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2021-09-05, 05:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2014
Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
There might be a bit of silver lining to this:
1.) Dragonborn could be plural (our character starts a dynasty or something)
2.) Future calamities just won't need someone Dragonborn
3.) Our character could wind up an immortal or near-immortal vampire and be around for a long, long, long time.
IIRC he got kidnapped by Daedra, and the only reason it stayed up as long as it did after that was because the Dunmer made a magic doohicky that kept it up - but it took a steady fuel of souls to power the thing, and when the girlfriend of one of the doohicky's makers got picked to help fuel it, well...RIP Vivec City.
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2021-09-05, 05:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2018
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
Without drawing any explicit parallel comparison to real-world religious beliefs, many philosophies across the ages have interpreted the corporeal condition as a prison of sorts from which one must seek freedom, and their adherents on average weren't a bunch of deeply depressed people.
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2021-09-05, 05:13 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2018
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
So, what's the more likely option:
- People who genuinely believe in an afterlife/that dragons are real
Or
- An entire nation who pretends to believe in something nobody really believes in but they all pretend because everyone believes except they don't so how did that belief even got established in the first place?
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2021-09-05, 05:23 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Sep 2016
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2021-09-05, 05:26 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2017
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- France
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
And? It's not like it's a requirement to save the world.
Vivec could have done that whenever he wanted in Three Eras. Vivec could have done that the moment he realized what was needed to stop Dagoth Ur (that probably would have helped with maintening the Ghostfence too). Vivec didn't do that. Vivec stated that the rock would hover as long as the Dunmer loved him. It destroying Vvardenfell when the Dunmer turned away from worshiping the Tribunal wasn't a bug, but a feature.Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2021-09-05, 06:36 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2008
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- Orlando, FL
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
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2021-09-05, 11:10 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2011
Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
A dragonborn hero won't be needed, because it seems that Alduin was the only dragon with the resurrection shout. He won't be back until the appointed time of the world's natural end.
Dragons are indeed mighty, but hardly invincible. A solo mage from the Twin Secrets book was able to best one. Now when a dragon dies, it doesn't matter if it's soul remains, it's taking a nap until the true end times.Don't know your name but bring the pain.
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2021-09-06, 03:30 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2009
Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
What if this is that appointed time? There are indications of that.
E.g. Esbern's commentary on Alduin's Wall: "The Last Dragonborn does battle with Alduin at the end of time." (Not an exact quote, but he definitely uses that phrase.)
Or Felldir's words on banishing Alduin from the time of the Dragon War: "We shout you out, from all our endings until the last."
Then there's Paarthunax's none-too-cryptic warnings to the Dragonborn: "Those who try to hasten the end, may delay it. Those who work to delay the end, may bring it closer."
And of course the repeated references to "the Last Dragonborn". Not just from the prophecy - Miraak also uses the term."None of us likes to be hated, none of us likes to be shunned. A natural result of these conditions is, that we consciously or unconsciously pay more attention to tuning our opinions to our neighbor’s pitch and preserving his approval than we do to examining the opinions searchingly and seeing to it that they are right and sound." - Mark Twain
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2021-09-06, 05:03 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2007
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- Manchester, UK
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
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2021-09-06, 05:12 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2009
Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
"None of us likes to be hated, none of us likes to be shunned. A natural result of these conditions is, that we consciously or unconsciously pay more attention to tuning our opinions to our neighbor’s pitch and preserving his approval than we do to examining the opinions searchingly and seeing to it that they are right and sound." - Mark Twain
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2021-09-06, 05:55 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2013
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- Bristol, UK
Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
In the real world, prophesies are hogwash. In fiction, prophesies are whatever the author wants, for as long as the author wants, and if the author changes her mind, then the status of the prophesy changes. If the authors change (as in different people become authors) on a weekly basis, as seems to be the case with the Elder Scrolls, then the chances of a prophecy meaning the same thing between games are very very slender.
The end of what Son? The story? There is no end. There's just the point where the storytellers stop talking.
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2021-09-06, 06:24 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2017
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
Thing is, the Amulet of Kings is destroyed meaning no more Dragonborn Emperors and Alduin's body is slain meaning he will only ever come back when Aka(tosh) decides it is time for him to come back and for the kalpa to end. At which point Aka(tosh) is unlikely to spawn a Dragonborn to stop Alduin. So why would there ever be another Dragonborn?
Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2021-09-06, 07:06 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2007
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- Switzerland
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
Several cultures, at least the Khajiit, the Nords and the Redguard, claim to have experience with previous Kalpas. So the idea of Kalpas ending is reasonably credible.
Resident Vancian Apologist
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2021-09-06, 07:46 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2013
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- Germany
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
You think the god of time's devotee in Elder Scrolls is stopped by such a trifling matter as continuity? To put on my imaginary tinfoil hat fully, I assume dwemer vanished by some time travel shenanigans. They either breached the mortal realm by realizing they can quite literally all achieve CHIM (and thus realize they are in a game) or where simply "written out of existence" by Akatosh. But not fully deleted, as to warn mortals about the dangers of achieving divinity as a mortal.
And if my wishes would be granted, the ultimate TES part would have the daedra (who are tricksters and oppose the aedra, the gods) actively fight against the aedra, actually being the good guys for once, because they want the illusion to end.
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2021-09-06, 07:55 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2013
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
The Aedra arent actually "Good" though, in any sense that we understand. Theyre Law, to the Daedra's Chaos. Naturally mortals side with them because consistency of reality is very good for people who dont have the power to just arbitrarily affect the rules to get what they want, but the Aedra dont necessarily have mortals best interests at heart, whatever their priests may say. Case in point, Alduin and the dragons exist, whether they are aedra themselves or simply the direct agents of one.
“Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”
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2021-09-06, 08:49 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2017
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2021-09-06, 11:21 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2014
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2021-09-06, 01:43 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2016
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- Earth and/or not-Earth
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
I made a webcomic, featuring absurdity, terrible art, and alleged morals.
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2021-09-06, 02:14 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2017
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- France
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
Last edited by Fyraltari; 2021-09-06 at 02:14 PM.
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2021-09-06, 03:14 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2009
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- Canada
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
This just created the image of Akatosh and Periyte as a pair of overworked IT support guys.
Akatosh is a server admin that can't look away without someone letting a million spam bots in and Dagon trying to crash the exchange stack, and Periyte gets sent around to computers that are "super defective, get up here and fix it or lose your job" when it's just not plugged in.
And then he has to carry all the junk off someone's desk down to Akatosh, who's furious because Sheogorath posted the company WAN details and password in a Facebook meme.
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2021-09-06, 08:03 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2014
Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
You mean, aside from giving everyone minor super powers just for being born in their months/touching their stones? Yes, there’s an entire questline for them in Craglorn.
Is he though? He arranged for a Dragonborn just in time to stop Alduin.
I like this mental image.
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2021-09-06, 08:32 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2009
Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
Well, in the past there have been fairly steady streams of Dragonborn. The entire Septim line, for instance. I've also seen it suggested that the heroes of previous games are also Dragonborn (nobody uses the word back then because it has no particular significance except to the Greybeards, who aren't in any of those games), and that accounts for how they (alone of all people in all the world) are able to level up so quickly and achieve what they do.
"None of us likes to be hated, none of us likes to be shunned. A natural result of these conditions is, that we consciously or unconsciously pay more attention to tuning our opinions to our neighbor’s pitch and preserving his approval than we do to examining the opinions searchingly and seeing to it that they are right and sound." - Mark Twain
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2021-09-06, 09:19 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2011
Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
Besides Uriel (and maybe Martin) Septim, the only previous character in an Elder Scrolls game that I think had a chance of being Dragonborn was perhaps Mankar Cameron, and even that is shaky. If there's one thing Cameron was good at, it was lying and misdirecting.
Previous heroes were favored in some way(Not the hero of Daggerfall though, lol). That doesn't necessarily mean the previous protagonists were Dragonborn.Last edited by Lurkmoar; 2021-09-06 at 09:22 PM.
Don't know your name but bring the pain.
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2021-09-06, 09:35 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2013
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
“Evil is evil. Lesser, greater, middling, it's all the same. Proportions are negotiated, boundaries blurred. I'm not a pious hermit, I haven't done only good in my life. But if I'm to choose between one evil and another, then I prefer not to choose at all.”
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2021-09-06, 09:43 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2006
- Gender
Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
The Champion could have since the amulet was attuned to Dragonblood. While a Dragonborn might not qualify. Which makes no sense but when gods are involved rules tend to be the first thing hurled out the window.
I am trying out LPing. Check out my channel here: Triaxx2
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2021-09-07, 03:26 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2007
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- Switzerland
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2021-09-07, 04:21 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2017
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- France
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
Oh, I like that. Anu is the CEO who no one ever sees. Magnus was the guy who set up most of the software infrastructure but left the company a while ago and nobody is really sure how it all works now. Julianos is from accounting. Zenithar and Stendarr are the HR guy and the local union leader but I don't know which fits which better. Mephala jsut love to spread gossip around and will make up stuff if nothing is interesting enough. Mara is the one who is always ready to help out the newbies and give them advice. Kynareth is the the only one who waters the plants. Nobody really knows what Sanguine actually does, but he's there.
And I'm out of ideas.
Yes aside, from that, since they dot seem to have much control over that (although I think lore-wise, only the Heroes get to enjoy that).Yes, there’s an entire questline for them in Craglorn.
Is he though? He arranged for a Dragonborn just in time to stop Alduin.
The Dragonborn Emperors were dragonborn because of the Covenant between Alessia and Akatosh. That Covenant ended when the Amulet of Kings was broken.
I've also seen it suggested that the heroes of previous games are also Dragonborn (nobody uses the word back then because it has no particular significance except to the Greybeards, who aren't in any of those games), and that accounts for how they (alone of all people in all the world) are able to level up so quickly and achieve what they do.
We know for a fact the Hero of Kvatch and the Imperial Agent were not dragonborn either, since the HoK couldn't put on the Amulet of Kings and the Agent couldn't use the Totem of Tiber Septim to control Anumidium.
The only indication that any of them may be Dragonborn is that the Nerevarine is said to be "dragon-born and star-marked" which is likely to mean "was born in Imperial territory".
Mankar Camoran (he's from the Summerset Isles, not the British Isles) being Dragonborn is the only way to explain why he can wear the Amulet of Kings when the HoK can't. At least, it's the only way I know of.
My understanding is that all the Dragonborns have the dragonblood, but the Dragonborn Emperors (except Tiber and Reman) only had the dragonblood and not the rest of the package.
*Sighs*
Customer service...Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.
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2021-09-07, 06:44 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2007
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- Switzerland
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
Last edited by Eldan; 2021-09-07 at 06:44 AM.
Resident Vancian Apologist
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2021-09-07, 07:29 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2009
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- Canada
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
Originally Posted by Eldan
Spoiler
Lorkhan : Started this entire branch of the corporation, introduced all the ease-of-use designs and actually lead the first production team himself in a garage. For these amazingly successful efforts, he later received... The hatred of everyone on salary, and got shredded on social media until they could fire him.
Magnus : Built almost all the cabling and company internals himself. Didn't like Lorkhan's "artistic direction", and just up and quit without notice leaving a lot of things unfinished and in Akatosh's claws to deal with.
Akatosh : The overworked head of IT that's had to do 90% of the server work himself for the last <years error> since Magnus left. Rarely leaves his office, and when he does, everyone goes ballistic because their network starts to crash.
Arkay : HR manager, the one that's always doing the actual interview when you're being hired... Or fired.
Dibella : She's always getting newer, nicer, offices and things for reasons. Cough. Also usually is the one arranging the office party scheduling, and other mandated celebrations.
Julianos : He says he's from accounting, but any time anyone sees him he's reading the news. From tomorrow, the 1800s, or something in Ancient Sumerian.
Kynareth : She's a founding member of the company, but oddly never moves up in the world. Keeps all the office plants watered, and is usually arguing with landscaping maintenance.
Mara : No one is entirely sure which department she's in ever since the time people ganged up to get rid of Lorkhan, she's usually busy talking with the workers and bringing in food.
Stendarr : Is the one that does all the paperwork in HR and all the internal interviews. Almost always sides against certain parts of management. Oddly started keeping a mace above his office door. No one's asked about it yet.
Zenithar : The Union president, who hasn't had to deal with a strike yet because honestly most of the workforce (mortals) don't realize they have anything to do about management. Is antsy about this "Thalmor" social media group.
Talos : An industrial contractor that ended up on salary. Some of the normal staff dislike him, others love him.
Azura : No one has seen her do any work in the last forever, aside from whenever she storms down from her corner office to reprimand an entire department staff for sophistry.
Boethiah : All of the employees that work in her advertising department are hollow eyed and nervous; they're usually all backbiting to try and get her to smile on them.
Clavicus Vile : A company lawyer, who's closely followed by his briefcase-carrying junior associate. Has a gold inlaid mahogany desk with a Newton's cradle on it. And is irritated that some twerp managed to take contracting away from him.
Hermaeus Mora : He's the lead from design. People usually edge away when he's staring at them, which is always. His office was once blocked off for a week when a pile of trashy Scientific Journals fell over in front of his door.
Hircine : Keeps bringing a bunch of hounds into work and tracking mud all over. Always off on hunting weekends, or assigning lower-level managers deal with his work for him.
Jyggalag : He was a strict no-nonsense downer Chief Financial Officer that pedantically marched on over everyone else at every meeting until he had his way. So they forced him to come to a company party and spiked his drink. Hasn't been seen since. Though, that Sheogorath fellow...?
Malacath : A manager of engineering. Is very serious when working on something, but finding him when he's not red-faced with rage otherwise is a real challenge. And so is getting back out of his office after saying something like that.
Mehrunes Dagon : Hasn't stopped insisting that he has a better corporate plan and that this place is just one step from falling down. Usually sabotaging company works to make this at least partially true. Spreads political theories to the workers, and is all smiles to those who listen. And tries to get the rest fired immediately.
Mephala : Claims she's in charge of administration, but this may just be an excuse to read everyone's paperwork. So she can have something to tease everyone else with. Put a spider tank on the cubicle dividers for people to admire, isn't sure why people don't. Does wiccan art online under a pseudonym.
Meridia : Is one of the few on this side of the office that does a lot of work, claims she's the only one keeping the lights on around here. Collects any worker she likes onto her team, where they find it extremely difficult to get transferred back out of.
Molag Bal : Calls himself the "Chief People Officer". The HR department refuses to report to him, and in fact have an ever-growing pile of complaints about him. Even those who leave the company can still find it difficult to avoid him.
Namira : Always in the office after hours. Says she's in charge of Sanitation. Encourages beggars to stay in the lobby. Odd smell around her. Sends company memos deriding Arkay CC'd to everyone.
Nocturnal : Is the oldest manager in the entire building. People mutter that the place was just built around her when she chose not to move. Keep an eye on your office supplies, or she'll have them. Also walks off with personal items. You'll never get them back, don't go looking.
Peryite : Has a sign that says Inferior Assistant Under-Manager nailed to his door. Does all the work that other people claim that they're responsible for. Hangs around Akatosh whenever possible, because they're third cousins twice removed on his uncle's wife's side. Has a year-round head cold, and is always sniffling.
Sanguine : Often shouts "hip" internet slogans and sprays people down with champagne. Has relations with the workers, which the other managers find more than odd and slightly uncomfortable (except for Malog Bal, which should make anyone reconsider their choices). Always 110% chipper and just back from vacation somewhere exotic.
Sheogorath : Looks oddly like Jyggalag if he had been a mad tramp surfer instead of a 40-something balding accountant. Carries a box of fishsticks under one arm and tells rambling stories to anyone who will listen, until either giving them real gold Spanish doubloons or sticking a live anchovy in their ear. The rest of management refuse to do anything about this and say, "It's fine. That's fine. Better than expected, really." Everyone is amazed that not only can he work a computer, but is also a wild break-away memetic hit with every social media post.
Vaermina : Once brought in a "home crafts project", judging by the number of managers and workers that suddenly needed to leave it was a great success! She'll pull your ear if you're not working, but the more committed to the job you are, the more upset she is with you.
Ideal Masters : After taking over a files and documents room they said that, as middle management, they should be making all the decisions instead. Few of the upper management or workers seem to remember they're there at all.
Tribunal : Three workers took over a wing of the building and ran it fairly well until Azura got tired of them doctoring their profit numbers.
Dagoth Ur : Found Lorkhan's old plans, which the Tribunal used later, and holy **** is that cancerous!? Get him out of here!
Umbra : Spray paints outside of the building with "Suck it, Clavicus!" tags when not writing contracts.
Numidium : Someone thought they were ordering a Mercedes-Benz. They received this instead. It was a lawn ornament until someone stole it, crashed it into the internet cables outside andAkatosh wrote an enraged 5000-page company wide notice about the impactit mysteriously disappeared.
Mannimarco : Who the !@?# is this guy? Who invited him? What do you mean, read the notice?
Last edited by Misery Esquire; 2021-09-07 at 07:41 AM.
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2021-09-07, 08:16 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2017
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- France
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Re: The Elder Scrolls: The XVII Princes of Oblivion
The Hist: an old tree in the courtyard of the main building. Sanguine swears it hissed at him once, but he might have been high.
Trinimac: Former head of security and Akatosh's best buddy, was fired after having a fight with Boethiah when she called him a compulsive liar. Malacth inherited his office.
Morihaus: Kynareth's son, was an intern for a while with his buddy Pelinal. Hard-working and reliable but did not leave much of an impression.
Pelinal: Also an intern, made friend with Morihaus. A complete mess that you would never know if was going to work a 20-hours shift or show up late and yell at everybody. Couldn't stand Akatosh and once ripped off a toilet seat and used it to break another toilet seat. Liked to rant about how "VR is the future, man!"
Alkosh: Akatosh's pet cat. Pelinal kicked him once by accident and he scratched him so hard he had to go to the hospital
The Hoon Ding: Head of logistics and transportation. Very rarely at the office but when he is things tend to go smoother.
Ebonharm: One of the company's very first employees. Isn't around anymore but nobody is sure if he retired, was fired, muted to another building or what.
Sithis: not an employee, he works for construction company that made the building where the main offices are. Hangs out at the same pub the others do.
Mai'q: A janitor. Likes to quote obscure proverbs and refuses to elaborate on their meaning.
Sai: Who?Forum Wisdom
Mage avatar by smutmulch & linklele.