[3.5] Modern (guns and tanks!)

[Chas the mage]

Has't thou ever tried to come forth and play dungeons and dragons in the time of today? I has't had minimal experience with thine modern roleplaying. this is what i have gathered:
-It is very unadvisable to go forth with 1st level character into a gun battle. I has't tried this before and the result was pitiful, shorty before the campeign was't O'er!
-Weapons can pose forth a challange to thine players! guns be'st not cheap! and thou cannot go forth into a gun battle with a knife!
-armor: nor can i find good armor. the first (and only) modern armor i used be'st a flack jacket, and that gaveth players 5 more AC. They only had 17 AC, so they where killed when they where'st hit with ease.
-guns should provide bonuses. it is easier to shoot one with a gun that it be'st to slash one with thine sword.

Any feedback, suggestions or question qill be appreciated!

(BTW check out dandwiki.org and quoth into the search engine of it: MSRD)

[Emperor Tippy]

Ye gods, spell normally.

[Knaight]

Go play d20 modern, it has this stuff built in. It also has a free SRD. Or pick up any number of non d20 modern games and play them. Furthermore these games often will deal with it being harder to dodge gunshots and stuff, which deals with your complaint. Also please spell normally.

[FMArthur]

Has't thou ever tried to come forth and play dungeons and dragons in the time of today? I has't had minimal experience with thine modern roleplaying. this is what i have gathered:
-It is very unadvisable to go forth with 1st level character into a gun battle. I has't tried this before and the result was pitiful, shorty before the campeign was't O'er!
-Weapons can pose forth a challange to thine players! guns be'st not cheap! and thou cannot go forth into a gun battle with a knife!
-armor: nor can i find good armor. the first (and only) modern armor i used be'st a flack jacket, and that gaveth players 5 more AC. They only had 17 AC, so they where killed when they where'st hit with ease.
-guns should provide bonuses. it is easier to shoot one with a gun that it be'st to slash one with thine sword.

Any feedback, suggestions or question qill be appreciated!

(BTW check out dandwiki.org and quoth into the search engine of it: MSRD)

You are in debt by one internet.

[BRC]

You are in debt by one internet.

One internet, AND a brain. The OP broke mine so he owes me a new one of equal or greater value.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

You guys really should stop harping on his choice of spelling...it's not like he can't spell, he's just going for an effect. I personally had no problem with it, and found it mildly amusing to boot. If you don't feel like reading through it, don't. It's that simple. Or, if you do want to critique him, at least provide some commentary that is actually helpful alongside your criticism (I'm looking at you, Tippy, FMArthur, and BRC).

That said, I see you are using d20 Modern, so here are a few bits of information:

First off, the game is more fatal. That's all there is to it. Getting hit hurts...a lot. So at low levels it's advisable to try to use cover whenever possible. Think of it as a real gunfight...would you really stand out in the open and exchange shots? Didn't think so.

Armor shouldn't be that bad, as your Dex, Armor Bonus, AND Class AC bonus get added together (I think...it's been a little while). Considering that only the Strong Hero has a full Base Attack Bonus, you really aren't in any more danger than you are in a standard D&D game. In fact, you chances of getting hit should actually be smaller.

Knives in gunfights are actually pretty decent ideas, as you get your Strength bonus to damage, and that makes it pretty easy to trigger the Massive Damage Threshold. It also means that they deal a higher average damage that firearms, as a general rule (assuming a decent strength score).

As for the pricing of weaponry, again...it's slightly realistic. Maybe not in terms of actual price, but in terms of what a human needs. It's not that easy to purchase a complete arsenal, and most starting heroes won't come armed for bear. Maybe a handgun or so, but I know no-one who carries around an assault shotgun in day-to-day activity unless circumstances require them to have one (i.e. they've had several encounters already, and need it to survive).

-The Djinn

[Heliomance]

It's possible to simulate guns under D&D rules - I'm playing in a modern day D&D game at the moment, and it works quite well I feel. Guns hurt. However, the DM has ruled that modern bulletproof armour grants DR - but only against bullets, thus making other weapons also viable options. I would note though, that standing underneath a helicopter you've just destroyed as it falls from the sky because you think the tableau this will form will look badass is not a good idea. It looks awesome right up to the point where the helicopter lands on top of you.

[Zeful]

First off, the game is more fatal. That's all there is to it. Getting hit hurts...a lot. So at low levels it's advisable to try to use cover whenever possible. Think of it as a real gunfight...would you really stand out in the open and exchange shots? Didn't think so.

A 5' 10" 130lb man with a toughness of 16 and a 13hp did. He was fun.

[charl]

It is a modern setting. Think modern life.

Guns aren't cheap. Neither is ammo. A single gunshot is often deadly, so the best course of action is to take cover behind something. Knives aren't much use when the bullets start flying, unless you are some kind of ninja and/or action hero. And bullet-proof is a very misleading name. Plus even when they work, it still hurts and bruises if you get hit. And they generally don't cover all of the body, which any bad-guy gunfighter with skill will know, meaning they will not be aiming at your torso, but either at your head or your hips if they mean to kill you.

Best strategy is to not get into a gunfight to begin with.

[Storm Bringer]

Has't thou ever tried to come forth and play dungeons and dragons in the time of today? I has't had minimal experience with thine modern roleplaying. this is what i have gathered:

-It is very unadvisable to go forth with 1st level character into a gun battle. I has't tried this before and the result was pitiful, shorty before the campeign was't O'er!

two options:
A) start the characters above level 1. after all, they're heros.
b) design the frist few adventures to focus on non-combat set ups, with just one or maybe two firefights, against foes who are simmily equipped.

And don't be afriad to fudge the dice. Dm's have screens for a reason.

-Weapons can pose forth a challange to thine players! guns be'st not cheap! and thou cannot go forth into a gun battle with a knife!

agian, two options:
A) design the combats with the expectation that the players are only going to be carrying pistols.
b) let the players loot a decent gun or two during the adventure.

-armor: nor can i find good armor. the first (and only) modern armor i used be'st a flack jacket, and that gaveth players 5 more AC. They only had 17 AC, so they where killed when they where'st hit with ease.

It may be that you just messed the sums up, as others have pointed out you get a bonus form class to AC. But if your first action when the shooting started wasn't taking cover, then you were kinda asking for it.

Also, rember we are not talked about wether the bullet got though the armour. we're talking about wether any damage got though. As pointed out, even a bullet is stopped, it will still leave a major bruise.

Oh, and rifle calibre bullet tend to sail though most armoured vests. Only really heavy duty vests can stand up to Ak's or M-16s at the short ranges we are talking about.

-guns should provide bonuses. it is easier to shoot one with a gun that it be'st to slash one with thine sword.

Any feedback, suggestions or question qill be appreciated!

debateable. the statistics don't bear that out, certainly. I've seen a document that gave the shot/hit rates for a police force over a year, and the tally about out as about 30-40%, which is better than the odds for a first level character, at any rate.

[Knaight]

That and the "stormtrooper effect" has research backing it up. In a study with 1 police officer firing at a target, done with 8 police officers seperately they averaged 64% accuracy. With all 8 firing simultaneously this went down to 8%. While this could be not seeing where you hit the first time, it seems likely that the focus changed to just pumping out the bullets, possibly because of some instinct to try suppression fire. And most GMs don't use screens, at least as far as I've seen, as I have never seen one used and don't use one personally.

[Storm Bringer]

really? Our group always uses some form of screen, even if it's just a conveinent stack of books.

allow me to asked a related and intriuged question: do you/does your dm roll his dice in plain sight while DM'ing? As in, the players can see the dice and how they landed?

[Knaight]

Yes, we all do that, and the players have to. At least the people who we let GM(Me and a few others.). That said I'm often rolling a succession of dice and applying them, and players can easily miss a beat.

[Storm Bringer]

Yes, we all do that, and the players have to. At least the people who we let GM(Me and a few others.). That said I'm often rolling a succession of dice and applying them, and players can easily miss a beat.

intresting. rather different than the way we do it. The players all roll in the open, obviously, but the DM usually rolls out of sight.

Your answer implies, you understand the need to fudge rolls to keep the players happy, so I'll not elaborate on that.

[Chas the mage]

tippy: "its a little thing I like to call 'roleplaying'."

I thank thee for thine sugestion of modern d20, but ye olde wizards o' thine coast nearest me be'st closed, and I don't knoweth how'st to obtain a roleplaying book. the wizards of the coast got closed down near me and htere is an uncles games, but all they have is 4th edition. Alas, woe is me! anyways, cover did come into play, but my characters and I fogot about it until I drag someone behind a bush for partial cover (+2) while'st resesitating them. soem of the DM rolls haappen outside. mainly the initative, and enemies attacks.

thanks for the response

-Chas the mage

[Heliomance]

Seriously, if you're going to use archaic English, don't butcher it like that. Modern English is preferred, but if you have to use old-fashioned language, at least get it right.

I thank thee for thy suggestion of d20 Modern, but the Wizards of the Coast nearest me are closed, and I know not how best to obtain a roleplaying book.

Third person stays unchanged a lot of the time. Please, don't make our eyes bleed any more

[Knaight]

intresting. rather different than the way we do it. The players all roll in the open, obviously, but the DM usually rolls out of sight.

Your answer implies, you understand the need to fudge rolls to keep the players happy, so I'll not elaborate on that.

No, I'm just saying that if I were to fudge rolls, it wouldn't be difficult, I don't fudge rolls. Its much easier to say alter hit points, or have some unmentioned boost wear off. Not that I do that either, but I'm just saying that its the easier method.

As for Middle English, the plural singular divide is still more or less the same, so at least get a better handle of it before using it. Read Shakespeare, that always works. As for d20 modern, its right here.

Although if your not dead set on the d20 system I can easily dig up some other stuff that works really well, and quickly. Very easily.

[Chas the mage]

Thanks but no thanks knaight.
Yes... I'll try and stop the middle english

[Yahzi]

Guns aren't cheap. Neither is ammo.

Um. Yes they are. A decent assault rifle and a few boxes of ammo costs what, $1,000 or so? That's a month's work for minimum wage.

In regular D&D, a longsword, shield, and studded leather armor costs 27 gp or so. Which is 9 month's work for minimum wage (1sp/day).

[BRC]

Um. Yes they are. A decent assault rifle and a few boxes of ammo costs what, $1,000 or so? That's a month's work for minimum wage.

Provided you spend no money at all on things like food, water, gas, rent, clothes, or ANYTHING else.

[TheThan]

Go play d20 modern, it has this stuff built in. It also has a free SRD. Or pick up any number of non d20 modern games and play them. Furthermore these games often will deal with it being harder to dodge gunshots and stuff, which deals with your complaint. Also please spell normally.

I believe you refer to this linky

[Siosilvar]

Provided you spend no money at all on things like food, water, gas, rent, clothes, or ANYTHING else.

Taxes, too.