History Monks

[Lostintransit]

Okay, well here is an idea me and my gaming group came up with for the History Monks of the Discworld. Anyone who has read thief of time has an idea what I'm on about.

I've posted it here to see what people think. The basic thoughts behind it were; a trade off, guaranteed flurry as per a regular monk, to be replaced with the time splicing. A number of the monks abilities became special abilities gained at later levels. All feedback welcomed. (try to keep it constructive though!)

(I must point out that the knowledge (time) skill is, as of yet, a campaign specific skill, as we are using it to see if the monks know what is supposed to happen at certain times. Sort of like a Deus Ex Machina)

EDIT: added a Time Feat at level 1 and changed splicing to slicing, also circular reincarnation to aging.
EDIT:Changed Time Feats to Time Training.
EDIT: Added Text regarding bonus type, haste clause, and attacks with unarmed while splicing.
EDIT: added slow clause, no longer time bonus.
EDIT: Added bits to Enlightenment - spend time points to re-roll
EDIT: added Upsidazi to Time Training.
EDIT: added a bit of background info.
EDIT: added craft(Bonzai Mountains) as a class skill.
EDIT: added Time Focus as a 2nd level abilitly, put in losing unspent points.
EDIT: Added in Wisdom of History ability.
EDIT: added class restriction clause thanks to a heads up on mass +Xd6 damage classes. (now removed due to other fixes)
EDIT: added in more clauses with Time slicing, change a number of stance abilities.
EDIT: changed the number of attacks generated by Djim. Editted some abilities further.

History Monk

The secret order of the History Monks is one of the Discworlds most important Sects. They have a responsibility to see history follows the right track, as set out in the huge lead-bound History Books - 20,000 of them, ten feet high, with printing small enough to need a magnifying glass to read. "When people say "it is written" - it is written here."

The main role of the monastery is to ensure anything relating to time, happens at all. Unfortunatly on the discworld people's perception of time affects its flow on the Disc, and the Monks must ensure this does not become a problem, by, as an example, taking some time from the middle of the ocean ('how much time does a codfish need?') and putting it in a busy Ankh-Morpork workshop with a deadline to meet.

They also frequently need to enter the world, to take a more direct hand in events. It is for this reason that a number of monks have been trained as ninjas. Many of them have since been retrained by Lu-Tze, who believes most problems can be sorted out without resorting to martial arts.

The main source of their control, lies in Oi-Dong, located High in the Ramtop mountains. This is were time is managed by means of spinning cylinders called "procrastinators", which look like Tibetan prayer wheels.

Abilities: Wisdom is the most important ability for a History Monk as it determines how many Time points they get each day, it also effects a number of other class abilities. Strength, Dexterity and Constitution are not as important but will play a major part if the character is going to be fighting alot near the front ranks.
Alignment: Lawful Neutral.
Hit Die: D8

Class Skills
The history Monks Class skills (and the Key ability for each skill) are Balance (Dex), Climb (Str), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int),Craft (Bonzai Mountains) (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Hide (Dex), Jump (Dex), Knowledge (Geography) (Int), Knowledge (History) (Int), Knowledge (Time) (Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Perform (Cha), Profession (Wis), Sense Motive (Wis), Spot (Wis), Swim (Str), and Tumble (Dex)
Skill points at 1st Level: (4 + Int modifier) X 4
Skill points at Each Additional Level: 4 + Int Modifier

{table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special

1st|

+0

|

+0

|

+2

|

+2

|Time Slicing(1st Djim), Okidoki, Time Training

2nd|

+1

|

+0

|

+3

|

+3

|Evasion, Time Focus

3rd|

+2

|

+1

|

+3

|

+3

|Time Slicing(2nd Djim)

4th|

+3

|

+1

|

+4

|

+4

|Time Training

5th|

+3

|

+1

|

+4

|

+4

|Shiitake, Wisdom of History

6th|

+4

|

+2

|

+5

|

+5

|Time Slicing(3rd Djim)

7th|

+5

|

+2

|

+5

|

+5

|Uncanny Dodge

8th|

+6/+1

|

+2

|

+6

|

+6

|Time Training

9th|

+6/+1

|

+3

|

+6

|

+6

|Time Slicing(4th Djim)

10th|

+7/+2

|

+3

|

+7

|

+7

|Chang-fu

11th|

+8/+3

|

+3

|

+7

|

+7

|Improved Evasion, Wisdom of History

12th|

+9/+4

|

+4

|

+8

|

+8

|Time Slicing(5th Djim), Time Training

13th|

+9/+4

|

+4

|

+8

|

+8

|Circular Aging

14th|

+10/+5

|

+4

|

+9

|

+9

|Improved Uncanny Dodge

15th|

+11/+6/+1

|

+5

|

+9

|

+9

|Time Slicing(6th Djim), Torro-fu

16th|

+12/+7/+2

|

+5

|

+10

|

+10

|Time Training

17th|

+12/+7/+2

|

+5

|

+10

|

+10

|Enlightenment

18th|

+13/+8/+3

|

+6

|

+11

|

+11

|Time Slicing(7th Djim), Wisdom of History

19th|

+14/+9/+4

|

+6

|

+11

|

+11

|Zimmerman's Valley

20th|

+15/+10/+5

|

+6

|

+12

|

+12

|Deja-fu, Time Training[/table]

Class Features

Weapon and Armour Proficiency: History Monks are proficient with all simple weapons and all light martial weapons. They are also proficient with the Kama, Nunchaku, Sai and Siangham. History Monks are not Proficient with any armour or shields - in fact, many of the History Monks special powers require unfettered movement.
When wearing armour, using a shield, or carrying a medium or heavy load, a History monk loses his Time Slicing, Time Training, Torro-fu and Deja-fu abilities.
Time Slicing (Ex): A History Monk is taught from early training to manipulate the flow of time around them. A well trained History Monk can slice time so fine that they can act faster than the eye can follow.

At the start of each day the History monk generates a number of time points, the number of time points generated is equal to the History Monks level x his Wisdom modifier. Whenever the History monk generates more time points he loses any time points not spent during the previous day.

When unarmoured and unencumbered the History Monk can spend these time points to activate any level of Djim he has reached. Each Djim costs a number of time points to activate equal to its level (So a 6th level Djim would cost 6 time points, for example.) The benefits granted by a Djim last until the start of the History Monks next action. A character can only have one Djim active at any one time, but is allowed to freely change between the different levels of Djim at the start of each of his actions.

To activate a Djim takes no time at all, but a History monk can do it only during his action (see Initiative, page 136 of PHB), not in response to someone else's action. A History Monk can't, for example, activate a Djim when attacked in order to get the increased AC, although the extra AC would be a benefit if he had activated his Djim earlier in the round, before the attack was made.

Any attacks made while a Djim is Active may only be made with unarmed strikes, Kama, Nunchaku, Sai and Siangham. While Time Slicing a History Monk loses all benefits granted by the Haste spell and all penalties gained by the Slow spell.

While a Djim is active, the Time Monk gains a number of benefits due to his highly accelerated speed. He gains a bonus to armor class, attack and damage rolls, and reflex saves, and his speed increases. Additionally, when making a full attack action, he gains a number of additional attacks at his full attack modifier. See the table below for the exact benefits gained at each Djim level.

{table=head]Djim Level|Attack and Damge Bonus|AC Bonus|Ref Save Bonus|Movement Bonus|Additional Attacks

1st|

+1

|

+1

|

+1

|

+30Ft

|

+1

2nd|

+2

|

+2

|

+2

|

+60Ft

|

+1

3rd|

+3

|

+3

|

+3

|

+90Ft

|

+2

4th|

+4

|

+4

|

+4

|

+120Ft

|

+2

5th|

+5

|

+5

|

+5

|

+150Ft

|

+3

6th|

+6

|

+6

|

+6

|

+180Ft

|

+3

7th|

+7

|

+7

|

+7

|

+210Ft

|

+4

[/table]

Okidoki (Ex): Okidoki is a Strange martial art taught to all Monks at the History Temple, it mainly focuses on using the Monks own body for attacking rather than relying on weapons. This is abilitiy functions exactly like the Unarmed Strike ability of a Monk.
Time Training (Ex): As a History Monk learns to control their Time manipulating powers, they pick up useful skills that can help them further. On attaining 1st level, and at every four levels thereafter (4th, 8th, 12th, 16th and 20th), a history Monk gains a Time Feat of his choice from among the following options.

Stance of the Coyote (Ex): The History monk may spend two time points to negate any effects from falling and to land on their feet after falling.

Stance of the Moon (Ex): The History monk needs to only sleep for four hours to gain the benefits of a full nights sleep, or twelve hours to gain the benefits of a Full days rest.

Closing of the Flower (Ex): The History Monk may erase his presence from the world, people will forget him, pictures of him will disappear and his name will vanish from records. If the history monk spends 24 hours in meditation doing nothing else, he may upon completion of his meditation, have all existence of him removed. The Monk may choose up to one item or person per History monk level to remain unaffected by this ability. If a sentient creature is targeted by this ability it is allowed a Will save (DC 10 + 1/2 History Monk level + Wisdom Mod) to remember them still. The character is unaware of the attempt to earse the History Monk's presence. Gods or other such powerful creatures and any other History Monks remain unaffected by this ability.

Stance of the Monkey (Ex): The History Monk becomes adept at using even the smallest Slice to his advantage, protecting him from danger. When unarmoured and unencumbered, the History Monk adds his Wisdom modifier (if any) to his AC. This Bonus applies even against Touch attacks or when the monk is flat-footed. He loses this bonus when he is immobilized or helpless, when he wears any armour, when he carries a shield, or when he carries a medium or heavy load. The History Monk also generates two less time points from his total maximum allowed. This ability does not stack with any other abilty that grants your wisdom modifier to AC.

Tung-pi (Ex): The History monk is immune to all forms of environmental damage. The History Monk also generates one less time point from his total maximum allowed.

Stance of the Mountain (Ex): The History Monk can draw strength from Time itself, mending his wounds. A History Monk can heal a number of hit points of damage equal to twice his current History Monk level each day, and he may spread this healing out among several uses.

Stance of Surprise (Ex): Whenever the History Monk is called upon to make an Initiative Check, he may spend two time points to get a bonus to the roll equal to his History Monk level.

Upsidazi (Ex): The History Monk has become adept at reacting to abnormal time situtions, allowing him to react almost instantly to anyone manipulating time. The History Monk is immune to all effects from time based spells and acts normally during any such situtions. The History Monk generates two less time points from his total maximum allowed.

Evasion (Ex): This ability functions exactly like the Evasion ability of a Monk.
Time Focus (Ex): One of the most useful techniques the History Monk learns is to store his own personal time, allowing him to use it when the situation requires. Whenever a History Monk generates time points he may keep up to his wisdom score of unspent time points and add these to his newly generated time point total.
Shiitake (Ex): This Martial art teaches the History Monk to use his great wisdom to predict the effects of attacks. The History Monk may, instead of using the relevant modifier, use his Wisdom Modifier for all Fortitude and Reflex saves.
Wisdom of History (Ex): As a History monk studies in Oi-Dong, they gain a deeper understanding of the universe. On attaining 5th level, and at every level marked thereafter (11th and 18th), a History Monks Wisdom Score increases by +1. These increases stack and are gained as if through level advancement.
Uncanny Dodge (Ex): This ability functions exactly like the Uncanny Dodge ability of a Barbarian.
Chang-fu (Ex): This Martial art teaches that little can stand against the ravages of time, even gods will eventually fade away. A History monk of 10th level or higher ignores all Damage reduction and Hardness.
Improved Evasion (Ex): This ability functions exactly like the Improved Evasion ability of a Monk.
Circular Aging (Ex): As a History monk learns to control time, his understanding of death and its effects increases, until he reaches a level of understanding that grants him eternal life. A History Monk of 13th level or higher, never take penalties for aging and cannot be magically aged. Any such penalties already taken however remain in place. Bonuses still accrue, but the History Monk will not die of old age. The History Monk also becomes immune to all mundane Diseases and all (Magical and Mundane) Poisons.
Improved Uncanny Dodge (Ex): This ability functions exactly like the Improved Uncanny Dodge ability of a Barbarian.
Torro-fu (Ex): This martial art allows the History monk to move so fast he doesn't even appear as a blur. A number of times per day per point of Wisdom modifier the History monk has, he may act as if under the efffect of a Time Stop Spell. The History monk may keep up any Time Slicing he has during the rounds, spending time points as normal.
Enlightenment (Ex): The History Monk has reached a state of understanding for all things. The History monk can comunicate with anything that has an Intelligence of 3 or higher in its native tongue.
Also whenever the History Monk rolls a D20, he may spend three time points to re-roll the dice, picking and keeping whichever of the two results he prefers.
Zimmerman's Valley (Ex): A History Monk of 19th level or higher can safely reach Zimmerman's Valley. When a History Monk Time Slices, every round after the first that he continues to use the same Djim, costs him three time points less. For example if he used the 7th level Djim then for the first round it would cost him seven time points then on the second and subsiquent rounds it would cost him only four time points. The cost of a Djim can never be taken below one.
Deja-fu (Ex): This martial art is a legendary technique that only few have ever known. To anyone observing the History Monk it appears as if he is standing stock still yet his opponents are feeling the effects of blows. A master in this art is actually attacking his opponents from the past, his mastery of time is such that he is pulling his opponents body through different speeds of time. While Time Slicing the History monk may, as a Full round action, perform a Deja-fu attack. This attack is the same as the History monks regular full attack action, but may target any opponent within a single move action away and line of sight. The History Monk does not move during the attack and remains in exactly the same spot. As long as the History monk would of had sufficient movement to reach his target, it may be attacked.

[puppyavenger]

um Lu-Tze andlobsong definetly aren't lawful.

[Alex12]

You should give them a new History-Monk-only magic item called a timespinner. It'd be a self-charging device that stores Time Points (and maybe have a timestealer ability or something)

[Nebo_]

I don't think that Stance of the Monkey shoule be a time feat. That, or it should come before level 4.

[Lostintransit]

Well I know their are exceptions to the rules in terms of Lu-Tze and Lobsang, but one was so enlightened nothing he did could be considered chaotic and the other was an incarnation of time so by default had special circumstances apply!

But thats not the point the real question is, what about the rules themselves, do they seem ok? to good? to bad? thats the crux of the issue!!

EDIT: double post! oh and why don't you think it should be a time feat? If given as standard it makes them slightly to powerful we thought....

[DracoDei]

The way it worked in the books Zimmermans valley would have been Time Stop that last for... oh... about 10 minutes per time point spent! (but probably requires about 10 to 30 points to activate before you can start spending for the duration)

[Nebo_]

Having really bad AC for the first four levels would be pretty frustrating for a player. It wouldn't be overpowered at all to give it to them at level 1.

[DracoDei]

Also it isn't Circular REINCARNATION it is CIRCULAR AGING. (Serial Reincarnation is what people who can't quite get the hang of Circular Aging do, the abbot was one of these).

[tyckspoon]

[nitpick]In the printing of the book I have, the ability is time slicing, as in 'cutting it close'. Each passing second is cut into finer and finer bits, and the skill is in fitting yourself into those microseconds.[/nitpick] Of course, the History Monks do a lot of splicing as well, it's just usually more in the style of taking a chunk of time out of the middle of a prehistoric ocean and dropping it into the present day where people need it.

Other than that this looks pretty nice. I was concerned when I saw the 'lose time points generated' clauses on some of the special abilities, but you were generous enough with the time points that those probably won't be a problem. It'd be fun to work up a prestige class based on this concept.. except you seem to have covered most of it already.

[Lostintransit]

Well I'm glad people seem postive so far about it! I can see what you mean about the low AC being a problem at early levels, so I'm tempted to add a Time Feat at 1st level, allowing the player more choice.

Also the splicing thing may just have been the part i took it from, will change to slicing! Any other thoughts?

[levi]

I really like the flavor. Unfortuantly, I haven't read enough of the series to have encountered Time Monks yet. The abilities also seem to be quite good, which is ok, because monks are generally considered weak.

I do have a few critiques though. Firstly, is it really justified to have all the abilities be Extraordinary. These guys seem pretty Supernatural to me. Does the source material explicitly state whether Time Monk abilities should count as magical or not? If not, I suggest that to be in line with the rest of DnD, the abilities that are clearly beyond normal martial arts be changed to Supernatural abilities.

Secondly, I think the use of the term Feat for the Time Feat abilities could be a poor choice. They are a selection of class features, not Feats. Standard practice with classes that have a choice of abilites like this is to use some other term (such as "special ability" for the Rouge, or "combat style" for the Ranger) and reserve the use of "Feat" to refer to actual Feats.

Finally, the higher levels of Time Slicing may get overpowered when combined with bonus damage, such as that from Sneak Attack. Bonus damage dice are always a concern when granting a character additional attacks.

Other than that, not much to complain about. Looks like a fun class to play, especially from a flavor perspective.

[Lostintransit]

I really like the flavor. Unfortuantly, I haven't read enough of the series to have encountered Time Monks yet. The abilities also seem to be quite good, which is ok, because monks are generally considered weak.

I do have a few critiques though. Firstly, is it really justified to have all the abilities be Extraordinary. These guys seem pretty Supernatural to me. Does the source material explicitly state whether Time Monk abilities should count as magical or not? If not, I suggest that to be in line with the rest of DnD, the abilities that are clearly beyond normal martial arts be changed to Supernatural abilities.

Secondly, I think the use of the term Feat for the Time Feat abilities could be a poor choice. They are a selection of class features, not Feats. Standard practice with classes that have a choice of abilites like this is to use some other term (such as "special ability" for the Rouge, or "combat style" for the Ranger) and reserve the use of "Feat" to refer to actual Feats.

Finally, the higher levels of Time Slicing may get overpowered when combined with bonus damage, such as that from Sneak Attack. Bonus damage dice are always a concern when granting a character additional attacks.

Other than that, not much to complain about. Looks like a fun class to play, especially from a flavor perspective.

Well the Time feat name can be changed it was mainly a placeholder till I thought of another name. (Such a Time Training) As for the State of their special abilities being Ex, it is because their powers are not magical their are techniques derived from the teachings of Times lover (I.e an anthropomorphic personification) and as such follow the laws of time. It seems to fit in with the idea of what the monks can do, (I.e magic doesn't stop them using their powers for example)

Well the Djim's were the thing I was most unsure about, due to the high number of attacks at higher levels, but it still seems to be managable (Also as you need to be lawful to take levels in this class, you couldn't stack it with sneak attack as rouges have to be chaotic!)

The most time points I managed to generate at level 20 were just short of 300, which gives you about 60-70 rounds per day of level 7 Djim. (okay that was a character with a wisdom of 39 but hey!)

[levi]

Well the Time feat name can be changed it was mainly a placeholder till I thought of another name. (Such a Time Training)

It's not a big deal. It's just that consistant use of terminology facilitates clearer rules and ease of gameplay.

As for the State of their special abilities being Ex, it is because their powers are not magical their are techniques derived from the teachings of Times lover (I.e an anthropomorphic personification) and as such follow the laws of time.

If there is a clear rationale for them being Ex in the source material, it would be a good idea to follow that. If it could be debated to go either way, aim for balance by making some abilities Su.

It seems to fit in with the idea of what the monks can do, (I.e magic doesn't stop them using their powers for example)

Actually, approximatly a third of the Monk class features are Supernatural. While many of them are not very powerful, a Monk does drop a bit in powerlevel in an anti-magic feild or other magic negating effect. The Time Monk dosn't have any such drawback.

Well the Djim's were the thing I was most unsure about, due to the high number of attacks at higher levels, but it still seems to be managable

I'm not a balancing guru, so I'm not entirely sure. I guess some playtesting would be the best way to figure it out.

(Also as you need to be lawful to take levels in this class, you couldn't stack it with sneak attack as rouges have to be chaotic!)

While it is a common misperception, the Rouge class has no alignment restrictions. Furthermore, the usually accepted view is that using Sneak Attack is not a Chaotic action, so a Lawful character cas use it without risk of an alignment shift.

There are also other sources of bonus damage that don't have even the appearance of being Chaotic, such as Skirmish, or magical weapons with an elemental property.

The most time points I managed to generate at level 20 were just short of 300, which gives you about 60-70 rounds per day of level 7 Djim. (okay that was a character with a wisdom of 39 but hey!)

When you put it that way, it does seem more reasonable.

Edit: While rereading the rules, I though of a few more things.

You should specify in Time Slicing what sort of action it is. Either a "free action" or a "swift action". That way you clearly define what sort of action it is and can remove the paragraph that explains what sort of action it is. The rules you currently have are the same as a free action, but it isn't because you've written special rules that make it "not an action", but restrict it to being used only on the Time Monk's turn. This serves no real gameplay function and only needlessly complicates matters.

Also, in Time Slicing it doesn't specify what sort of attacks may be made with the Dijim. As this ability is meant to replace the Monk's Flurry of Blows ability, it should proably be limited to Monk Special Weapons and Unarmed Attacks. As it's currently written, the character can use any sort of attack they have, including more powerful non-Monk weapons, and even odd stuff like the Warlock's Eldritch Blast.

Finally, Time Slicing doesn't specify that the Time Monk must make a full attack to gain the extra attacks. Unless this is intentional, a statement to that effect should be added. If it is intentional, I'd urge you to reconsider it, as such an ability seems really unbalanced to me.

[DracoDei]

Well the Djim's were the thing I was most unsure about, due to the high number of attacks at higher levels, but it still seems to be managable (Also as you need to be lawful to take levels in this class, you couldn't stack it with sneak attack as rouges have to be chaotic!)

Not by the RAW, and not in any game I have every played they don't!

I also agree that the abilities should be Supernatural... not Spell-like, but DEFINITELY Supernatural.

[Lostintransit]

It's not a big deal. It's just that consistant use of terminology facilitates clearer rules and ease of gameplay.

Sorted that now, have editted the original post to Time training!

If there is a clear rationale for them being Ex in the source material, it would be a good idea to follow that. If it could be debated to go either way, aim for balance by making some abilities Su.

Actually, approximatly a third of the Monk class features are Supernatural. While many of them are not very powerful, a Monk does drop a bit in powerlevel in an anti-magic feild or other magic negating effect. The Time Monk dosn't have any such drawback.

Lol, this was a misunderstanding, when I said a monks abilities, i meant the History Monks abilities not a regular monks abilities. The History monks, as per fluff, are not stopped in a magic field, only a complete shattering of time halts them on that plane!!

I'm not a balancing guru, so I'm not entirely sure. I guess some playtesting would be the best way to figure it out.

Not a problem, you have been very helpful even so!

While it is a common misperception, the Rouge class has no alignment restrictions. Furthermore, the usually accepted view is that using Sneak Attack is not a Chaotic action, so a Lawful character cas use it without risk of an alignment shift.

another misunderstanding I'm affraid! In our world rouges have to be chaotic, but i can see why in regular games it would be a problem.

There are also other sources of bonus damage that don't have even the appearance of being Chaotic, such as Skirmish, or magical weapons with an elemental property.

When you put it that way, it does seem more reasonable.

I completly forgot about magic weapons and elemental damage! I'm thinking of putting in a limit to monk weapons or unarmed only......

Edit: While rereading the rules, I though of a few more things.

You should specify in Time Slicing what sort of action it is. Either a "free action" or a "swift action". That way you clearly define what sort of action it is and can remove the paragraph that explains what sort of action it is. The rules you currently have are the same as a free action, but it isn't because you've written special rules that make it "not an action", but restrict it to being used only on the Time Monk's turn. This serves no real gameplay function and only needlessly complicates matters.

Its the same action as a barbarians rage class feature, hence copying the text!

[Also, in Time Slicing it doesn't specify what sort of attacks may be made with the Dijim. As this ability is meant to replace the Monk's Flurry of Blows ability, it should proably be limited to Monk Special Weapons and Unarmed Attacks. As it's currently written, the character can use any sort of attack they have, including more powerful non-Monk weapons, and even odd stuff like the Warlock's Eldritch Blast.

Finally, Time Slicing doesn't specify that the Time Monk must make a full attack to gain the extra attacks. Unless this is intentional, a statement to that effect should be added. If it is intentional, I'd urge you to reconsider it, as such an ability seems really unbalanced to me.

See above for the first part in response to attacking with weapons, as for the second part if you look at the Djim table it says that the bonus attacks are only gained when making a full attack action, hence you can only gain the attacks whgen full attacking!!

[levi]

Lol, this was a misunderstanding, when I said a monks abilities, i meant the History Monks abilities not a regular monks abilities. The History monks, as per fluff, are not stopped in a magic field, only a complete shattering of time halts them on that plane!

I see, Extrordinary does seem to be a good fit them.

Not a problem, you have been very helpful even so!

I do what I can.

another misunderstanding I'm affraid! In our world rouges have to be chaotic, but i can see why in regular games it would be a problem.

Well, unless you specify that you're developing the content for a specific set of house rules, the assumption is that you're using baseline d20.

I completly forgot about magic weapons and elemental damage! I'm thinking of putting in a limit to monk weapons or unarmed only...

That would be consistant with the baseline Monk and is proably a good balancing technique.

Its the same action as a barbarians rage class feature, hence copying the text!

Well, so it is. Still, the Barbarian rage rules are silly. It's a free action. There is no game play difference. I don't know why the Barbarian is written that way, but you should just say it's a free action.

See above for the first part in response to attacking with weapons, as for the second part if you look at the Djim table it says that the bonus attacks are only gained when making a full attack action, hence you can only gain the attacks whgen full attacking!

Ah, silly me. I was looking at the rules text and somehow missed the part in the table. I think it might be clearer if you wrote a paragraph explaining what the benifits of a Dijim are, with a bit about referencing the table for the specific numbers. This would also allow you to reduce the vertical height of the table by reducing the length of the extra attacks sections. For instance, something like this:

While in a Dijim state, the Time Monk gains a number of benefits due to his highly accelerated speed. He gains a <type> bonus to armor class, attack and damage rolls, and reflex saves, and his speed increases. Additionally, when making a full attack, he gains a number of additional attacks at his full attack modifier. See the table below for the exact benefits gained at each Dijim level.

This would be more like the way such rules are normally worded. You should also specify a type for the bonuses granted. I put "<type>" in the above example because I'm not familar enough with the source material to make a good judgement as to what type the bonuses should be.

Also note that I specified "full attack modifier" rather than "full base attack bonus". This is because there are a number of effects (such as using Power Attack or Combat Expertise, taking a pentalty to attack due to a negative condition or dual weilding, etc.) that can make one's attack modifier different from one's base attack bonus. Also, your base attack bonus (even when "full") doesn't include your strength, size bonus, etc.

[Lostintransit]

Well, so it is. Still, the Barbarian rage rules are silly. It's a free action. There is no game play difference. I don't know why the Barbarian is written that way, but you should just say it's a free action.

I thought there were effects that prevented you from taking free actions? Hence why I plan on keeping it as worded, unless labelled as a free action makes it easier....

Ah, silly me. I was looking at the rules text and somehow missed the part in the table. I think it might be clearer if you wrote a paragraph explaining what the benifits of a Dijim are, with a bit about referencing the table for the specific numbers. This would also allow you to reduce the vertical height of the table by reducing the length of the extra attacks sections. For instance, something like this:

While in a Dijim state, the Time Monk gains a number of benefits due to his highly accelerated speed. He gains a <type> bonus to armor class, attack and damage rolls, and reflex saves, and his speed increases. Additionally, when making a full attack, he gains a number of additional attacks at his full attack modifier. See the table below for the exact benefits gained at each Dijim level.

This would be more like the way such rules are normally worded. You should also specify a type for the bonuses granted. I put "<type>" in the above example because I'm not familar enough with the source material to make a good judgement as to what type the bonuses should be.

Also note that I specified "full attack modifier" rather than "full base attack bonus". This is because there are a number of effects (such as using Power Attack or Combat Expertise, taking a pentalty to attack due to a negative condition or dual weilding, etc.) that can make one's attack modifier different from one's base attack bonus. Also, your base attack bonus (even when "full") doesn't include your strength, size bonus, etc.

I like this idea alot, I will add it as text to the Class, the type bonus will have to, of course, be Time. The reason for the full BAB attack thing is due to the Djim being based off of the Haste Spell, actualy thats a thought, I have not put in a clause against haste yet! must do that!

[levi]

I thought there were effects that prevented you from taking free actions? Hence why I plan on keeping it as worded, unless labelled as a free action makes it easier...

You may have a point. Anyway, it's not a big deal. I though it might simplify and shorten the rules, but there may be some obscure rules interaction that I'm not aware of. Perhaps someone who knows more about this can enlighten us.

I like this idea alot, I will add it as text to the Class, the type bonus will have to, of course, be Time.

Well, there is no "time" bonus type. If you feel that it's really necessary, go ahead and use it, but be aware that inventing bonus types is usually frowned apon. You'd be just as well to use an untyped bonus. Since nothing else in the game would grant a time bonus, the end effect, stacking of the bonuses, would be the same.

As for haste, the Attack bonus is unnamed, the AC bonus is a dodge bonus, and the speed increase is an enhancement bonus. Unnamed bonuses always stack, dodge bonuses stack, so the only one that might not stack would be the speed bonus. Although, enhancement bonuses to movement are not that common, so stacking or not may never come up.

Given that most of the effects of haste are stacking bonuses, using untyped bonuses may work just as well as anything else. However, dodge bonuses to AC are negated when flat-footed or otherwise denied your Dex bonus to AC, so you may want to consider a dodge bonus for the AC and Ref buffs. This makes sense for both balance and flavor reasons.

The reason for the full BAB attack thing is due to the Djim being based off of the Haste Spell, actualy thats a thought, I have not put in a clause against haste yet! must do that!

Well, in the haste spell, after the part about full BAB, it says "...plus any modifiers...", which actually covers quite a lot.

As for not allowing stacking with haste, see the haste spell for a nice block of rules-ese that covers this and other nitty gritty details of extra attacks. It's the bit in parenthesis at the end of the second paragraph. Something similar should work well.

You may also want to consider the interaction with the slow spell.

[Lostintransit]

Good idea about the slow spell, will add that in as well.

Will also change time bonus to un-named bonus.

So any more thoughts?

[Alex12]

Ah, what about Time Stitching? Perhaps as a high-level skill that lets them spend Time Points to reroll a roll they just made?

I'd also suggest some sort of immunity to time-based spells (So something like Temporal Stasis would not affect them unless they wanted it to)

[TheLogman]

I'd rule that Deja-Fu defied a Target both Dodge and Dex bonuses, since you are attacking them without them seeing either your movements or blows.

Very nice class, it seems perfectly in line with Prachet's novels, and it seems to be excellent crunch-wise as well.

[Lostintransit]

I'd rule that Deja-Fu defied a Target both Dodge and Dex bonuses, since you are attacking them without them seeing either your movements or blows.

Very nice class, it seems perfectly in line with Prachet's novels, and it seems to be excellent crunch-wise as well.

Well firstly I'm glad you liked the class! I wasn't sure if it was to over powered but it seems to be going down well!

As for Deja-fu, I didn't want it to be to powerful, because as it stands, you can make around 10 attacks at any target with 240Ft, or a multitude of targets at 240Ft. However I do think that denying dex and dodge is characterful as the blows do come from the past.

EDIT: Qoute from Alex12; Ah, what about Time Stitching? Perhaps as a high-level skill that lets them spend Time Points to reroll a roll they just made?

I'd also suggest some sort of immunity to time-based spells (So something like Temporal Stasis would not affect them unless they wanted it to)

Well I like the idea of a re-roll skill, maybe it would work as a Time Training. As for immunity to Time spells, that seems a very good idea, Itr would free up some text in the Time Slicing section..

Any other Thoughts?

[Nebo_]

Well I like the idea of a re-roll skill, maybe it would work as a Time Training. As for immunity to Time spells, that seems a very good idea, Itr would free up some text in the Time Slicing section..

Logsang had immunity to timestop, but that didn't really have anything to do with his training. But it would still be great to see - being in a wizard's timestop with him.

[Lostintransit]

Logsang had immunity to timestop, but that didn't really have anything to do with his training. But it would still be great to see - being in a wizard's timestop with him.

thats exactly what I was thinking, the wizard casts time stop to get away, when suddenly the monk starts attacking him! I will add some more text as a Time Training as follows:

(Fancy name here): The History monk has become adept at reacting to abnormal time situtions, allowing him to react almost instantly to anyone manipulating time. The history monk is immune to all effects from time based spells and acts normally during any such situtions. The history Monk generates two less time points from his total maximum allowed.

Thoughts?

[jindra34]

thats exactly what I was thinking, the wizard casts time stop to get away, when suddenly the monk starts attacking him! I will add some more text as a Time Training as follows:

(Fancy name here): The History monk has become adept at reacting to abnormal time situtions, allowing him to react almost instantly to anyone manipulating time. The history monk is immune to all effects from time based spells and acts normally during any such situtions. The history Monk generates two less time points from his total maximum allowed.

Thoughts?

Name= Temporal adaptability. and yes it looks great.

[Lostintransit]

Name= Temporal adaptability. and yes it looks great.

Glad! however is the wording good or not? does it conform to Wotc style for DnD (i.e. does it makes sense in rule terms, would someone look at that and go huh??)

EDIT: have named it after one of the martial arts in the book: Upsidazi

[DracoDei]

Eh... Lobsang had that ability because of who he was born as and NO other reason... if you want to include it in the class that is fine... but I would really consider NOT naming it after one of the martial arts listed in the book.

[Lostintransit]

Eh... Lobsang had that ability because of who he was born as and NO other reason... if you want to include it in the class that is fine... but I would really consider NOT naming it after one of the martial arts listed in the book.

Huh, I'm a bit confused... I thought the point of the ability was that the monk could keep up with whatever fancy time spell was thrown around, hence the immunity, didn't think it was just a pure lobsang power.

Aslo as the class is designed to be the History monks why is naming it after a named art bad? Is it to do with the type of power, or due to some other reason??

[Nebo_]

Because having your own time when there is no other time isn't something that the time monks can do.

Spoiler

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Lobsang could only do it because he is the son of Time.

[Total_Viking_Power]

Yay! Great idea More Pratchett to the People!!!

Do you think, for the sake of good cheer, that you could throw a +4 bonus to craft(bonzai mountains) in the mix?

I cannot comment on the mechanics, but flavorwize, speaking as a zealous Discworld fan, this is spot on. Good work!