How can someone be fit without going to the gym? Also, I hate sports.

[A.A.King]

If you're going to complain about an Athlete earning more than Doctors, Teachers and Firemen (and I assume you used a picture of someone from Doctors without Borders because the regular ones seem to do just fine money wise) then I wonder what your opinion is on Singers, Actors and Writers? I'm not an American so I don't know who 'this guy' is but I am assuming he is a top athlete and as such a top earner, yet he probably has less money in the bank then top earners from those three professions. Are people like Tom Cruise, Taylor Swift and G.R.R. Martin not even better examples then of how decadent our society really is or are you only complaining about people earning money from things you don't enjoy? (or do you only like things from people without huge bankouts? I don't know your taste so I had to pick generic rich names).

I mean, I can understand not enjoying watching sports, I'm not exactly a fan myself. I mean, I enjoy the ones where it is my nation versus your nation (and even then I only really enjoy it when my nation's team crushes your nation's team) but outside of that basic narrative I've not yet found one I enjoy watching as a regular competition. However, doing sports? I have always enjoyed that. Even the ones I'm not particular good at. Why? Well, it's something you can do with friends which to most people is a bonus but beyond that there are two simple reasons to enjoy sports and exercise: 1) It releases Endorphins. Endorphins make you happy. 2) It's a simple accomplishment. It feels good to tire yourself out on one those fake-bikes to nowhere because once you're done your body tells you that you've been active. I mean, if you want to believe that there is no value to exercise other than vanity reasons this might not work for you but if you know that exercise is healthy and that you really should be more healthy then even the occasional 30 minute work-out can really make you feel like you've done something to improve yourself (even if you go and reward yourself with a big mac afterwards...). Bascially, exercise can give you the same feeling smug people get from eating a carrot in front of you (except this time it's an actual accomplishment of some sort).

However, if you're going to say that you hate team based sports because they make you "have to actually talk directly to the person" then I would argue your problem isn't with sports it's with 'people' in general, which no amount of logic and arguments can solve.

[Ninja_Prawn]

Working out is also a good thing for people with diabetes

True!

Anyway, I agree with the prevailing view that The Eye is

operating on a fairly absurd frame of reference

so I won't bother repeating what's already been said.

I just thought I'd share some personal experiences. Everyone I know who goes to the gym was originally sent there by their doctor: my dad and my aunt have high blood pressure, my sister and I both have problems with our tendons and my other gym-going friend was injured in a car accident and needed the gym for rehab. None of us were particularly into sport or exercise before but all of us have kept up the gym habit, because we've found it enjoyable, beneficial or both.

For me, I'm quite lazy, so I find that going to the gym helps me focus on exercising for a solid chunk of time with no distractions or excuses. I don't know where the OP's gotten the impression that gyms are torture chambers; that's not true at all. They're bright, clean, safe and (in my experience) tolerant places. It's only as painful as you want* it to be - no one's forcing you to do anything super-intense or beyond your ability (indeed, that would be dangerously irresponsible), and it's not like you have to go every day. As for preening, vain gym-bros... they're a tiny minority. Most of the people I see at the gym are there to lose weight or stay healthy.

*And, bear in mind, the additional endorphins that are released during exercise generally compensate for the physical pain involved.

[Xyril]

In world where this guy gets so much more money than these guys, truly show us how decadent our society really is.

No, it just shows us how the free market works and that you have problems making proper comparisons. It's illogical for you to compare top earning athletes to doctors working for a non-profit organization (in other words, doctors who made a deliberate choice to take a job earning less than they could with their abilities.) If you take the average actor, athlete, model, or singer, he or she makes less than the average doctor or teacher (especially if you include the private sector.) If you look at a top earning doctor who only practices medicine, they're making more than many of the players in the NBA--even the least talented are whom are among the best at what they do. And if you look at doctors making money outside of practicing--folks who do private research or started a medical devices or services company, basically any job that isn't treating patients but is still requires an experienced doctor--I would guess that they make as much money as even the top professional athletes.

The other thing you forget (or ignore) is the nature of the work itself. If I had to put a dollar value on good medicare care, I would place it far above the value of entertainment. The free market seems to agree with me, and that's as it should be. However, there is a limit to how much medicare care a doctor can "sell." A doctor has a limited amount of time to see patients. Even if he's charging $500 an hour for his time alone, he'll have to work long hours to break $1 million a year. In contrast, if you're an actor, or a writer, or an athlete, you have to option of a different way to monetize. There is no theoretical limit on the number of books or tickets you can sell, or the number of people can watch you.

Let's imagine that I am willing and able to pay $500 an hour for a doctor. I value a certain book 2% as much, so I'm willing to pay $10 for the book. I like watching basketball, but not enough to pay for it, so I watch it on free TV--obviously, the value I place on basketball is several orders of magnitude less than what I place on medical care. However, the doctor can only work for 60 billable hours a week, so he makes a bit over $1 million a year helping a few hundred patients. The author of that book gets $5 out of every book sale, and I'm not the only one who likes him, so he sells a million copies and makes $5 million. He makes 5 times more than the doctor despite the fact that each individual values his work less than medical care. A popular basketball player is valued by the team because they think he helps attract viewers and sell ads. Since there are so many players and other people who contribute to the popularity of the team, the popular player only gets a small share of the total advertising revenue--a mere ten cents per viewer per game. However, the team is quite popular and has 50 million viewers per game. Thus, the athlete can make more in a game than the doctor does in a year, despite the fact that most individual people value healthcare enough to pay thousands of dollars, but don't pay a cent to watch basketball.

Many go to the gym, something I will never understand, the fact that people pay to go to machines to suffer pain in other to fit what our society say is beautiful strikes as something out of a dystopian novel or movie.

That, or they want to increase (or regain) their physical abilities or improve their health.

That strikes me as odd since he is very muscular, like super muscular, with six packs and biceps and large chests and all that stuff. I asked what he did to be so in shape and he says jogging and a thing he calls "calisteniks" or something.

Is that possible? Can someone have such a super hero build without going to such horrible places?

It was once possible, but the Red Skull's men killed the scientist who invented it and destroyed all his research, and thus far all attempts to replicate it have failed.

What's his secret? Genetics? Dedication? Steroids? Does he goes to the gym and pretend he doesn't so he will look cool? (and make his weirdo friend ask random people in the internet about it).

He already told you his secret. You were just too lazy to google it. (It's spelled "calisthenics," but even if you type it in your way Google would know what you mean.) Resistance training is one of the more efficient ways to build bulk, but it's not the only way. Also, building bulk isn't all there is to looking muscular. A lot of reasonably active people have a six pack in there--it's trimming all that excess fat that lets it show.

[fire_insideout]

I was just about to comment on this. I am fully behind ditching crunches and sit-ups because they do suck as far as an all-around core exercise goes.

Just drop to the floor and do a plank when you're done with those squats. They will be perfectly safe as long as your form is correct and you don't over-do the weight. But do those planks if you ever want that weight to increase above what you started with.

Agreed, a strong core is super-important if you want to have a good squat. I see a lot of people failing their squats not because they lack leg strength, but because their core cannot hold the pressure from the bar. This is especially important if you're not super mobile and fall forward a lot in your squat which will put a lot more stress on your core.

[Florian]

I can actually get not liking "team-based competition". That should be friendly, all too often, it is not and only done for personal gratification.
But: Fitness requires a lot of disciple, first to get it started, later to not be slack with it. Depending on taste, you either build up the discipline to do it alone, have some form of "friendly competition" by doing it with a group or you find it encouraging to directly compete against other. Your cup of tea.

I´m not a friend of gyms either, but mainly because of the often attached "gym culture". Still, they are a good starting point to get the basics right when you have a good trainer, as they can evaluate and correct wat you´re doing before any harm can come from it.

Personally, I like a mix of T´ai Chi and basic calisthenics. As for why, simple healthcare reasons. Better cardio and lungs, less fat, make life with what is basically an office job better and also helps with the seasonal allergies.

[Cozzer]

Disregarding the whole "above this petty vanity" thing since I am above that petty vanity (but apparently not above the petty vanity of declaring I'm above other kinds of petty vanities), it's very possible to be and look extremely fit without ever going to a gym. I have a friend who looks fitter than most gym-rats, and he just did a reasonable amount of bodyweight exercises each day (or almost each day) for a long time. You just need to choose the right kind of exercises, and know when to change them so that you keep challenging yourself when you get to a plateau.

As in most things, constance and time are the keys to success, more than intensity.

[Sobol]

Many go to the gym, something I will never understand, the fact that people pay to go to machines to suffer pain

I exercise chiefly for pleasure and mental health.

Of course, physical health is good, too; but it's not my main goal.

Exercise gives your brain a high-quality rest (and I need it much: I'm a mathematician and do a lot of mental work).

That's something professional chess players understood long ago (about the middle of the 20th century) - that you shouldn't just sit all day long with a board analyzing positions. Look at the latest World Chess Championship, for example: both contestants had official physical trainers (Brede Kvisvik for Magnus Carlsen, Anna Chakvetadze for Sergey Karjakin).

I was given an applied problem once which I couldn't solve no matter how hard I thought. Then I went to the gym to get distracted - and during French press the solution appeared in my head.

Physical exercise calms you down, clears your mind, drives away dark and compulsive thoughts, gives you inner peace.

Last year I met a 70-year-old woman in my gym who told me she lost her son and started to work out to fight depression. She did pretty well for her age.

Yes, when starting to exercise after a long interval - it's "suffering." But you remember that in a short while, your muscles will adapt and the joy will return again.

Also, it's just entertaining. Kind of like upgrading your character in a game - and even more absorbing. Getting XP, watching your stats go up, reaching new levels...

Spoiler: An XKCD strip

Show

There may be many other reasons to exercise. Improving your self-assertion, for example.
Not just getting stronger.

Also, google "runner's high."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neurob...rcise#Euphoria

[FinnLassie]

I avoid gyms purely due to how expensive they are for my student budget, as well as the fact that when I went to a gym YEARS ago, I got bullied there. Just leaves a bad taste. The guys who did so were douchebags, and in the end a minority, but hurtful nevertheless.

Nothing against gyms, though. Some find it more convenient. I'm gonna stick to cycling and planking for now, maybe getting weights later this year.

Honestly. It's fussy to think about people's interests from such a negative light. Majority of the people that go to the gym I bet find it very enjoyable to themselves.

[paddyfool]

One more tiny point on the sportspeople's salaries: for those at the top of the game the salaries are indeed huge, while they're young. But they won't be earning those salaries past a certain point in their thirties or so, and will generally have to then seek alternative work. Or survive on what they saved in their peak years.

But yes, it's kind of crazy that some people earn in a day more than many others in the same society earn in a year.

[Tyndmyr]

If I see someone wasting their time to fulfill a social construct of beauty, I will comment about.

If you saw someone trying to put the ocean inside a water bottle one drop at a time, wouldn't you point out how inane that is? Same thing.

Running a mile is exactly as healthy if you're doing it outta vanity or concern for your health. Note that caring about how you look can also be practical for a number of reasons. Plenty of social advantages to be had by being attractive. Now, this ain't really something I pursue, but it's not irrational or anything.

Your body doesn't really care why you place demands on it. Going to the gym or not is ultimately up to you, and you can certainly work out in all manner of other ways. Manual labor can be good exercise, so shufflin' boxes around, chopping wood, or whatever else on the regular can be quite healthy. If your lifestyle doesn't offer this, a gym might be more convenient than other things. But if you wanna buy a bike and bike around your neighborhood, that's fine too. Or do the same exercises at home. Nothing magic about the gym.

[anjxed]

To be on topic though, exercising is one way to stay healthy. Seriously, even if you are not obese or anything. There will come a time that you will need your strength or endurance or whatever to help get you through.

Ps. I think you are a troll. Seriously

[obryn]

Wow.

OP, are you serious here, or are you putting us on?

I don't think you need a gym or an understanding of sports. I think you need to re-evaluate your approach to other people and life's experiences. You sound angry and discontented, with a lack of empathy for people who view life differently. It's not "I don't like sports," it's a tirade about how enjoyment of sport is immoral. It's not "I don't like going to the gym," it's "the gym is symbolic of vanity and vain people go there."

It sounds pretty miserable.

[Comrade]

Wow.

OP, are you serious here, or are you putting us on?

I don't think you need a gym or an understanding of sports. I think you need to re-evaluate your approach to other people and life's experiences. You sound angry and discontented, with a lack of empathy for people who view life differently. It's not "I don't like sports," it's a tirade about how enjoyment of sport is immoral. It's not "I don't like going to the gym," it's "the gym is symbolic of vanity and vain people go there."

It sounds pretty miserable.

This is par for the course from The Eye. They have a bad habit of creating threads with seemingly innocuous purposes ('How can someone be fit without going to the gym?' 'Why do people care so much about appearance?') and then using the initial premise to spiral off into vitriol against... something or other. People have advised them to keep their invective and judgement to themselves (or, if they're just trolling, to quit wasting their time), but as this thread attests, they've not taken that advice.

[The Eye]

I wonder what your opinion is on Singers, Actors and Writers?

I love acting, it's a great form of art, but it's also stupid that they are able to buy huge houses and make more money than some people will make in a lifetime.

They are also part of the "looks are more important than what you do" segment I hate.

EDIT: Besides I'm not in favor of living a non-active life, I just think that people can be active without doing inane tasks. Such as jumping up and down in the same spot, or riding a bike that takes you nowhere. I’m sorry if such opinions were offensive, that’s not what I meant.

[Rynjin]

Weight training is time-efficient, especially for people looking to lose weight. You can do a twenty minute workout with weights or two hours of cardio and get more weight loss benefits from the weight training. Big muscles are actually in and of themselves useful for losing weight since they require more calories to operate, relative to having the same amount of extra tissue as fat.

Also, sit-ups and crunches suck. Save your back the trouble and do squats instead. Squats work the legs and entire core instead of just the abs with one movement. Push-ups and pull-ups are good though, and if you really hate any kind of strength training but like to jog by all means do what you enjoy. But if you don't like working out but want a healthier body and want to make the best use of your time, strength training is the way to go.

Like I said, "after a point", not "completely pointless entirely". If you're weight training to the point it starts to impact your flexibility (like a lot of people seem to see as the ideal) you've gone too far.

I'd add rock climbing walls to that list - and it's a pretty significant list. Weights are ridiculously expensive even if you have the space for them, and then there's a good chance that you'll have to shell out some money for a specialized lifting platform as well. Rock climbing walls are entirely out of the budget of anyone who's not in the habit of assigning specialized activity rooms in their mansion, with even rock climbing equipment being pretty pricey (and I really wouldn't recommend going anywhere near an actual climb unless you're already in good shape).

I've never been to a gym with a rock wall. If I wasn't so irrationally afraid of heights I'd seek one out, it sounds neat.

[Sobol]

Besides I'm not in favor of living a non-active life, I just think that people can be active without doing inane tasks. Such as jumping up and down in the same spot, or riding a bike that takes you nowhere.

You can work as a builder's laborer, a stevedore... Doing something useful and getting enough physical activity at the same time.

But people can't be all physical workers. Those who write computer programs etc. - have to get their physical activity elsewhere.

[warty goblin]

EDIT: Besides I'm not in favor of living a non-active life, I just think that people can be active without doing inane tasks. Such as jumping up and down in the same spot, or riding a bike that takes you nowhere. I’m sorry if such opinions were offensive, that’s not what I meant.

My job is sitting in front of a computer for eight hours a day, five days a week. There is basically no way to make this actually active, which is fine.

So I do active stuff in the evening. Usually weights, followed by running. I'm sure some people would consider running the same couple of routes all the time inane, but it's quite often the best part of my day. Besides the health benefits, I find it improves my clarity of thought and general mental state immensely, and enduring the discomfort it involves substantially improves my mood. Weights and such are boring, but I enjoy being strong enough to do things with my body that my desk job alone wouldn't allow. And yeah, I like the way I look because of it, the first day I noticed I had visible stomach muscles or biceps that noticeably flexed were exciting. I'm unsure why exactly wanting to be somebody my girlfriend finds attractive is a bad thing.

[SaintRidley]

I'm above such petty aesthetic thing.

Many go to the gym, something I will never understand, the fact that people pay to go to machines to suffer pain in other to fit what our society say is beautiful strikes as something out of a dystopian novel or movie.

Spoiler: What comes to my mind when I see a gym:

Show

*snip*

My main discourse is how the world we live in cares more about what we look than what we are, if I go on working on having a body like that I would be betraying my own philosophy so I feel like I should not do it.

So above being petty about aesthetics.

[2D8HP]

I love acting, it's a great form of art, but it's also stupid that they are able to buy huge houses and make more money than some people will make in a lifetime.....

You're prechin' to the choir here! I see Eye to Eye with you, The Eye!

AFTER THE REVOLUTION COMES, and I'M KING OF CALIFORNIA, those overpaid folks will GET THEIR WAGONS FIXED!!!

After the AD&D RE-EDUCATION CAMPS are established OF COURSE.



But I wouldn't hold my breath waiting.

[Brother Oni]

That's something professional chess players understood long ago (about the middle of the 20th century) - that you shouldn't just sit all day long with a board analyzing positions. Look at the latest World Chess Championship, for example: both contestants had official physical trainers (Brede Kvisvik for Magnus Carlsen, Anna Chakvetadze for Sergey Karjakin).

The advantages of physical fitness has been well understood since ancient times - Socrates himself had a saying (paraphrased): “No man has the right to be an amateur in the matter of physical training. It is a shame for a man to grow old without seeing the beauty and strength of which his body is capable”.
His student Plato's name was derived from platon meaning 'broad' as a indicator of his physically robust figure.

Some more digging has indicated that the Buddha also has words on the subject, but I'm unsure I can quote them on this site.

[tomandtish]

Working out is also a good thing for people with diabetes, it helps keep our blood sugar levels down, which in turn make our A1c levels down, which makes our doctors very happy with us. Sadly I can't "work" out, but I do like to go on 15-20 minute walks, which always does wonders for my blood sugar levels, and it also burns off some excess calories and helps keep my weight down, which ALSO makes my body healthier and helps me produce more insulin naturally, thus again, keeping my blood sugar/A1c levels down. Lots and lots of "health" reasons to work out to the best of ones abilities, I'd honestly wager that most people that do work out, are doing so for the health benefits, as opposed to the vanity reasons you ascribe to them.

Have to second this. I dropped my A1c from 9.0 to 4.9 in a year just by some minor diet changes and walking regularly.

[Shamash]

"Self love my liege is not so vile a sin as self neglect".

I totally get this hateful attitude toward sports; I also had this conflict sometime ago.

I wanted to have a hunky body but I felt that it went against all I stand for, but that's a very childish point of view, the world is not divided in intellectuals and barbarians, that's silly, you can enjoy sports AND like books, rpgs and geek stuff.

The problem here seems that you believe in stereotypes, you think that jocks are dumb and muscular, geeks and nerds and smart and skinny, but that's not how the world works, people are just people you don't have to be X to be Z, that's something media created.

I used to hate the idea of going to the gym, but as often hate goes, it was unfounded based on prejudices, and once I went there it's actually a very cool atmosphere.


Here have the video that motivated me to go:

Spoiler

Show

In world where this guy gets so much more money than these guys, truly show us how decadent our society really is.

Yeah, with this I have to agree with you, that is the perfect illustration of how our civilization is a failure, that's why the aliens haven't called yet. >:(

[scalyfreak]

Like I said, "after a point", not "completely pointless entirely". If you're weight training to the point it starts to impact your flexibility (like a lot of people seem to see as the ideal) you've gone too far.

Or at the very least you have forgotten that stretching and various forms of yoga are a great way to get the most out of your muscle building routine.

[90,000]

Oh, that thread title is magical. I wonder if we could improve famous quotes with that suffix.

I only regret, that I have but one life to lose for my country. Also, I hate sports.

And as imagination bodies forth
The forms of things unknown, the poet’s pen
Turns them to shapes and gives to airy nothing
A local habitation and a name.
Also, I hate sports.

Master your instrument, master the music, and then forget all that bull**** and just play. Also, I hate sports.

Science is organised knowledge. Wisdom is organised life. Also, I hate sports.

A man will be imprisoned in a room with a door that's unlocked and opens inwards; as long as it does not occur to him to pull rather than push. Also I hate sports.

You miss 100% of the shots you don't take. Also, I hate sports.

Outstanding. Absolutely outstanding.

[ImperiousLeader]

I hesitate to offer this option, because I don't think a judgemental personality is the right fit, but my exercise of choice is dance. Specifically, partner dancing. Ballroom, Swing, Salsa, etc. When I go out for a night of Lindy Hop (a form of swing dance), I bring at least three changes of shirts, because I get a workout. But it never feels like one.

Fast dances offer cardio. Partnership requires communication and being a good partner. Feeling and adapting to music engages the brain, which, I get bored in the gym. Dance gets you in tune with your body as you have to think about how you move.

And, yes, I know dancers who can get very good bodies just through dance. Most supplement with other things, but, well, this guy claims he got his body purely through dancing.

[Tvtyrant]

Is that possible? Can someone have such a super hero build without going to such horrible places?

I must confess that I don't envy him, since despite some times wanting to have a body like that I like to think I'm above such petty aesthetic thing.

My main discourse is how the world we live in cares more about what we look than what we are, if I go on working on having a body like that I would be betraying my own philosophy so I feel like I should not do it.

Beauty is a transient thing not worth that amount of time and dedication.

I'm just curios. I don’t plan to go against my principles and hatred toward everything sport related.

Yes, having a decent body is possible without gyms. Ways to get them include rowing, swimming, and doing general body workouts.

But why though? When you are more in shape you get sick less often, have better sex and are less likely to get long term illnesses.

So is food, human life, glaciers, the sun and the very universe. Life is short, do things you enjoy. Being in shape is a mechanism for achieving more enjoyment.

Spoiler

Show

I understand not liking competitive sports, or even other people (I have been there.) But I also enjoy sweeping vistas, swimming for long periods of time, and being master of my body. The secret to life is doing everything for yourself, every other motivation will leave you bitter and disillusioned.

[Sobol]

Oh, that thread title is magical. I wonder if we could improve famous quotes with that suffix.

Spoiler

Show

Sorry :)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carthago_delenda_est

[fire_insideout]

Like I said, "after a point", not "completely pointless entirely". If you're weight training to the point it starts to impact your flexibility (like a lot of people seem to see as the ideal) you've gone too far.

But this is true for any physical (and non-physical) activity where mobility isn't part of the movements themselves. Heck, most desk workers today have a incredibly inflexible upper back and hip due to the rigid position they work in (Source: I am one, and I have to work a lot on my mobility).

Also, weight training exercises like squatting (especially variants like front squat and over head squat) and over head press (including the jerk-motions) will actually make you more mobile when done correctly since you are stretching your muscles at the same time as you are working out, in the same sense as yoga.

[90,000]

Spoiler

Show

Sorry :)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carthago_delenda_est

I really want this to take off.

[Eldan]

Oh, that thread title is magical. I wonder if we could improve famous quotes with that suffix.

Outstanding. Absolutely outstanding.

Ooh, that sounds way more fun than reading another tirade by The Eye.

The only thing we have to fear is fear itself. Also, I hate sports.

A wizard is never late, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to. Also, I hate sports.

Perfection is achieved, not when there is nothing more to add, but when there is nothing left to take away. Also, I hate sports.

The person who reads too much and uses his brain too little will fall into lazy habits of thinking. Also, I hate sports.

Without music, life would be a mistake. Also, I hate sports.

Edit: You're right, it's fun in Latin, too.

Vir sapit qui pauca loquitur. Ceterum, odi ludos.

Dulce bellum inexpertis. Ceterum, odi ludos.

Gladiator in arena consilium capit. Ceterum, odi ludos.