OOTS #1212 - The Discussion Thread

[The Giant]

New comic is up.

[super dark33]

I am going to bugbear-debate anyone on any topic from now on.

[Nemoricus]

Describing battle between clerics of different beliefs as "spirited philosophical debate" always amuses me.

And good on Minrah for calling Redcloak out.

[nrwillick]

Oona is wise, pretty words are pretty.

[Omomuro]

Man, Redcloak's getting a real philosophical pummelling (and real pummelling) in this one.

[Quebbster]

I have missed Greyview.

[Aron Times]

Oh man, this is kind of like when Xykon and the Monster in the Darkness just stood there watching Miko beat the crap out of Redcloak.

[hroþila]

Minrah is spitting so much truth and she's hitting so close to home than even Redcloak might end up having to face the facts at this rate. I don't expect him to drop Plan A (at least not until the very end), but he might be forced to stop thinking of Plan B as a viable alternative? He doesn't have so much riding on that, emotionally speaking. It probably won't happen right now but if this has sowed a seed of doubt in his mind about Plan B that could be very important later on.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

I have missed Greyview.

He is the absolute best. But I do have to also agree with Oona: sometimes, they are very pretty words indeed.

Grey Wolf

[Fyraltari]

I see why Oona is leader of her tribe. Much wisdom, yes.

Also, how odd is it, that Oona and V have the same idea of the degree of violence a typical religious (talkingaboutinuniverseheremodsdon’thurtme) debate entails?

[Shale]

A world with just humans? 2/10, would not recommend

[elros]

How many levels does Maxrah have? I think she must have some ranks in intimidation with those burns.

[Shining Wrath]

Bugbear politics are similar to two year old politics.

Maxrah has definitely earned herself a spot on Redcloak's to-do list. Which may be fatal next episode - she didn't like Unholy Blight very well. OTOH, she lit Redcloak up pretty well there. Why Durkon doesn't get them both the hell out of Dodge confuzzles me.

If Oona is hearing and believing at least a little, what about Xykon?

[Andrew Markham]

Minrah is really bringing something special to OOTS. Her perspective is...refreshingly direct. Maybe cause she sees things from an outside perspective. Either way, I love her contributions so far.

[Fyraltari]

Why Durkon doesn't get them both the hell out of Dodge confuzzles me.

How do you propose he does that?

If Oona is hearing and believing at least a little, what about Xykon?

He might be, but there’s not many places he could be hiding. Can he cast flight and invisibility silently?

[BaronOfHell]

Minrah is spitting so much truth and she's hitting so close to home than even Redcloak might end up having to face the facts at this rate.

The way I see it, much of this is news to RC, and it is really a lot of information at once, where he doesn't know what is true. Therefore it is next to impossible to gather what RC will take out of this debate and what he may forget to create a coherent world view that still fits his own beliefs.

[EmperorSarda]

I think this means Oona's life is forfeit. And Greyview's.

As soon as Durkon and MAXrah leave, Redcloak has no choice to silence them unless they (accidentally or otherwise) spill the beans to Xykon.

[Metastachydium]

Redcloak (…) might end up having to face the facts at this rate. I don't expect him to drop Plan A (at least not until the very end), but he might be forced to stop thinking of Plan B as a viable alternative?

Well, he definitely should. Plan B is just stupid, wrong and should not sound particularly good from his perspective.

[hroþila]

The way I see it, much of this is news to RC, and it is really a lot of information at once, where he doesn't know what is true. Therefore it is next to impossible to gather what RC will take out of this debate and what he may forget to create a coherent world view that still fits his own beliefs.

I didn't mean the bit about the Dark One not surviving the transition between worlds, I meant the bit where he's putting imaginary potential goblins ahead of real living ones. That bit was always true about the Plan as formulated by Redcloak himself.

[Schroeswald]

I love when we spend a week debating random ideas and “why didn’t [blank] happen”, and then [blank] happens on the very next page

[Fyraltari]

I think this means Oona's life is forfeit. And Greyview's.

As soon as Durkon and MAXrah leave, Redcloak has no choice to silence them unless they (accidentally or otherwise) spill the beans to Xykon.

This rather depends on how many people get here before the fight is over.

Killing witnesses doesn’t work when people witness you doing it.

[Griffincat]

Minrah's not wrong - everyone that Redcloak truly loved (his siblings and parents) are already gone.

[Nightcanon]

Superb! Go Minrah! Interesting to hear Oona's perspective on this too- I doubt she'd be hugely keen to be sacrificed to the greater glory of the goblin bargaining position in the next world.

[Metastachydium]

The way I see it, much of this is news to RC, and it is really a lot of information at once, where he doesn't know what is true. Therefore it is next to impossible to gather what RC will take out of this debate and what he may forget to create a coherent world view that still fits his own beliefs.

Exactly. Believing stuff you cannot verify which comes from your enemies is anything but rational, especially if your believing it would be convenient for them and extremely inconvenient for you.

[EmperorSarda]

Killing witnesses doesn’t work when people witness you doing it.

Redcloak is patient enough to wait for the right time to take them out. Either way, they're a liability to him now.

Unrelated, but something Oona didn't say about why she didn't jump in first is that Redcloak attacked first. She seems the type of bugbear to care about that sort of thing, fairness and all.
Besides, even with this fighting, they're still trying to convince Redcloak. Redcloak is the one trying to kill them. She probably thinks he doesn't need the help.

[EmperorSarda]

Oh, and this whole exchange with Redcloak validates Roy's reasoning for wanting to take Xykon out first, then negotiate with Redcloak.

With Xykon out of the picture then there is no hope for the plan. That's the only way Redcloak is going to listen, if he even does.

[Bartok]

I wonder if this Redcloak must die, and the artefact cloak's next wearer will be the one to heal the world...

[Metastachydium]

Besides, even with this fighting, they're still trying to convince Redcloak. Redcloak is the one trying to kill them. She probably thinks he doesn't need the help.

And, in fact, Redcloak's doing fine. Thus far he bloodied both his opponents, found a way to keep one busy and had the time to heal himself up.

[EmperorSarda]

I wonder if this Redcloak must die, and the artefact cloak's next wearer will be the one to heal the world...

Are there any other clerics of the Dark One capable of casting 9th level spells?

[HolyDraconus]

I do find it interesting that Oona was willing to let the debating continue. And has heard both parties arguments, enough so that even with the reveal of listening will probably continue to stay on the sideline. Redcloak dismissed the claim about the Dark One not making it, but considering that neither cleric is trying to kill him and is STILL trying to debate him, he may have to own up to some things he didnt want to sooner rather than later.

Pretty sure Roy isn't an idiot and even after shooting down Durkons plan, will know that he did it anyway once he noticed he was missing and immediately planned around it. Im not going to be surprised if the gang shows up to interrupt this.