Soylent Druid

[Tor the Fallen]

My D&D group is planning to do a jungle themed campaign, beginning at level 1. The classes will be somewhat limited- no fighters, no clerics (probably), scouts instead of rogues.

No one wants to play tank. I and another player want to play druids, someone will probably take scout, another wants wizard.

Both I and another player want to play druids. I'd prefer going the tanking route. At early levels, I'm thinking we'd flank with our animal companions and attack from behind them with longspears.

For levels 1-4, what would be a good way to tank, having only fragile characters? Summon animal?

I'm thinking at level 6 I'll dip a level of monk for the wis bonus to ac and the flurry of blows special attack, and pick up the natural spell feat. Would the dip be worthwhile? Hypothetically I could get a monk's belt, but this would be entirely up to the DMs discretion. I doubt there will be a big shopping mall in the middle of the jungle where I can pick up whatever item I wish.

What feats would be good to take for a tanking druid? Would power attack + shillelagh + THF in dire ape morph be a good route?

Heh, druids remind me of the animorphs. "Battle morphs!"

[marjan]

http://boards1.wizards.com/showthread.php?t=733400
Check this link. That would probably be all that you need.

[Tor the Fallen]

Oh, should have mentioned, I only have access to core 3.0.
No 'polymorph' errata.

[TheOOB]

Soylent Green is People!!!!

ahem...now that's out of the way. A druid should be able to tank fairly well for a party in low levels simply by using a shield. Sure they'll have a smaller AC and less hp then a fighter, but they'll more then make up for it with spells (both healing and buffing). Once you hit level five wild shape makes tanking easy.

[marjan]

Well that limits the options, but there are still some usefull things there that exist in 3.0.

[Tor the Fallen]

If I grab one level of monk, I'd get improved unarmed attack and improved grapple, which would be sweet in, say, dire bear morph.

Question about wild shape:
can I morph into a huge dire ape, as in one that's had HD advancement?

[OOTS_Rules.]

I think that you should only be able to polymorph into creatures that you have encountered. (Of course, with an HD equal or lesser than your character level)

Player: I turn into a Great Wyrm Red Dragon and crush the BBEG!

DM: Have you ever SEEN a dragon.

Player: Uhh, no.

DM: This means that you do not know that it exists. You cannot become what you do not know of. Goodbye! (BBEG uses Slay Living on the player)

[Tor the Fallen]

Nevermind that dragons are actually dragons and not animals....

Backstory:
"My druid grew up in a zoo."

Summon Animal of Appropriate Level.

Knowledge: Nature check.

[Mewtarthio]

I thought this thread was going to be about making either an edible Druid or a cannibal Druid... Imagine my disappointment.

[Thoughtbot360]

This topic reminds me of my old signature. Hey, whatever happened to - oh riiight. I killed him (7th post from the bottom). XD

[Bears With Lasers]

You're going about it the wrong way. A low-level druid isn't a tank--his animal companion is! Get a war-trained Riding Dog, slap some barding on it (studded leather, then chain shirt when you can afford it) and he'll have solid AC and HP for his level. If there's two druids, your riding dogs can flank with each other. They'll be attacking at +5 while flanking, and if they're war-trained, they get the wolf's Trip ability, so they're likely to bring enemies down.

Prioritize your stats this way: WIS, then CON, then DEX. Use ranged weapons. Entangle is your friend, especially in a jungle.

[Tor the Fallen]

You're going about it the wrong way. A low-level druid isn't a tank--his animal companion is! Get a war-trained Riding Dog, slap some barding on it (studded leather, then chain shirt when you can afford it) and he'll have solid AC and HP for his level. If there's two druids, your riding dogs can flank with each other. They'll be attacking at +5 while flanking, and if they're war-trained, they get the wolf's Trip ability, so they're likely to bring enemies down.

Prioritize your stats this way: WIS, then CON, then DEX. Use ranged weapons. Entangle is your friend, especially in a jungle.

Ah, just the man I wanted to see!

Riding dogs for the barding. Got it.
That was essentially my plan- use the animal companions. However, I was going to use longspears, as -4 to ranged attack into melee is pretty crummy, esp. with 3/4 BAB. We use a pretty high method of stat gen- 4d6, drop the lowest, then do that 3 times. Pick the best set. I will very likely have all positive stats.

Since I'm playing core, what should my feat selection be? I'm thinking scribe scroll and combat casting level 1, and maybe track at level 3, if there's no ranger. Otherwise, I'll go spell penetration.

Would power attack be at all worth it?
Are there any core huge animals with two+ hands?

[TheOOB]

Question, would a druid, with their stricture agienst metal armor, clad their animal companion in metal armor?

[Tor the Fallen]

Question, would a druid, with their stricture agienst metal armor, clad their animal companion in metal armor?

Technically, I guess they could.
But nah. That would be stupid to do.
Why play D&D if you're going to play that way?
May as well work on wall glitching in counterstrike.
Or duping items in Diablo.

[Jack Mann]

Depends on why they don't wear it. The books are, to my knowledge, fairly unclear on this. If they truly object to the idea of metal armor, then probably not (but then, why are they so willing to travel with others who use it?), but if it's just a matter of allowing their powers to work, then they probably won't care if their animal companion wears metal armor or not. I suppose it's up to the DM as to why they're prohibited.

[JellyPooga]

Depends on why they don't wear it. The books are, to my knowledge, fairly unclear on this. If they truly object to the idea of metal armor, then probably not (but then, why are they so willing to travel with others who use it?), but if it's just a matter of allowing their powers to work, then they probably won't care if their animal companion wears metal armor or not. I suppose it's up to the DM as to why they're prohibited.

I believe that they can't wear metal 'cos of some oath they make to become a druid, presumably to the land or nature or something). Break the oath, nature gets pissed and takes away your powers for a day (naughty, naughty). Nothing there to say you can't touch metal or use it, just not wear it. No problem, technically, with letting an Animal Companion wear metal barding.

[Tor the Fallen]

Depends on why they don't wear it. The books are, to my knowledge, fairly unclear on this.

Which it is.
Why can they use scimitars, but not a breastplate?
But then, why can a paladin only be lawful good?
Internal assumptions and balance, I guess. Maybe. I dunno. Like armor really matters to a Druid. Maybe it's hard to wildshape with armor on. All that metal melds uncomfortably with the flesh.

For whatever reason, as the settings hippies, I see the restriction as a fairly reasonable thing.

If they truly object to the idea of metal armor, then probably not (but then, why are they so willing to travel with others who use it?)

Druids never really struck me as the preachy type, mostly due to the requisite neutrality in their alignment.
Can you have a preachy druid?
Certainly. The archetype for the wildshaping PETA member eco-terrorist is certainly a valid one.
But to me, I've always seen druids as a sort of go with the flow, less concerned with what others are doing so long as it doesn't directly hurt them or their interests, or cause a very large degree of harm (depending on alignment)

but if it's just a matter of allowing their powers to work, then they probably won't care if their animal companion wears metal armor or not. I suppose it's up to the DM as to why they're prohibited.

If metal simply interferes with their powers and doesn't have anything to do with their ideology, certainly. But if it's one of those things like a vow of poverty or something, then nope, no way (which I've always assumed it was).

[TheOOB]

Heres a question, if a druid can use magic while in metal armor, how can their empathic link work through metal barding?

[Tor the Fallen]

They don't have one, do they?

[Bears With Lasers]

Ah, just the man I wanted to see!

Riding dogs for the barding. Got it.
That was essentially my plan- use the animal companions. However, I was going to use longspears, as -4 to ranged attack into melee is pretty crummy, esp. with 3/4 BAB. We use a pretty high method of stat gen- 4d6, drop the lowest, then do that 3 times. Pick the best set. I will very likely have all positive stats.

Longspears work if you have a decent strength... it's just that normally strength is a druid's lowest priority. If you really wanted to, you could take PBS and Precise Shot as your first-level feats, if you're a human. They'd become relatively useless once you got Wild Shape, though. Since you'll likely have good stats, you can afford a tolerable strength, I suppose.

Since I'm playing core, what should my feat selection be? I'm thinking scribe scroll and combat casting level 1, and maybe track at level 3, if there's no ranger. Otherwise, I'll go spell penetration.

Depends on what you plan to do eventually... Combat Casting is a bad idea, though; if you relaly want the concentration check bonus, take Skill Focus: Concentration. +3 all the time instead of +4 for only one use.

Would power attack be at all worth it?
Are there any core huge animals with two+ hands?[/quote]
Power Attack is worth it eventually, as a core druid; things like Natural Spell and Multiattack should probably come first. From levels 1 to 3, you will want Imp. Unarmed Strike plus Imp. Grapple (for when you can wildshape), or SF (Conjuration) as the prereq for Augment Summoning (for tougher summons). Combat Expertise + Improved Trip can also be a good idea. If you take Imp. Unarmed plus Improved Grapple as a human, snagging Stunning Fist might be worth it due to your high WIS.

[TheOOB]

They don't have one, do they?

Eep, it's not empathic but they do have a link. Hmm.

[Quietus]

Remember to keep in mind, if we're talking 3.0 core, that :

A) Animal companions are plentiful but weaker
B) Natural spell doesn't exist

[2 Eyed Cyclops]

Barkskin and flaming weapon make tanking easy for druids.

[daggaz]

Not to mention, will your DM even allow riding dogs in a jungle setting? Dogs? Doesn't seem to be very jungly to me. And then, who trained them for riding/fighting? Especially the riding part seems rediculous... riding any animal in (besides maybe a giant gorilla) a thickly jungled environment just seems to be a bad, if not impossible, idea. I won't even go into the barded leather...

Remember your setting, cuz your DM wont forget. You might want to think of some good jungle type animals and prepare yourself along that route.

[Bears With Lasers]

Not to mention, will your DM even allow riding dogs in a jungle setting? Dogs? Doesn't seem to be very jungly to me. And then, who trained them for riding/fighting? Especially the riding part seems rediculous... riding any animal in (besides maybe a giant gorilla) a thickly jungled environment just seems to be a bad, if not impossible, idea. I won't even go into the barded leather...

Remember your setting, cuz your DM wont forget. You might want to think of some good jungle type animals and prepare yourself along that route.

Wild dogs. Trained by halflings. Why not?

[swampninja]

Maybe see if you can get to use Oriental Adventures - that's got loads of jungly applications, and it's 3.0 rules.

[Rigeld2]

B) Natural spell doesn't exist

Wrong. Masters of the Wild page 24.

Its not Core, but it does exist.

[Quietus]

Wrong. Masters of the Wild page 24.

Its not Core, but it does exist.

Yes, and :

Since I'm playing core

And if you'll note, I specifically mentioned core.

[Tor the Fallen]

Not to mention, will your DM even allow riding dogs in a jungle setting? Dogs? Doesn't seem to be very jungly to me. And then, who trained them for riding/fighting? Especially the riding part seems rediculous... riding any animal in (besides maybe a giant gorilla) a thickly jungled environment just seems to be a bad, if not impossible, idea. I won't even go into the barded leather...

Remember your setting, cuz your DM wont forget. You might want to think of some good jungle type animals and prepare yourself along that route.

Have you ever been to the tropics?
There are plenty of canines.
Dogs have been trained for war since ancient times, too.

As a medium sized creature (human), you can't actually ride the dog. Besides, riding the dog means you'd have to forgo its attack, unless you wanted to sink a bunch of skill points into ride, which become useless at level five. I don't think my DM would go for the dire ape riding a dinosaur + string of riding feats.

[Woot Spitum]

Have you ever been to the tropics?
There are plenty of canines.
Dogs have been trained for war since ancient times, too.

As a medium sized creature (human), you can't actually ride the dog. Besides, riding the dog means you'd have to forgo its attack, unless you wanted to sink a bunch of skill points into ride, which become useless at level five. I don't think my DM would go for the dire ape riding a dinosaur + string of riding feats.

Riding dogs are mounts for small creatures, like halflings. A dog the size of a mastiff could easily manage that kind of load.