Need caster killing cheese.

[Tyndmyr]

Aright, normal game, need a way to reliably kill a level 17 kender sorc DMPC.

My character:
Grey Elf Elven Generalist(Storm Domain) Wizard 5/Incantatrix 3.
All spells of 4th level or lower are known. I do mean all.
I have a decent collection of about 30 low level scrolls and potions, as well as five eternal wands, and a few regular wands(including a CL 10 wand of Dispel Magic).
Wearing belt of healing, body and head parts of the veil set, and gloves of the starry sky. Plenty of stat boosts attached, resulting in a save DC of 22 for 4th level spells.
I have Fell Drain, Extend, and Persist as my metamagic feats. I also have the lightening reserve feat.
My saves are +5/+8/+14, unbuffed. At least, if, theoretically, I ever were unbuffed.
I'm damn near broke.

My party:
1xNoob Druid.
1xNoob Barb. He dies a lot.
1xRogue/homebrewed skillmonkey class. Good miss chance and skill optimization, great weaponry.
1xRogue/Assassin/Shadowdancer. Moderately competent.

The opponent:
Level 17 demonically possessed Kender Sorc.
Known spells on list: Flesh to Stone, Wall of Force(which he can cast through, oddly enough), Magic Missile, Knock, Teleport(or some other variant in this line), Alter self, and some spell that alters others. Contingency. True Seeing. Silence. He has Silent Spell, and can cast MM spells without taking a full round action.

In the last encounter, I drained eight levels off him, so it's possible he may be weaker in the next fight. He typically uses a Contingent teleport set to half hp.

I know he has less than 100hp, via PW:Pain usage. However, this was after a minor melee hit, so it's possible he has slightly more. He also puts out some pretty decently high save DC spells.


How do I kill him, or better yet, incapacitate him for sure? SoD spam is tempting, but I have no way to ensure that the DM doesn't fudge them, and frankly, phantasmal killer's dual saves are chancy business in the first place. Hp damage isn't likely great due to the contingency, unless I have some way of guaranteeing a huge spike in damage. Be aware that most of my party blindly attack hp regardless, and only the skill monkey rogue can put out hp damage comparable to my blasting(This is a bit sad, actually, since Im not optimized for blasting). The silence/silent spell is a real pain, as is the force wall he can cast through. Dispell ends up being used a lot, but Ive been relying on the expensive wand for the higher CL(I haven't faced him yet at lvl 8, having just dinged). My current tactic is fell drained PW:Pain's.

[dsmiles]

How about giving him a kender spoon of turning and shoving him into a room full of liches?

[Foryn Gilnith]

Get a scroll of Lesser Planar Binding. Bind a Mirror Mephit (Expedition to the Demonweb Pits). Debuff its charisma checks. Convince it to perform the open-ended task of obeying all your instructions. Order it to use simulacrum to make efreeti simulacrums, and order it to order them to give you wishes. Use those wishes to set up a stable wish loop, and kill the mirror mephit. Use your arbitrarily large number of wishes to pwn the kender.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Fill your Bags of Holding and HHH with Explosive Runes. He should detonate himself if he spends any time monologing.

[Tyndmyr]

Fill your Bags of Holding and HHH with Explosive Runes. He should detonate himself if he spends any time monologing.

He does in fact like to monologe. Unfortunately, my deck of cards w explosive runes ends up routinely ignored.

I suspect that any infinite loops are going to be considered to be a bit too ridiculous by all concerned.

As for the other idea...if only I had a room filled with liches. I do have a pet mummy, though, for whatever that's worth. I generally use him seldom enough that, like my familiar, the Dms forget he exists.

[Kylarra]

Explosive runes are probably your most reliable bet, unless he randomly picks up evasion somehow.

[clockworkmonk]

I see an obvious solution. hes Kender, right? so set a Kender catching trap. you are gonna need a sign that says "do not open this bag" and then make a cursed bag. Or use increasingly silly warnings on dangerous things. Warnings like Do Not Bounce. One of these things should catch a kender's attention. and then its a quick death for a kender.

[Kylarra]

I see an obvious solution. hes Kender, right? so set a Kender catching trap. you are gonna need a sign that says "do not open this bag" and then make a cursed bag. Or use increasingly silly warnings on dangerous things. Warnings like Do Not Bounce. One of these things should catch a kender's attention. and then its a quick death for a kender.

He's a DMPC kender which means his kender traits are only going to be beneficial.

[ashmanonar]

You get to use my favorite spell for this caster-killing trick.

It's called Hammergun to the Face.

Its only legitimate target is the DM.

[Tyndmyr]

He's a DMPC kender which means his kender traits are only going to be beneficial.

Mostly. He does frequently steal things though. Not from me, ever(anymore), likely due to the wild variety of horribly lethal things I keep in my HHH and such.

I believe that yes, he does have evasion. Back when he was a PC, he was trying to emulate a rogue.

The goal is to kill it in such a way that it appears quite fair and indisputable to the other players. Thus, the DM that loves him won't be able to magic him back to life.

It's round robin DMing, so he only shows up occasionally.

[Ormagoden]

While caster is sleeping CdG.

[jiriku]

Surrender, then give him the bag of holding contaning all of your treasure. Except, carry a bag of devouring instead and leave your treasure at home.

For a more blasty approach, polymorph the barbarian into something with a godawful high grapple bonus and have the druid wild-shape into a brown bear, hit the kender with dimensional anchor, then have the barbarian and the druid grapple him while you ready actions to counterspell with the wand of dispel magic and the rogue readies an attack to be used when he attempts to cast a spell (forcing a concentration check). If you have the capacity to UMD a scroll of silence, you can automatically counter his silence spell with your own. Once you have him dimensional anchored, grappled and counter-locked, all that beautiful hit point damage should solve your problem quickly.

Other options to consider:
Fell drain the druid's call lightning spell and the druid can whack him with one negative level per round while he's grappled by the barbarian. If you also fell drain his flaming sphere and cast resist fire on the barbarian, and then park the flaming sphere on top of the grapple, the druid could potentially drain him for two levels per round.

If he pops out of the grapple, but you have successfully hit him with dimensional anchor, don't be afraid to use grease, web, evard's black tentacles, or entangle to limit his mobility. The druid can precast freedom of movement on melee characters so that they can move freely through most of those obstacles.

You really want to win initiative against this guy. Consider polymorphing yourself into a high-Dex form, using heroics to give yourself Improved Initiative, casting nerveskitter as you roll initiative, and then hitting him with shock and awe when you catch him flat-footed.

Definitely precast see invisibility in case he goes invisible, and have glitterdust ready to outline him for the benefit of your allies.

[streakster]

1) Obtain tiny amount of Black Lotus poison.

2) Cast minor creation to create vast amount of poison, in open wooden barrel.

3) Fly over him, dump on him.

4) Watch as the kender must make several thousand saves.

5) Dance on its grave.

[Tyndmyr]

He doesn't sleep round us, unfortunately. I would have CdGed him long ago.

Surrendering won't work, as he doesn't consider himself to be fighting us...just "having fun" with us. No, this doesn't make sense to me either.

Silencing him won't do anything thanks to his silent spell(and the fact that I lack it), unfortunately. Dimensional Anchor, though...that's good. I forgot that was 4th level, frankly. Between that and my newfound ability to boost allied caster's spells, that's not bad. He's frankly not that fast, and I always have fly up, so it's not as if he can run away from me. Or the druid or barb.

Hmm, so once pinned, do we just kill him immediately, or wait 24hrs for level drain checks, then continue draining until he runs dry? More complicated, but amazingly permanent.

[Kylarra]

Hmm, so once pinned, do we just kill him immediately, or wait 24hrs for level drain checks, then continue draining until he runs dry? More complicated, but amazingly permanent.

I vote level draining unless you have something better to do with your time.

[wormwood]

Scrounge up 3825 gp for a scroll of PW: Kill. Have someone smack him once to make sure he's at less than 100 hp. Read the scroll.

You'll need a decent CL check to pull it off but, if it works, problem solved.

I realize this plan is not optimal because 1) you said you were broke and 2) it depends on a good roll to succeed. Any suggestions from the peanut gallery as to how we might overcome those obstacles?

[Doc Roc]

I see incantatrix. How much metamagic mojo can you muster? There's a build called the Mail Man that can deliver disproportionately reliable damage. All you need to do is negate his miss chances, doable with likely just true-seeing and true strike, then force a nat twenty using Surge of Fortune. Incantatrix will take care of the rest.

Good luck, and G'dspeed.

[jiriku]

Hmm, so once pinned, do we just kill him immediately, or wait 24hrs for level drain checks, then continue draining until he runs dry? More complicated, but amazingly permanent.

My money says you drain him, wait for him to rise as a wight, then command him with command undead. Now dress him in a stupid-looking outfit and force him to dig latrines, fetch and carry, and do any other undignified work you can think of.

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Fell Drain PW:P. Enervation. Enervation. Enervation. Have the party ready actions to disrupt and use their AoOs to trip. You don't want to risk tripping the contingency.

Also, don't forget that Targeted Dispel Magic can take out Contingency.

[Radar]

Fell Drained Power Word is really neat. Fell Drain is probably the way to go, since the caster ports out, when dealt HP damage. Still you need to hold him in place long enough, to pile up negative levels.

The most obvious solution is within your grasp: Dimensional Anchor (no attack roll, no save, no SR). It has short duration, so keep at least two of those to recast as needed.

Convince your party members (best done in secret from DM), to focus on triping/pinning down (and going for Coup de Grace for one shot kill - you could use a Defenestrating Sphere, to make the sorcerer Prone for them) or non-lethal damage (he won't be loosing HP, so the contingency shouldn't go off). The skill monkey should try to steal his components pouch as soon as possible.

If you could get your hands on a constrictor snake, then thanks to Crushing Coils (Dragon 330) you could grapple him - with low STR he won't be able to win the check against the snake. He would be limited to spells with no somatic components (or forced to use Still Spell and burn hig level slots on weaker spells). Not much, but an almost certain help.

If the caster is blocking the way with Wall of Force, then you can use Fly (also the second level swift version) to just delevel him from above, or use Force Ladder, to get all party members on the other side (the look on DM's face should be priceless).

[Haberdashery]

You could take some Dust of Dryness, absorb a lake with it to make a pellet, then shove it down the kender's mouth. Ker-splode.

[dsmiles]

My money says you drain him, wait for him to rise as a wight, then command him with command undead. Now dress him in a stupid-looking outfit and force him to dig latrines, fetch and carry, and do any other undignified work you can think of.

No, not menial labor...it's too good for a TRUE DMPC...
Continue with the stupid outfit, and make him dance for your amusement...

[Radiun]

Tell a Red Dragon that the DMPC has been talking trash about him/his momma

[Sstoopidtallkid]

No, not menial labor...it's too good for a TRUE DMPC...
Continue with the stupid outfit, and make him dance for your amusement...

Stick the Wight in a BoH. When the next DMPC shows up, use it to level-drain the new DMPC. Now you have a pair of Wights in funny outfits hidden in your extra-dimensional spaces. Continue like this until the DMPCs stop showing up.

As a bonus, you also guarantee that any Kender will get a nasty surprise.

[Douglas]

This depends on your DM being unwilling to fudge his saves beyond plausibility, but Fell Drain Thunderhead would be great. Each casting gets you (eventually) 1 negative level on him per caster level, and he has to make a separate reflex save against each negative level. If you can arrange circumstances so you can cast it, say, five times on him, that's 40 saves vs negative level he'll have to make, and they will get progressively harder because they are not simultaneous, so each save gets a penalty for every previous failed save.

[Anonymouswizard]

Take as many negative energy spells as you can when preparing. When he turns up hit him as as many as you can a round. Use targeted dispel magic or dimensional anchor to stop him teleporting. When you've weakened him with the negative levels send in the BSF. Let him whack him. If he shrugs of the negative levels, did you remember to use enough enervations?

Alternatively, avoid him for a few levels. When you can hit him with a metamagiked enervation then go after him, and use every spell you have to debuff him and remove his contingency. While this happens have the fighter trip him and the rogue deal as much damage to him as possible with his sneak attack.

Final tip: teach the bard to be a supporting character if he isn't already. Tell him as many bardic music tricks as you know.

[dsmiles]

Caster killing cheese, eh?

[Tyndmyr]

Am familiar with the mailman build, but frankly, it doesn't work unless you have metamagic reducers, and it doesn't really come together until high levels. I do have the orb spells, of course, and delivering touch spells isn't much of an issue for me, but 8d8 isn't enough to reliably drop >50% of his hp. I will look up surge of fortune, though, since a crit might in fact do that.

I'm built more defensively, as the standard paranoid mage. I tend to blow about half my slots on buffs for me and the party, and keep most of the rest in reserve, relying on my reserve feat to nuke my way through the light fights.

[Vitruviansquid]

I sense some antipathy towards the DM here, rather than just this character of the DM.

Within that context, my solution to this problem would be to tell the DM, out of character, that the NPC is annoying to the players on an out-of-game level and you'd really rather see him written out.

The problem isn't the specific character. If you're engaging in an arms race with the DM, and somehow you manage to win against this particular DMPC... chances are the DM's going to sic a bigger, badder DMPC on you next session and you're back at square one.

[dsmiles]

I still say...

Caster killing cheese, eh?