4e: What will be the druid's role?

[Da Beast]

Judging by the section in Races and Classes about the 4e druid focusing on wildshape and fact that we now have the barbarian as a primal striker I'd guess defender, though I'm hoping for controller. Has anything been released since Races and classes?

[Tadanori Oyama]

The game needs another controller. With the attempt to focus class roles (while allowing for in-class variants) I can see Druids being Controllers with spells.

That's just my hope, no idea what'll actually end up happening.

[bosssmiley]

+1 for divine controller. Walls, terrain effects, fey glamours...

[AKA_Bait]

Well, I think Primal Controller, but otherwise I agree. I think there is a possiblity of Primal Leader with a heavy empasis on the wildshape ability and few if any spells though.

[Charity]

They were originally talking about a true hybrid class, though they may have abandoned that for balance reasons...

[Orzel]

They were originally talking about a true hybrid class, though they may have abandoned that for balance reasons...

By the way the Barabarian works I could see it still happening.

Their at-wills and encounter powers could be controller powers. Lightning bolts and vine snares.

Then they'd shapeshift via their striker like dailly forms and use an at will that only works in when shifted.

Or vice versa.

[Random NPC]

Controller/Leaders, yo!

[Da Beast]

I'm having trouble envisioning how a wildshape focused druid class would play. Would wildshape be an at will evocation, a class feature or maybe something like the barbarian rages that give ongoing bonuses? Maybe their at will and encounter powers could function like wildshape feats in 3.5 where you have some minor change granting a smaller bonus than an outright shift.

[Jayabalard]

I find it likely that most of these classes will exist... it's just a coin flip as to which one is going to be called the "Druid"

[AKA_Bait]

I'm having trouble envisioning how a wildshape focused druid class would play. Would wildshape be an at will evocation, a class feature or maybe something like the barbarian rages that give ongoing bonuses? Maybe their at will and encounter powers could function like wildshape feats in 3.5 where you have some minor change granting a smaller bonus than an outright shift.

I picture them being something like stances granting particular bonuses. Dailes might grant a suite of additional at will or encounter attacks. I dunno how that would balance, but it's what occurs to me.

I find it likely that most of these classes will exist... it's just a coin flip as to which one is going to be called the "Druid"

That too.

[Da Beast]

I'd put my money on the druid turning into a big animal and filling the defender roll and some sort of shaman class filling controller or leader. Maybe bard will become the primal leader.

[AKA_Bait]

I'd put my money on the druid turning into a big animal and filling the defender roll and some sort of shaman class filling controller or leader.

I kinda see a Shaman being in the leader role and the Druid in the controller role. Some other thing I suspect will inherit the 'turns into something that eats your face' mantle.

Maybe bard will become the primal leader.

I would have liked to see that but I'm pretty sure they already said someplace that Bards are going to be Arcane Leaders.

[RebelRogue]

I would have liked to see that but I'm pretty sure they already said someplace that Bards are going to be Arcane Leaders.

My money is on Arcane Leader. Is there a list of the classes that are to be in PHB2? There's going to be Primal and Ki Power Sources, right? Any other new ones? Elemental?

[Saph]

To be honest, I'm kind of dreading the release of the 4e druid. Druid is my favourite class in 3.5, and I've got a nasty feeling the 4e revamp is going to maim it beyond recognition.

In 3.5, Druids have three iconic class features:

a) Wild Shape
b) Animal Companion
c) Animal Summoning

I have the suspicion that 4e is going to either completely eliminate or hopelessly nerf all three of those (e.g. you can wildshape, but only into a very limited set of forms and only for 5 minutes per day), leaving the druid without what made it so much fun in the first place.

But maybe I'm wrong and by next year the designers will ease up on the nerf-bat and start to reintroduce versatile abilities again. I hope so.

- Saph

[Charity]

Well they are going to have to tamp down the druid's power level a bit Saph, you know that they were OTT powerful in 3.5, they can't keep it all...

I'm optomistic to be honest... but thats just me.

[Shhhh!]

Words

Well, They've already said that the ranger is getting a beastmaster style in the martial power book, and it wouldn't very well be a druid without shapeshifting of some form, however, I don't know of any summoning spells in 4ED so far. They may be the first to get them, But I think it's more likely they'll get a Pick either an animal companion, or shapeshifting type deal, much like the swordmage aegis, or the ranger combat styles, something that keep it from being...Gasp Too versatile, without removing the bits that make it druid in the first place. Just guessing though.

[Saph]

Well they are going to have to tamp down the druid's power level a bit Saph, you know that they were OTT powerful in 3.5, they can't keep it all...

Yeah, but they were also crazy fun. No point in being balanced if it's not interesting to play.

Oh well, if they do nerf it too badly I can just stick to 3.5 I guess.

- Saph

[DM Raven]

I would guess leader with heavy controller aspects. Since the druid could use a lot of healing and buff abilities in the previous editions, I wouldn't be surprised if they kept that theme. However the druid also had a lot of controller aspects to it in previous editions...so I would guess the druid a leader with heavy controller aspects.

Either that or the other direction...a controller with heavy leader aspects.

And yes, I demand druid nerfs. No way the wizard can get the nerf hammer and let the druid get away untouched. You're going down hippie!

[RebelRogue]

Well, They've already said that the ranger is getting a beastmaster style in the martial power book, and it wouldn't very well be a druid without shapeshifting of some form, however, I don't know of any summoning spells in 4ED so far.

I was thinking that they might be Daily powers sort of similar to the Flaming Sphere spell: you summon an animal into existence and use actions to direct it around and attack. The ability to shift into a (probably specific) form would also work well as a Daily Stance power. That way you choose between the two when picking Daily powers.

[Charity]

Yeah, but they were also crazy fun. No point in being balanced if it's not interesting to play.

Oh well, if they do nerf it too badly I can just stick to 3.5 I guess.

- Saph

They just spread the fun over a few more classes in 4e, I think you'll still get to give folk big grizzly bear hugs Saph.
My guess is a controller/striker for our old wooden pal, but I've been known to have been wrong before ... yeah I know every time

[Oracle_Hunter]

Personally, I've been intrigued with the 4e Barbarian mechanic - it seems like WotC may be in for the Stance-style mechanics.

In that case, it's quite possible that Druids will get Dailies that Shift them into some Animal Form (with special powers and such) until another Shift power is used, or the end of the Encounter. Perhaps that is what all Druid Utilities will be, actually, with Encounter and Daily attacks reflecting Druid Nature Control.

But yeah, Primal Controller/Striker is what I'm seeing - no way they'll bother with Divine if the description of the Primal Source in the Barbarian entry is accurate.

[Ealstan]

From what I can tell the Druid was originally a hybrid Striker / Controller ( A true hybrid, not like paladin which is MAIN CLASS / little splash of secondary class . The problem they ran into was that hybrid classes don't work; the hybrid could either switch gears and be either a striker or a controller, thus outclassing all classes of either role, or it could dabble and be too unfocused to contribute to the party in either role. So they decided to ditch one of the roles. I'm gonna say the Druid is gonna be a controller, cuz that's what I want to see. But striker would be cool as well I guess.

[Zeful]

From what I can tell the Druid was originally a hybrid Striker / Controller ( A true hybrid, not like paladin which is MAIN CLASS / little splash of secondary class . The problem they ran into was that hybrid classes don't work; the hybrid could either switch gears and be either a striker or a controller, thus outclassing all classes of either role, or it could dabble and be too unfocused to contribute to the party in either role. So they decided to ditch one of the roles. I'm gonna say the Druid is gonna be a controller, cuz that's what I want to see. But striker would be cool as well I guess.

Actually with the way class design in 4e a hybrid could easily have a half set of striker options as well as a half set of controller options. It would be up to the player to pick whichever abilities he wanted, but he couldn't be both at once.

For example if you wanted to play our theoretical hybrid Druid as a shapechanging striker, you would pick up shifting powers which could have a line that says: "you can only use powers with the 'Shifting' keyword after activating this power." Which means the abilities geared toward control are unusable while striking. And to prevent the other crossover the striker powers would mostly be melee range or work 1 to 2 squares away, while the controllers are 10+ squares, making it not a good idea to be in the main combat while controllering.

[skywalker]

I kinda see a Shaman being in the leader role and the Druid in the controller role. Some other thing I suspect will inherit the 'turns into something that eats your face' mantle.

I have a lot of respect for you and your wisdom around these forums so please don't take this as disrespect, I'm in the middle of staying up all night to reset my sleep schedule and I can't make it any more flowery:

Races and Classes completely contradicts you. The article in that book says that when they looked at what was iconic about druids, their number 1 iconic feature was wildshaping. I know I quoted AKA_Bait but I'm of course directing this at everyone. Druids are going to be wildshapers, and I think the idea that wildshape will work similarly to rage is a good one, because so far, power sources in 4e work similarly. For instance, the paladin and cleric have different roles but similar powers that tend to grant similar things, only in different amounts or ways. Divine powers tend to grant allies HP, saves, etc, whereas martial powers(with the exception of warlord powers) tend to shift other characters and have effects on enemies. Arcane powers tend to affect multiple characters at once, as well as having similar mechanics across classes/roles. I think Primal powers will work the same way.

But that's just my two cp. I apologize if I was blunt, but I think what I have to say is worth reading(and me saying) regardless.

[Valdar]

Add a "me too" to Striker with a side of Controller from the description in Races and Classes.

Just noticed Barbarian is in playtest, and will be a Striker, so maybe Druid is being shifted off that role? There are two Martial strikers, so no reason why there couldn't be two Primal ones, though.

The cover art for PHB2 is up on Wizards' site, and there's a tagline "Arcane, Divine, and Primal classes". So, no Ki or Monk this time around...

Mearls has already described Bard as Arcane Leader, so that's very likely. Sorcerer may be in there as well.

From what I've heard, four Primal classes is likely (Druid and Barbarian, plus Shaman and Witch, or whatever the focus groups like for names for the last two), plus two Arcane (Sorcerer, Bard), and two Divine (new stuff probably). Another interview (forgot source) stated that PHB2 will be mostly new stuff, so there will possibly be only two other classes from 3e core in there (if they drop one of those, it will probably be Sorcerer, since the reason for the 3e Sorcerer's existence is gone with the new magic system...)

[skywalker]

Add a "me too" to Striker with a side of Controller from the description in Races and Classes.

Just noticed Barbarian is in playtest, and will be a Striker, so maybe Druid is being shifted off that role? There are two Martial strikers, so no reason why there couldn't be two Primal ones, though.

The cover art for PHB2 is up on Wizards' site, and there's a tagline "Arcane, Divine, and Primal classes". So, no Ki or Monk this time around...

Mearls has already described Bard as Arcane Leader, so that's very likely. Sorcerer may be in there as well.

From what I've heard, four Primal classes is likely (Druid and Barbarian, plus Shaman and Witch, or whatever the focus groups like for names for the last two), plus two Arcane (Sorcerer, Bard), and two Divine (new stuff probably). Another interview (forgot source) stated that PHB2 will be mostly new stuff, so there will possibly be only two other classes from 3e core in there (if they drop one of those, it will probably be Sorcerer, since the reason for the 3e Sorcerer's existence is gone with the new magic system...)

What do you suppose an arcane sorcerer's role would be?

I've seen lots of rumors that sorcerer will actually be part of the "elemental" power group, altho I'm not sure how many other classes they could come up with for that... Then again, the way some of the fluff is looking for the barbarian, maybe elemental got rolled into primal?

[Da Beast]

Add a "me too" to Striker with a side of Controller from the description in Races and Classes.

Just noticed Barbarian is in playtest, and will be a Striker, so maybe Druid is being shifted off that role? There are two Martial strikers, so no reason why there couldn't be two Primal ones, though.

The cover art for PHB2 is up on Wizards' site, and there's a tagline "Arcane, Divine, and Primal classes". So, no Ki or Monk this time around...

Mearls has already described Bard as Arcane Leader, so that's very likely. Sorcerer may be in there as well.

From what I've heard, four Primal classes is likely (Druid and Barbarian, plus Shaman and Witch, or whatever the focus groups like for names for the last two), plus two Arcane (Sorcerer, Bard), and two Divine (new stuff probably). Another interview (forgot source) stated that PHB2 will be mostly new stuff, so there will possibly be only two other classes from 3e core in there (if they drop one of those, it will probably be Sorcerer, since the reason for the 3e Sorcerer's existence is gone with the new magic system...)

Where did you find these interviews? Races and classes said something about Sorcerers having an elemental source and being focused around somesort of aura affects iirc. And I may be wrong, but wasn't there some mention of bards now being divine characters?

[ImperiousLeader]

I'm hoping the Druid will remain a more hybrid-esque class, but I do tend to think of them as Controllers. Plus, there's not many other slots for them, I've never seen them as Defenders, and Striker or Leader will step on the other two known Primal classes, the Barbarian and the Shaman.

Really, as long as they've got wildshaping and some neat nature spells, I'll probably be happy.

[BardicDuelist]

I'm hoping the Druid will remain a more hybrid-esque class, but I do tend to think of them as Controllers. Plus, there's not many other slots for them, I've never seen them as Defenders, and Striker or Leader will step on the other two known Primal classes, the Barbarian and the Shaman.

Really, as long as they've got wildshaping and some neat nature spells, I'll probably be happy.

Either the Druid or the Shaman will be a controller, the other will be a leader. It's a toss up there. I imagine that the mysterious "w" class will be something like "Warden" which will end up as a primal defender.

[Edea]

Actually, I get the sinking feeling that the Druid will be a Primal Striker, unless Races and Classes is full of bunk.