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2019-08-20, 04:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
Last edited by Squire Doodad; 2019-08-20 at 04:53 PM.
An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2019-08-20, 04:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
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2019-08-20, 04:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
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2019-08-20, 04:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
Do you guys think a low WIS Cleric would use more or less divine energy?
Presumably a low WIS Cleric would drain less and use it less often, but maybe a higher WIS Cleric would be more efficient at doing so?An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2019-08-20, 04:59 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
Oh, huh, I don't think that's how it works. Why would people getting killed in his name send him their souls? The souls of the goblins okay, but their victims presumably continued on to their normal afterlives. always read that as the fact that he was so important to so many goblins that they worked themselves up to a year-long frenzy in his name being the important part. So many of them believed in him so much that his soul was transformed.
That's circular. He would need worship before becoming a god to ascend. He would need to be a part of people's lives while still active on the Mortal Plane. Murderous liches are dime a dozen, if all you needed to become a god was to murder enough people there would be a whole lot more. the Dark One was a visonnary that united an entire people behind him. Xykon is leagues behind.Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2019-08-20, 05:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2019-08-20, 05:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2017
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- France
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2019-08-20, 05:04 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-08-20, 05:07 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
An explanation of why MitD being any larger than Huge is implausible.
See my extended signature here! May contain wit, candor, and somewhere from 52 to 8127 walruses.
Purple is humorous descriptions made up on the fly
Green is serious talk about hypothetical
Blue is irony and sarcasm
"I think, therefore I am,
I walk, therefore I stand,
I sleep, therefore I dream;
I joke, therefore I meme."
-Squire Doodad
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2019-08-20, 05:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
Jeez. Never thought I see Loki walking away looking like that.
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2019-08-20, 05:15 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
It's the Dedication thing. The big old burst of belief energy you get just from mortals dying and releasing their soul energy. The idea is that the Goblins consecrating it to the memory of the Dark One meant he got enough Devotion (and the rest of the stuff from the Goblins who worshipped him) to ascend.
Or at least that was my understanding when I read the story of him ascending.
Depends on if enough Devotions would do it, or if you actually needed Worship and Belief first too. But the other point is that BY massacring enough people that it would propel him to Godhood, he would strike fear into the hearts of the rest of the world. Killing Azure City isn't going to do it. He needs to massacre like most of the civilized world and put himself far above other murder happy liches.
I mean the Dark one didn't get power because a bunch of Goblins worked themselves up into a frothing frenzy over him, it was because they wiped out almost all the Humans until the Elves and Dwarves stepped in to make there be peace. (Start of Darkness)
But if double crosses the Dark One to save the world, I'm not sure if he'll get that coveted position."Besides, you know the saying: Kill one, and you are a murderer. Kill millions, and you are a conqueror. Kill them all, and you are a god." -- Fishman
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2019-08-20, 05:20 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
Where did it say he was trying to teach Hel a lesson?
I don't remember that scene. I just thought the god of mischief was playing a clever prank on his daughter.
With worlds being temporary, any hurt would be temporary... except that they might be able to preserve this world, and that would kill Hel.
Also, what would admitting anything do? The wager was in the design of the new world. It's baked into the world, and when the world ends, the condition ends. (Stated in this strip, too)
They build a new world with new rules.
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2019-08-20, 05:21 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
I disagree that Loki was bound by such mortal limitations that the logical outcome of the bet would surprise him (assuming that Hel would, indeed, die from this, which is a belief I do not share, but for the purposes of the argument and all).
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2019-08-20, 05:22 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
I, for one, have no sympathy for Hel. The only reason she is dying is because she chose to make her afterlife such a terrible place. She actively enslaves and tortures the souls she gets, which is exactly why the dwarves don't want to go to her plane. If she was kind to those souls she could have easily become one of the more powerful gods in this world. The dwarves could have ended up a pacifist culture that scorns violence, where dwarves always seek to pass away peacefully into the loving embrace of Hel. Instead she chose to torment her souls, so the dwarves have to be honorable or suffer eternally. She made her bed, now she must lie in it. If she dies then the bet is rendered null, and everyone is better off with one less evil god.
Compare that to the Dark One, whose afterlife is a great reward for his followers, at least by goblin standards.Last edited by flyinglemur; 2019-08-20 at 05:24 PM.
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2019-08-20, 05:27 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-08-20, 05:30 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-08-20, 05:32 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
Again, how could the goblins hijack that energy? In that comic this energy is clearly going to Thor not to whatever deity the bugbear followed. TDO would get the Dedication and Souls of the goblins that died in his name but why would he get those of the people they killed?
The Gods need four energy sources, it stands to reason that to become a good you need to gather some quantity of each. TDO had all, Xykon assuming he could somehow hijack Devotion and managed to trap souls on a large scale would still be missing two.
"Over the centuries, certain powerful elves had managed to attract enough of a group of followers that they were able to become gods themselves. [...] Now this horrific year of violence dedicated to one single man served to raise the Dark One's spirit, too."
Sounds like the important part is having many devoted followers. Murderizing a continent is simply how the goblins chose to express that devotion.Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2019-08-20, 05:33 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-08-20, 05:36 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
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Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2019-08-20, 05:37 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-08-20, 05:37 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
Didn't Loki propose The Bet as a way of teaching Hel a lesson in an attempt to modify her behaviour. Insofar as we can project human parenting ideals onto evil gods who are literal embodiments of death, disease, trickery etc, this was intended to be a parent revealing some wisdom to his child. He wasn't just doing this for shots and goggles.
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2019-08-20, 05:39 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
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Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2019-08-20, 05:40 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-08-20, 05:40 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-08-20, 05:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-08-20, 05:43 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
On TDO's ascension, I think you just need the four forms of nutrition in such large amounts that it's hard to get.
Pretty much all the goblins Believed in him and his goal. They Worshipped him as their saviour. They Dedicated themselves to his cause. And with them being naught but sources of XP in the eyes of the other gods, their Souls were free to join him.
Quite frankly I'd guess the main reason why TDO is unique with forming a new quiddity is because a) no god had bothered with goblin souls in any significant quantity, and b) if a character from a PC race reaches that level of importance some god most likely takes notice and puts themselves up as that character's patron, thus ensuring that the new godling joins that pantheon rather than splitting off into their own.Last edited by Worldsong; 2019-08-20 at 05:50 PM.
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2019-08-20, 05:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-08-20, 05:48 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
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2019-08-20, 05:56 PM (ISO 8601)
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2019-08-20, 06:05 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1176 - The Discussion Thread
'Utúlie'n aurë! Aiya Eldalië ar Atanatári, utúlie'n aurë! “The day has come! Behold, people of the Eldar and Fathers of Men, the day has come!" And all those who heard his great voice echo in the hills answered, crying:'Auta i lómë!" The night is passing!"