Arcane Archer? Yea or Nay

[Slash_712]

Sorry if there has already been a thread on this, but I have not seen one. Now I have been told that the Arcane Archer is a waste of a prestige class. Any ideas or input?

[Douglas]

The main class feature of the Arcane Archer is a free enhancement bonus. You can get the same thing just by getting the party wizard or cleric to cast Greater Magic Weapon once per day, and the bonus from the spell will be as high or higher all the way until level 9 in the class (character level 16 minimum in core), and even then a Bead of Karma can make up the difference for a cleric without being too expensive for that level.

Imbue Arrow is almost completely worthless because the class does not advance spellcasting and the high BAB requirement means you won't have many levels in your casting class either, so you don't have any spells worth using with it.

Seeker Arrow is once per day, doesn't work with full attacks, and most of the benefit can be gained all the time for the cost of one feat (which incidentally has an extra benefit).

Phase Arrow is once per day and doesn't work with full attacks.

Hail of Arrows is useful only against mooks.

Arrow of Death requires a full day of preparation, can't have multiples ready at once, and the DC is... 20. No, not 20 + an ability score bonus or 20 + class level or 20 + anything else that scales in any way. 20. By the time you get that, casters are dishing out save-or-dies with DCs several points higher multiple times per day with no requirement beyond that they prepare spells like they do every day.

[Starbuck_II]

Sorry if there has already been a thread on this, but I have not seen one. Now I have been told that the Arcane Archer is a waste of a prestige class. Any ideas or input?

An archer based Hexblade wouldn't be too bad off (that or Duskblade). Bab would be enogh quickly and spells aren't the main forte (as they have only up to 4th for Hexblade).

Still, the abilities of Arcane Archer aren't the best.

[PinkysBrain]

The main class feature of the Arcane Archer is a free enhancement bonus.

Arcane archer is a 2 level prestige class whose capstone ability is imbue arrows!

[Fawsto]

AA is quite bad... He was much better on 3.0, but they ruined it for real on 3.5... Certainly I do not recomend any archery based characters... AAs are not an exception. See, archers have some serious problems in D&D, I am personaly trying to fix it, but it tends to show me that it is a very "lasting" problem.

If you want someone to go archery, find a class taht can use his abilities more times a day... Many of AAs abilities are once per day ones, and he doesn't even get to have full BAB on the final lvls, since you must spend a few levels as a caster before choosing it. If you want an archer, get one with full BAB (Fighters or Rangers with ranged especialization; If Paladins can smite with Bows and Arrows, pehaps they are a good idea too... Or not, since you won't be willing to spend another good atribute on dexterity.) or instead of using Bow and Arrow (or similars) go for throwing weapons like throwing axes and teh sort. At least you will be able to deal your strenght bonus as damage too.

[Neon Knight]

or instead of using Bow and Arrow (or similars) go for throwing weapons like throwing axes and teh sort. At least you will be able to deal your strenght bonus as damage too.

Composite bow.

[Isomenes]

If your DM is nice, you can use Reach Spell with the Duskblade's Arcane Channeling (within 30 feet). Normally you'd probably need to take Rapid Metamagic, but spellpoints eliminate that particular inconvenience. (It's still not a very good solution; fixing it with one of the many homebrews I've seen floating around of it would be better.)


It really is a shame, too--it could be so useful. Throwing together a Duskbow sounds like a fun idea, though. Maybe sacrifice melee channeling for ranged, and no full attack channeling?

[Damionte]

I don't have much problem with the Arcane archer. As a fighter class it's above PAR. So you're good there. Just don't take all of the class. personally I'd cap it out at either Lvl 3 or Lvl 5. As it doesn't get enough really cool abilities to go further than that.

The easy +2 bow though is nice. As is the full BAB.

As said though I can come up with better mechanical ways to make an archer, as a flavor archer the AA is fine.

I wrote a few articles on the subject over at Rustmonster.net Which reminds me I havn't finished the series.

Playing the A-Archer depends on what level and type of capagn you're going to be in. thier use goes up in a low magic campagn the same way a kensai does. It will also do much better in a game you figure will end aroudn the mid levels. Say around lvl 9-11.

In a high magic campaign it's not so hot.

[Orzel]

The class is pretty bad. Okay in a low magic frequency setting where item buffs and magic weapons are rarer. It's nice in gesault though. But a straght ranger archer or fighter archer is bettter.

It's a 2 level Prc for achery fighters/stuff/eldritch knights with practiced spellcaster.

[Yechezkiel]

Nay.

I've always like the concept, but none of the homemade 3.5 updates I've seen have been balanced or useful. Like it has been said many times, full Ranger does better (and will have to do).

[Droodle]

Arcane Archer makes for an awesome 2 level PRC.....

[XBobbis]

Actually, I'm playing a gestalt game right now; Ranger/Sorcerer to start then Arcane Archer/Sorcerer. It's pretty brutal, honestly.

[Tengu]

Is that a legal build? If you're taking AA on the same side as ranger, you do not have the required ability to cast arcane spells there.

[Gavin Sage]

No spell progression and junk main ability (unless you some contrive the bonuses to stack with other bonuses from equipment) make this class only useful for a 2 level dip, maybe based just off an Elven caster who waited until mid level.

Imbue Arrow could be really really cool but is miffed by lack of options for it. The rest of the abilities don't have enough repeat use. Hail of Arrows could be cool if you could direct it however you wanted (Arrgh 8 attacks!) but you can't so might as well use whatever BAB you have on a full attack.

[Fawsto]

Ohh yeah... An Arcane Archer using his amazing strenght bonus on a composite bow... That would deal (expecting no magic or buffs) incredible 1d8 + 1 points of damage! Wow! If you expect a reasonable use of magic itens, a Barbarian still wins with his Belt of Giant's Might and his Flaming Burst Keen + 2 Great Axe, in terms of damage, of course.

If, and I say only if, a AA could use his abilities more than once per day, than he would be a better class. Let's say, firing the Hail of Arrows at will would be really cool.

[Knight_Of_Twilight]

Well, Gestalting fixes the whole no spell progression problem, which I feel is the biggest weakness of the class.

[ImperiousLeader]

I have to agree with the general sentiment, the AA is good for a two level dip, or for gestalt.

[the_tick_rules]

but hey if you wanna play it play it. It all depends on the situation. Most people above have mentioned how spellcasters can do it better, but if you don't have one readily available the AA skills become much more valuable.

[Falrin]

Lots of people agree it needs 1/2 Spellcasting. And Even then it's probably not worth it.

Gain feats in the line of the rangers (maybe even stack LvLs for detemening ?)

Most abilities at will.

Arrow of death should be Enhance arrow +6.

[Person_Man]

Vastly inferior to a Cleric Archer, a Soulbow, a Peerless Archer, or even a Fey archer build. If you're really just in love with its special abilities for whatever reason, just play a Ranger with access to the Spell Compendium. It can do everything an Arcane Archer can do, but better.

[Neon Knight]

Ohh yeah... An Arcane Archer using his amazing strenght bonus on a composite bow... That would deal (expecting no magic or buffs) incredible 1d8 + 1 points of damage! Wow! If you expect a reasonable use of magic itens, a Barbarian still wins with his Belt of Giant's Might and his Flaming Burst Keen + 2 Great Axe, in terms of damage, of course.

That was not my point.

A composite bow can add strength bonus as damage. Thus you do not need to use throwing axes in order to add your strength bonus to your damage rolls. That was all I was replying to.

For good measure, the SRD.

All composite bows are made with a particular strength rating (that is, each requires a minimum Strength modifier to use with proficiency). If your Strength bonus is less than the strength rating of the composite bow, you can’t effectively use it, so you take a -2 penalty on attacks with it. The default composite longbow requires a Strength modifier of +0 or higher to use with proficiency. A composite longbow can be made with a high strength rating to take advantage of an above-average Strength score; this feature allows you to add your Strength bonus to damage, up to the maximum bonus indicated for the bow. Each point of Strength bonus granted by the bow adds 100 gp to its cost.

Thus the damage could be 1d8+ whatever the strength rating of the bow is if you meet the strength rating.

Your sarcasm was unnecessary and mean spirited. I suggest you attempt to be more polite the next time you post; being flippant and rude is something almost universally frowned upon.

With all dues respect,
Kasrkin
P.S.: This is the first and last time I sign a post.

[Draz74]

Is that a legal build? If you're taking AA on the same side as ranger, you do not have the required ability to cast arcane spells there.

Nothing in gestalt says prereqs have to come from a certain side.