Need an ecl for a players "race"

[lyko555]

Ok i started a 1 shot tomb of horrors today but 1 of the characters brought a homebrew race.
Ok so to start out it has a constant detect magic on him, as well as the ability to "teleport" without error. Mind you he can sense where the safe spot to land is. Within 50 feet. At will as a free action. What type of la would that cost ?

[quick_comment]

It depends what level you are playing at.

At level 17? +1, teleportation is common

At level 1? I wouldnt allow it, long range teleportation should be impossible.

[lyko555]

well he has it at will as a free action >.<

maybe i should change the forum to looking for a la
and the lvl setting is currently 12

[quick_comment]

well he has it at will as a free action >.<

I would not allow this race

[lyko555]

Yeah im currently on the idea to never let him run a character without a close inspection of his sheet again. and somehow hes running that as
a 0 la race >.<

[Masaioh]

Did he make this himself, or did he take it from another source?

Maybe you could make it a standard action 3/day, and give him a reasonable LA like +2 or +3.

[sofawall]

Ok i started a 1 shot tomb of horrors today but 1 of the characters brought a homebrew race.
Ok so to start out it has a constant detect magic on him, as well as the ability to "teleport" without error. Mind you he can sense where the safe spot to land is. Within 50 feet. At will as a free action. What type of la would that cost ?

Do not allow that race. It is a trap. He can move infinitely during his turn with no chance of repercussions. Free action teleport at will? No, do not allow. MAYBE swift, but even then it's really good. I wouldn't allow it, full stop.

[Faleldir]

As a free action? You do realize he can take infinite free actions per round, right? That means infinite Shadow Pounce. At the very least, make it a swift action.

[quick_comment]

To do this with feats would require a spell like ability of greater teleport, then taking the quicken spell like ability feat for greater teleport. This is impossible pre epic. And even then, its only once per round.

So a level 22 character could do a quickened greater teleport as an SLA only 3 times per day, and your player wants this at will, more than once per round?

LA +10.

[Fiendish_Dire_Moose]

To do this with feats would require a spell like ability of greater teleport, then taking the quicken spell like ability feat for greater teleport. This is impossible pre epic. And even then, its only once per round.

So a level 22 character could do a quickened greater teleport as an SLA only 3 times per day, and your player wants this at will, more than once per round?

LA +10.

This. Teleport is powerful. Teleport at will is over powered. Perfect teleportation at will as a free action is literally epic+. I can't think of a monster that has it. Unless your game is 30+, don't give them it. and with Tomb of Horrors, they'll teleport past all traps. DON'T GIVE IT TO THEM.

[lyko555]

Yeah i killed it right off the bat as stupidly broken. It just irks me that he didnt even try to give it an la. He quote "never finished statting it up" i think it might have also given him umd as a skill as well.

[Fiendish_Dire_Moose]

Yeah i killed it right off the bat as stupidly broken. It just irks me that he didnt even try to give it an la. He quote "never finished statting it up" i think it might have also given him umd as a skill as well.

Yeah, at that point you roll your eyes and tell him he can be either a gnome, or an elf, for the rest of any time he plays your games. Maybe then he'll stop trying to pull one over on his DM.

[lyko555]

nah i think im gonna make him be a dwarven bard .

[Ozymandias9]

Ok i started a 1 shot tomb of horrors today but 1 of the characters brought a homebrew race.
Ok so to start out it has a constant detect magic on him, as well as the ability to "teleport" without error. Mind you he can sense where the safe spot to land is. Within 50 feet. At will as a free action. What type of la would that cost ?

A 50 foot errorless teleport at will as a free action is... problematic. Its particularly powerful, but not particularly versatile for combat purposes. Heck, 50 foot base movement would probably be worthy of a LA of 1, and this is much much better. Is there a particular reason that that cannot be scaled back?

If not, we need more information to go on. I generally do this by first desigining a MM entry for the race. Since the PC is bringing this race in, I assume there is some fluff that will have bearing on the crunch. Is the race fragile or hearty (i.e. how big are the hit die)?
Do they tend to be strong, smart, wise (what do we want to look at as far as ability penalties/bonuses?
Are they particularly capable combatants as a norm (what kind of attack bonuses are we looking at on the racial die)?
Are there any other extraordinary, supernatural, or spell-like abilities? If not, we may honestly need to add some as filler (or buff up the stats) to get the race to a high enough CR that when overcoming the teleport is a reasonable goal, the race wouldn't suddenly fold as a challenge.

In reality, fleshing out this race will require getting close to, if not reaching epic levels.

Edit: The people making infinite movement comments:

Free actions don’t take any time at all, though there may be limits to the number of free actions you can perform in a turn.

Still, swift or move would be at FAR less of an issue.

[lyko555]

I couldnt just make him rewrite a character in the middle of a fight. ( they had just started fighting the gargoyle of doom.) so i made him cut it down as a move action. I do believe he is bringing a monk next game cause im gonna throw that toon through the stripping portal.

[sofawall]

Yes, you can and should. If teleport is the only issue, you damn well can tell him it works differently now.

[Faleldir]

Assuming this SLA is closer to DD than Teleport, just introduce a homebrew monster with Summon Monster IV as a free action at will. If he complains, tell him it's a 4th-level Sor/Wiz Conjuration spell, just like his character.

[ericgrau]

Free action teleport, even swift action teleport is something not normally achievable pre-epic. Dimension door even keeps you from doing other actions after you teleport. A quickened teleport is 9th level. I'm guessing the reason is because a move plus a full round action is considered imba. I'd switch it to a standard action. Even then letting it be at will is pretty strong b/c he'll move past anything and everything that might be remotely dangerous just for kicks. And check other floors, etc. Limiting it to a certain number of times per day would lessen that.

I'm not sure what the LA would be, since I don't know of too many similar things. I'm gonna guess LA 3 or 4.

The detect magic at will is less problematic, but still significant b/c it's at will. I'd make sure he concentrates to do it (standard action each round). Even then it's a great scouting spell when you can spam it that much. Especially since it penetrates wooden doors. But given the teleport at will I'd be tempted to throw it in for free, or at most make in an additional +1 to LA.

[The Glyphstone]

Wait, isn't using any sort of Teleportation in the Tomb basically a fancy means of suicide? Or is that going Ethereal?

[lyko555]

Yes, you can and should. If teleport is the only issue, you damn well can tell him it works differently now.

Oh by rewrite I meant throwing that character sheet out the window and making him play a diffrent toon. I damn well did tell him that i wasnt allowing a lvl 12 character to do it at will as a free actiont that goes against the very action economy of dnd. On another note he may just not know the system that well hes used to 4.0 (ive never played it so dont know the rule changes).
He did try to AoO with a magic staff >.< and gave me deer eyes when i told him he was being stupid.

Wait, isn't using any sort of Teleportation in the Tomb basically a fancy means of suicide? Or is that going Ethereal?

Its going ethereal.

on a side note i did enjoy haveing a target on which i feel no remorse about screwing over. they actually let the gargoyle live, and have camped out for the night safe in a room accsesible only by narrow tunnels so it cant get to them. He some how decided he could cast alarm on every thing and now Mr. Gargoyle is sitting out in the hallway sticking his hand into the alarm and backing away to see it something comes out. roughly evry 15 min or so.

[ericgrau]

What, a magic staff is still a big shaft of wood so I imagine it can still be used as a weapon. Might not be a very effective one, but it doesn't hurt to try (EDIT).

Looks like you'll need to guide him a bit, w/o getting too harsh since he doesn't know better.

[Flickerdart]

What, a magic staff is still a big shaft of wood so I imagine it can still be used as a weapon. Might not be a very effective one, but it doesn't hurt.

I'd assume such a staff would hurt plenty.

[lyko555]

What, a magic staff is still a big shaft of wood so I imagine it can still be used as a weapon. Might not be a very effective one, but it doesn't hurt.

No he was trying to use its cone of cold effect after he had already used it that turn then stepping away and saying if he aproaches me i get to AoO him with it again.

[ericgrau]

Ah, then tell him you can't make AoO's with a bazooka. There's rotating and reloading issues that don't exactly shout "natural reflex".

[lyko555]

Yep i made that very clear.

[Flickerdart]

For LA+0 you could let him reflavour 5ft step in combat as a short-range teleport. In combat only, though: walking through walls that way is worth LA.

[Starbuck_II]

Ok i started a 1 shot tomb of horrors today but 1 of the characters brought a homebrew race.
Ok so to start out it has a constant detect magic on him, as well as the ability to "teleport" without error. Mind you he can sense where the safe spot to land is. Within 50 feet. At will as a free action. What type of la would that cost ?

Make it dimension door: that way he can't do anything after teleporting.

[sofawall]

No he was trying to use its cone of cold effect after he had already used it that turn then stepping away and saying if he aproaches me i get to AoO him with it again.

Wait, stepping away as an AoO is a feat itself, and it means you give up the attack, not in addition to...

He should learn the rules.

[Tyndmyr]

If he wants a bonus, allow him to take two separate five foot steps in combat if he would normally be eligible to take one. This is still quite handy, and doesn't suffer from "look, I can cross the world instantly" imbalance.

Mind you, any custom race should be based on an existing race of the desired ECL. Just trade approximately equal bonuses out.

[lyko555]

Wait, stepping away as an AoO is a feat itself, and it means you give up the attack, not in addition to...

He should learn the rules.

I meant he had used the staff that round and then backed away. expecting to be able to blast again as an AoO. Also i had to spend time telling him that just cause he had made the staff to be activated by pushing a button that triggering it didnt count as a free action >.<