size is, why is it then at huge when you have a natural 15 foot reach you'll gain a 30 foot reach according to the text? .

[AstralFire]

Reach weapons double your reach. Double your fun.

That's the statement of the great mint of double mint gum.

[olelia]

That strangely tastes of Swiss.