Positive Energy Undead

[Th3N3xtGuy]

I remember reading somewhere about undead being brought back with positive energy but usually only divine ranked creatures can do it. Anyone know the link would be preferred. I believe its a template.

[Dusk Eclipse]

You are thinking of "Deathless", which at their core are indeed positive-energy powered Undead, the connection to divine powers comes from a) being first introduced in the Book of Exalted Deeds and b) In Eberron, the Undying Court (a sort of deity) is made up of Elven Deathless.

[ngilop]

I remember reading somewhere about undead being brought back with positive energy but usually only divine ranked creatures can do it. Anyone know the link would be preferred. I believe its a template.

I am not sure, but I do believe that is what the Deathless type is. It can be found in the Book of Exalted Deeds.

Not able to provide a link as it is not OGC.

[Th3N3xtGuy]

thank you guys very much couldn't find where I read it before.

[Brookshw]

Sounds like your thinking of the deathless type from BoED

Edit: multiple ninja'd!

[Th3N3xtGuy]

so do they rot still as deathless? Can a vampire be deathless if a vampire god turns them?

[ngilop]

Deathless is its own template.

SO I would say officially No a vampire ( as it I its own template separate from deathless) could not be a deathless..

But I do not see a reason why one could not just make a deathless based vampire, only able to feed off the blood of evil doers or some such.

[OldTrees1]

so do they rot still as deathless? Can a vampire be deathless if a vampire god turns them?

They rot exactly as much as comparable negative energy undead do.

Vampires are not deathless and a deathless counterpart to vampires has not been printed. However there is nothing stopping you from making a deathless counterpart to vampires (nor is there anything stopping you from calling them vampires).

[Afgncaap5]

so do they rot still as deathless? Can a vampire be deathless if a vampire god turns them?

I'd imagine that they don't "rot" but from what images I've seen they probably "dry out." Honestly, "deathless" is a great template for things like non-evil Mummies.

And I'd imagine that the vampire could be deathless if the vampire god had that kind of control over positive energy. Case in point, I'm not sure I'd let Wee Jas bring back deathless since she's more of a font of negative energy than positive energy.

...now I'm imagining a weird kind of vampire that must always travel westward, since it can only live while being exposed to sunlight, and must never bear witness to the moon or the nights of star-filled skies.

"Oh, this wicked curse, nevermore able to gaze upon the setting sun or the stars that hide in brighter light..."

[Th3N3xtGuy]

I'd imagine that they don't "rot" but from what images I've seen they probably "dry out." Honestly, "deathless" is a great template for things like non-evil Mummies.

And I'd imagine that the vampire could be deathless if the vampire god had that kind of control over positive energy. Case in point, I'm not sure I'd let Wee Jas bring back deathless since she's more of a font of negative energy than positive energy.

...now I'm imagining a weird kind of vampire that must always travel westward, since it can only live while being exposed to sunlight, and must never bear witness to the moon or the nights of star-filled skies.

"Oh, this wicked curse, nevermore able to gaze upon the setting sun or the stars that hide in brighter light..."

From what I read all gods at the end of the day are positive based while Aboleths are there negative counterparts. That vampire idea actually sounds a pretty hilarious character to play. I might make one in a campaign hunter during day asleep at night. They wont expect a vampire to strike in daylight the perfect front.

[atemu1234]

Deathless is its own template.

SO I would say officially No a vampire ( as it I its own template separate from deathless) could not be a deathless..

But I do not see a reason why one could not just make a deathless based vampire, only able to feed off the blood of evil doers or some such.

Yeah, it's basically the Undead type minus the bad rep.

[XionUnborn01]

I'd imagine that they don't "rot" but from what images I've seen they probably "dry out." Honestly, "deathless" is a great template for things like non-evil Mummies.

And I'd imagine that the vampire could be deathless if the vampire god had that kind of control over positive energy. Case in point, I'm not sure I'd let Wee Jas bring back deathless since she's more of a font of negative energy than positive energy.

...now I'm imagining a weird kind of vampire that must always travel westward, since it can only live while being exposed to sunlight, and must never bear witness to the moon or the nights of star-filled skies.

"Oh, this wicked curse, nevermore able to gaze upon the setting sun or the stars that hide in brighter light..."

That could be the basis for a really tragic BBEG who's trying to stop the rotation of the planet or make it eternal day or something. Maybe he's trying to create a plane wide daylight spell that would kill lesser creatures without resistance to the bright light like basically all the commoners and such.

[Spore]

Would a positive energy based Vampire donate blood on a daily basis or explode?

On a more serious note I like the idea of "solar powered vampires" although they should have a dust form (rather than mist). If they don't get their time in the light outside (cloudy weather and suchsimilar still count), they have to feed on positive energy. Their max. health would get reduced by a fixed amount (only be able to be healed by the cure series of spells, or restoration).

Many of them would start becoming clerics (or at least, adepts) in order to maintain their health. Physically indistinguishable from real vampires the only odd thing striking a canny observer is the fact that they are outside at day (and are killed by magical darkness).

[Urpriest]

From what I read all gods at the end of the day are positive based while Aboleths are there negative counterparts..

There's no basis for that. There are even Aboleth gods, and Aboleths in general don't involve themselves much from the undead.

[ZamielVanWeber]

There's no basis for that. There are even Aboleth gods, and Aboleths in general don't involve themselves much from the undead.

According to Lords of Madness aboleths do not worship gods, insteading paying homage to entities they call the Elder Evils.

[ShurikVch]

Alternately: Lichfiend Vivacious Creature Energon (Xag-Ya) - it's an undead made out of animated piece of Positive Energy, which radiate PE aura, able to channel PE, shoot PE rays, and explode into PE burst at 0 hp

[Urpriest]

According to Lords of Madness aboleths do not worship gods, insteading paying homage to entities they call the Elder Evils.

I had the impression that Piscaethes [sp?] had a divine rank, but I may be misremembering. But yeah, the vast majority of gods are far too young to get any respect from the Aboleths.

[atemu1234]

Alternately: Lichfiend Vivacious Creature Energon (Xag-Ya) - it's an undead made out of animated piece of Positive Energy, which radiate PE aura, able to channel PE, shoot PE rays, and explode into PE burst at 0 hp

I now know how to wipe out an army of undead.

[Chronos]

Personally, I've always thought that the concept of Deathless is kind of silly. We already have plenty of examples of creatures animated by positive energy: They're called "living".

[ShurikVch]

Personally, I've always thought that the concept of Deathless is kind of silly. We already have plenty of examples of creatures animated by positive energy: They're called "living".

I second it!

[Xerlith]

Personally, I've always thought that the concept of Deathless is kind of silly. We already have plenty of examples of creatures animated by positive energy: They're called "living".

Yeah, that's one way of looking at it. Then again, I always kinda went with the notion that in a living being, the Positive and Negative energy are in balance, waxing and waning during their lifespan (the anabolic and catabolic processes respectively), while an Undead and/or Deathless are simply beings of purely polar identity.
That opens a whole new can of worms (Can I Turn Undead old people?), but at least pretends to make sense.

Yeah, the Deathless would basically use just enough Positive energy to move around and think. Ditto for the undead. How there are mindless undead but no mindless Deathless and why the undead are ALSO sentient sometimes... That's something to think about.

[Th3N3xtGuy]

Personally, I've always thought that the concept of Deathless is kind of silly. We already have plenty of examples of creatures animated by positive energy: They're called "living".

I agree but at the end of the day the laws of reality per campaign are different from what RAW says.

[atemu1234]

Yeah, that's one way of looking at it. Then again, I always kinda went with the notion that in a living being, the Positive and Negative energy are in balance, waxing and waning during their lifespan (the anabolic and catabolic processes respectively), while an Undead and/or Deathless are simply beings of purely polar identity.
That opens a whole new can of worms (Can I Turn Undead old people?), but at least pretends to make sense.

Yeah, the Deathless would basically use just enough Positive energy to move around and think. Ditto for the undead. How there are mindless undead but no mindless Deathless and why the undead are ALSO sentient sometimes... That's something to think about.

Because the point of deathless is that they CHOSE to stick around - to do something. According to BoED, they chose to 'delay death' instead of running from it. They don't fear it. Mindless deathless go against that.

[ZamielVanWeber]

I had the impression that Piscaethes [sp?] had a divine rank, but I may be misremembering. But yeah, the vast majority of gods are far too young to get any respect from the Aboleths.

Off topic, but in LoM they say that the aboleths' racial memory is older than any god, although Atropus is almost certainly an exception. I also have never heard of the Blood Queen having a divine rank (and I always conflate her with Ragnorra). Afroakuma may know more.

On topic, the designers of BoED clearly wanted things with the undead immunities and longevity without undead fluff. This makes fluff hiccup a bit, but I always explained it as: living creatures are made of the four elements and powered by their interactions; positive energy heals because it is a creative force and brings more elements into play to balance out what was lost. Deathless are animated purely by positive energy so adding more heals them and giving them its opposite, negative energy, damages them. Undead are the opposite.