How much warning is enough?

[Ghostwheel]

When you are the DM, how do you decide how much to warn your players that a significant and/or dangerous encounter is about to occur?

I have had some bad experiences where, in retrospect, I should have given some signal to the players that they needed to "gird up" but did not. I have also ran encounters that the players were given too many hints.

Where, and how, do you draw the line?

[Gaiyamato]

My players start to get the point when I start describing things in reeeeeaaalllly fine detail.

[JeminiZero]

My players start to get the point when I start describing things in reeeeeaaalllly fine detail.

Because of something like this?

[Xenre]

I give them no warning whatsoever. They are supposed to be seasoned warriors and adventurers. An axiom as old a time: Expect the unexpected.

If they aren't prepared, they suffer the consequences.

The dice don't care whose side you are on. Good? Bad? I'm the one with the Crit.

[Ghostwheel]

Because of something like this?

Supercool. Have a

[Ghostwheel]

I give them no warning whatsoever. They are supposed to be seasoned warriors and adventurers. An axiom as old a time: Expect the unexpected.

If they aren't prepared, they suffer the consequences.

The dice don't whose side you are on. Good? Bad? I'm the one with the Crit.

I think that you meant that "the dice don't know which side you are on."

True, but the DM needs to try and keep it fun for everybody. Including himself.

[Narmoth]

Listen and spot-checks maybe. But really, they should expect to be attacked at any time without warning

[ghost_warlock]

Listen and spot-checks maybe. But really, they should expect to be attacked at any time without warning

...by a mindflayer riding a beholder.

[Irreverent Fool]

Players will continue to do stupid things from time to time.

I once had a party of appropriately paranoid adventurers running through a labyrinth. When they reached the central chamber, the mage boldly stepped forward. I described the chamber as made of the same stone but blackened and charred, along with a pair of black skeletons laying in heaps near the sides of the wall. He wisely cast detect magic and I told him there was a moderate aura of evocation lingering in the room.

He walks in and steps on the fireball trap and dies spectacularly in a 10d10 explosion of pure awesome.

The player was mad and said 'how was I supposed to know there was a trap?'

obnoxious
sig

[Josh the Aspie]

For PBP games, I make an int / wis / knowledge / survival / etc check for each of the characters involved who has any reasonable chance of knowing the information.

For example, if they're talking about putting a halfling in a portable hole, or taking a handy haversack into a rope trick, I do a silent knowledge: arcana roll. If they make a reasonable check, depending on the effect (say, 15 for the above example), I quote the relevant passage of the text to them in a PM, and then leave it at that. If they still choose to go ahead with it, I let them. It's their choice.

Or I might roll a spellcraft check for a spell-caster that is about to cast a spell that will envelop his allies, if I think he isn't thinking about it.

The players should really already know the effects and rules as written on their equipment or spells. This is meta-knowledge. At this point, I'm testing to see if their characters remembered something they did not, and giving them another chance at not being teh shtuupit.

[Shinizak]

Players will continue to do stupid things from time to time.

I once had a party of appropriately paranoid adventurers running through a labyrinth. When they reached the central chamber, the mage boldly stepped forward. I described the chamber as made of the same stone but blackened and charred, along with a pair of black skeletons laying in heaps near the sides of the wall. He wisely cast detect magic and I told him there was a moderate aura of evocation lingering in the room.

He walks in and steps on the fireball trap and dies spectacularly in a 10d10 explosion of pure awesome.

The player was mad and said 'how was I supposed to know there was a trap?'

obnoxious
sig

Was he that much a 'tard? Saying that there is an evocation ANYTHING is like saying "do you open the spiked chest with the blood stained target in front of it?"

[aivanther]

I've never been a DM, but I, as a player, am a firm believer in RPG Darwinism, the stupid die and either learn from their mistakes or get killed so many times they give up.

I had one part that the thief chose the marching order in the middle of group, ranger in the back, with the gnome mage up front. My monk politely suggested a scout and some more beef upfront. Apparently, the gnome thought he was sneaky, so he went scouting...

Then, DM finally had it (or so I though anyway), and when the gnome wizard tried to flank a group of goblins, they spitted him pretty bad. My monk, a Lawful Neutral guy who had long established his idea of universal karma, nodded solemnly at him as he died, telling him he got what he deserved.

Interestingly, *I* was the one ejected from that group. Ah well, not a group worth playing with anyway.

[Foryn Gilnith]

Because people tend to react poorly to being told their characters' deaths are deserved? Lack of caution IRL is worse than lack of caution in-game.

[Altima]

None? Since switching to 4e, most of the powers can be used repeatedly in a day. Once the party starts getting curb-stomped, and their encounter powers aren't cutting it, their reasoning for using daily powers switches to "Well, I can't use these if I'm dead!"

I admit that it is a tad harder in 3.5, what with spell hording and such.

Still, whenever I design campaigns, I always make a few cut-out plans in case of a party wipe. It's not on purpose (usually), but sometimes whether through a miscalculation of mob strength, bad luck, or player stupidity, it happens.

Oh, FYI, wizards really hate being sold into slavery and losing their spell/ritual books. Same with warriors and their +1 swords of asskicking. But serves them right, in some cases.

[quick_comment]

It depends on the encounter.

Telling them that beyond the door they smell a dragon is ok.

Having a bunch of ninjas drop down from the ceiling without warning is also ok. It depends on the encounter.

[annoyinglizardv]

However much warning makes sense plot-wise.
A battle can be spotted from miles away, but a supprise raid isn't going to give an advanced warning or anything.
Supprise traps are okay as long as there's some sense to them being there. A castle (currently lived) isn't going to have anyway near as many traps as long sealed tomb.