Vedalken Eldricht Knight

[adb82]

Hello everyone,
I'm currently trying to build a Dex based Vedalken EK, using Shadow Blade and a shield, with the dueling fighting style.
I rolled the stats and i got an interesting 11 str, 19 Dex, 16 con, 13 int, 13 wis, 13 cha. (We are using tasha's Custom Origin rules)
The campaign gonna end around level 14, maybe 16, with some few chance to go till the end.
I think the build can't start otherwise than EK 8, that's mean 3 feats till that point, im thinking about warcaster @4, elven accuracy (+1 Dex) @6, Alert @8 or maybe one between Resilient (wis) and lucky. From here on I'm not that sure about what to do, I'm very tempted to get couple levels of War Magic wizard, for get also some extra slots beside the defensive bonuses, and than again get couple lv of Paladin for smite, than whenever it gonna end I'll take only WW levels, or I can reach EK 11 for the third attack (lv 15 of the character).
Which do you think it can work enough well? Or when and how you would multiclass for the concept i have in mind? Considering it have to deal damage and be enough tanky, because it is probably the one DPS in the group and no other one can tank.

[nickl_2000]

How would you do Elven Accuracy? A Vedalken isn't allowed.

As for War Wizard, 2-3 levels is terrific for survival. More level 1 spells, level 1 and level 2 rituals, and massive amazing defense and is really good on both EK and AT (ran an AT 12/WW 5 and loved that PC).

[RogueJK]

Vedalkans are not Elves, so therefore are not eligible for Elven Accuracy. If you're wanting a DEX half-feat, take a look at Skill Expert. Otherwise, you could just do +1 DEX and +1 INT as your Level 6 or 8 ASI. Taking Resilient WIS at 8 or 12 is a good plan.

Also, you don't have the stats necessary to multiclass into Paladin, which requires 13 STR and 13 CHA, unless you were to spend an ASI on +2 STR. Dipping Paladin 2 wouldn't be worthwhile anyway, especially if it cost you an ASI for basically no gain. Being a 1/3 caster, the EK doesn't have the spell slots to sustain repeated Divine Smites throughout the day, and basically all your 1st level slots will be reserved for Shield/Absorb Elements and all your 2nd and 3rd level spell slots will be reserved for Shadow Blade anyway.

2 levels of War Wizard, on the other hand, is potentially worthwhile, for the defensive ability, the boost to your higher level spell slots for upcasting Shadow Blade, access to 1st level Ritual casting, and Arcane Recovery of a 1st level slot. Here's an example of an effective DEX-based Shadow Blade Eldritch Knight build that takes 2 levels of War Wizard after hitting your 3rd Attack at EK 11: https://forums.giantitp.com/showsing...&postcount=523 However, see above about Elven Accuracy, so the Elven Accuracy aspect of that specific Shadar-Kai EK build is not doable with a Vedalkan.

Or rather than waiting until after EK 11, you could potentially take those 2 levels of War Wizard as early as after EK 8, and just lean on War Magic for Booming Shadow Blade + BA Shadow Blade to compensate for the delay in your 3rd Attack. This would mean giving up a bit of damage from Level 11-13 in return for access to the War Wizard's defensive ability, ritual spells, Arcane Recovery, and spell slot progression several levels earlier.

Something like this:
Vedalkan Eldritch Knight Fighter 8 -> War Wizard 2 (going straight Eldritch Knight after that)
STR 11
DEX 19
CON 16
INT 13
WIS 13
CHA 13
Dueling Fighting Style
ASIs: Warcaster at 4, 20 DEX/14 INT at 6, Resilient WIS (14 WIS) at 8
EK Cantrips: Booming Blade, and a utility cantrip like Minor Illusion
EK Spells: Shield, Absorb Elements, Protection from Evil and Good, and Mage Armor
EK "Any School" Spells: Find Familiar at 3 and Shadow Blade at 8, then swap Find Familiar to something else like Misty Step once you have access to FF as a Wizard Ritual spell
War Wizard Cantrips: Three more utility cantrips like Mage Hand, Message, and Mold Earth
War Wizard Spells: All the 1st level Ritual spells you can get

[DarknessEternal]

You're not combining Eldritch Knight and shadowblade in anything resembling normal D&D. Even devoting all of your spell slots to it leaves you without for many combats in a day.

If you aren't expecting to get into that many combats per day, don't be a Fighter at all.

[RogueJK]

You're not combining Eldritch Knight and shadowblade in anything resembling normal D&D. Even devoting all of your spell slots to it leaves you without for many combats in a day.

You'd utilize a Rapier from Level 1-7 before Shadow Blade comes online, and then continue to use the Rapier in combats when you can't/don't want to cast Shadow Blade, saving Shadow Blade for the bigger/longer/tougher fights where the extra damage is more impactful.

By the time you hit EK 9/WW 2, you'd have 3x 2nd level slots and 2x 3rd level slots. That's 5 Shadow Blades per day, 3x at 2d8 damage and 2x at 3d8 damage. That's going to cover the majority of your combats in an average adventuring day (6-8 by the book).

[da newt]

A rig of spell storing is always handy for an EK.

[adb82]

Vedalkans are not Elves, so therefore are not eligible for Elven Accuracy. If you're wanting a DEX half-feat, take a look at Skill Expert. Otherwise, you could just do +1 DEX and +1 INT as your Level 6 or 8 ASI. Taking Resilient WIS at 8 or 12 is a good plan.

Also, you don't have the stats necessary to multiclass into Paladin, which requires 13 STR and 13 CHA, unless you were to spend an ASI on +2 STR. Dipping Paladin 2 wouldn't be worthwhile anyway, especially if it cost you an ASI for basically no gain. Being a 1/3 caster, the EK doesn't have the spell slots to sustain repeated Divine Smites throughout the day, and basically all your 1st level slots will be reserved for Shield/Absorb Elements and all your 2nd and 3rd level spell slots will be reserved for Shadow Blade anyway.

2 levels of War Wizard, on the other hand, is potentially worthwhile, for the defensive ability, the boost to your higher level spell slots for upcasting Shadow Blade, access to 1st level Ritual casting, and Arcane Recovery of a 1st level slot. Here's an example of an effective DEX-based Shadow Blade Eldritch Knight build that takes 2 levels of War Wizard after hitting your 3rd Attack at EK 11: https://forums.giantitp.com/showsing...&postcount=523 However, see above about Elven Accuracy, so the Elven Accuracy aspect of that specific Shadar-Kai EK build is not doable with a Vedalkan.

Or rather than waiting until after EK 11, you could potentially take those 2 levels of War Wizard as early as after EK 8, and just lean on War Magic for Booming Shadow Blade + BA Shadow Blade to compensate for the delay in your 3rd Attack. This would mean giving up a bit of damage from Level 11-13 in return for access to the War Wizard's defensive ability, ritual spells, Arcane Recovery, and spell slot progression several levels earlier.

Something like this:
Vedalkan Eldritch Knight Fighter 8 -> War Wizard 2 (going straight Eldritch Knight after that)
STR 11
DEX 19
CON 16
INT 13
WIS 13
CHA 13
Dueling Fighting Style
ASIs: Warcaster at 4, 20 DEX/14 INT at 6, Resilient WIS (14 WIS) at 8
EK Cantrips: Booming Blade, and a utility cantrip like Minor Illusion
EK Spells: Shield, Absorb Elements, Protection from Evil and Good, and Mage Armor
EK "Any School" Spells: Find Familiar at 3 and Shadow Blade at 8, then swap Find Familiar to something else like Misty Step once you have access to FF as a Wizard Ritual spell
War Wizard Cantrips: Three more utility cantrips like Mage Hand, Message, and Mold Earth
War Wizard Spells: All the 1st level Ritual spells you can get

Yep, I made a mess, i confused elven accuracy with the bladesinger class that before was allowed only for elven kind characters and now is free to choose for every race. So, the race is elf Shadar - Kai.
I was thinking also couple of alternatives to the war mage, but I'm not sure they gonna work as well, probably War Wizard keep being a more solid choice:

After lv 8/9 EK (or 11) go for cleric all the way, specifically Twilight, Trickery, or Tempest. Twilight protect also my allies, trickery for when I'm not in dim light or i can't cast a shadow blade, and tempest give some nova damage, both will give me good spells like spiritual weapon that keep damage up, especially when i don't cast Shadow Blade (as they both require a bonus action), but even aid and some other good spell to upcast (unluckily no counterspell, but by that time our bard should have it), and both will get also divine strike that unluckily don't stack with action surge. Probably Twilight would be stronger, but probably still below the War Wizard one.
Gloomstalker after lv 11 is also a very nice choice (also very thematic for a Shadar Kai), but i suppose it depends on how much i feel safe with the saves at that point and how many Shadow Blade i want to cast during the day, or i have to hope to get lv 16 for see it in play (but anyway i can't add it before lv 11, so it can't be in play before lv 14).
I was thinking also about hexblade, that again, thematically it's nice for a Shadar Kai, but the slots not stacking don't excite me so much.
Shadow sorcerer also seem not bad, good also thematically, but it do nothing to push up defenses.

[RogueJK]

With a 13 WIS, Tempest won't be giving you much nova damage, and Spiritual Weapon won't be very useful either. Your +1 WISMOD will cause your spell DCs and attack bonuses to be pitiful, especially since it's going to be Tier 3 before your Tempest Cleric damage spells start to become available.

So either way, if you go Cleric/Sorcerer/Wizard after EK 8, you're going to have to stick with spells that don't rely on your INT/WIS/CHA score. That means no attack spells or save spells. Stick to utility spells, defensive spells, and buff spells. But you'll primarily be using upper level spell slots to upcast Shadow Blade anyway.

[adb82]

With a 13 WIS, Tempest won't be giving you much nova damage, and Spiritual Weapon won't be very useful either. Your +1 WISMOD will cause your spell DCs and attack bonuses to be pitiful, especially since it's going to be Tier 3 before your Tempest Cleric damage spells start to become available.

So either way, if you go Cleric/Sorcerer/Wizard after EK 8, you're going to have to stick with spells that don't rely on your INT/WIS/CHA score. That means no attack spells or save spells. Stick to utility spells, defensive spells, and buff spells. But you'll primarily be using upper level spell slots to upcast Shadow Blade anyway.

True, but once i get my first 3 asi's (warcaster, elven accuracy, resilient wis) at lv 8, the others can be take to bump wis to 16/18 (even 20 wis, if it will get to lv 20), and anyway it won't get spiritual weapon before character lv 11, while at lv 12 it can have already 16 wis (18 wis at character lv 16). The same can't be done with int or cha because resilient is kinda useless in that stats. But I agree with you that the war wizard rute (divination and chronurgy also are nice, but I still prefer war magic) is more optimized.
I really love the Gloomstalker option, especially for thematic reason (but that attack in the beginning of the turn that stack with action surge it's also huge), unluckily I'm not sure we ll get lv 16 for get also the war wizard archetype, but if I'll feel that Resilient and maybe lucky is enough for the mental defences, and that i don't need that many upcast of shadow blade, i would love to try it after lv 11. Unluckily it don't stack with war magic, so i can't add it in before lv 11, this make me think that the Bladesinger would be better for it, as it's double attack with cantrip stack with the Gloomstalker attack, he has better spells, earlier shadow blade, more slots, at the cost of couple lv delay on the second attack, assuming starting fighter for con saves. In theory a triclass echo knight/Gloomstalker/bladesinger could work well, but it need int and lots of ability score improvement, so probably in practice it's not that playable, even with my stats, while probably echo knight4/bladesinger x (starting with fighter 1/BS 6) or Gloomstalker 4/bladesinger x (going first BS 6) can be less difficult to build, but probably the bladesinger is better straight, without multiclass it, and that's the reason why i normally don't play it unless i want to play a wizard with insane AC, as after lv 9 it will probably play mostly as a wizard and rarely as a gish.

Ps of course any Bladesinger multiclass should start int 16, con 14 somehow.

[Gignere]

True, but once i get my first 3 asi's (warcaster, elven accuracy, resilient wis) at lv 8, the others can be take to bump wis to 16/18 (even 20 wis, if it will get to lv 20), and anyway it won't get spiritual weapon before character lv 11, while at lv 12 it can have already 16 wis (18 wis at character lv 16). The same can't be done with int or cha because resilient is kinda useless in that stats. But I agree with you that the war wizard rute (divination and chronurgy also are nice, but I still prefer war magic) is more optimized.
I really love the Gloomstalker option, especially for thematic reason (but that attack in the beginning of the turn that stack with action surge it's also huge), unluckily I'm not sure we ll get lv 16 for get also the war wizard archetype, but if I'll feel that Resilient and maybe lucky is enough for the mental defences, and that i don't need that many upcast of shadow blade, i would love to try it after lv 11. Unluckily it don't stack with war magic, so i can't add it in before lv 11, this make me think that the Bladesinger would be better for it, as it's double attack with cantrip stack with the Gloomstalker attack, he has better spells, earlier shadow blade, more slots, at the cost of couple lv delay on the second attack, assuming starting fighter for con saves. In theory a triclass echo knight/Gloomstalker/bladesinger could work well, but it need int and lots of ability score improvement, so probably in practice it's not that playable, even with my stats, while probably echo knight4/bladesinger x (starting with fighter 1/BS 6) or Gloomstalker 4/bladesinger x (going first BS 6) can be less difficult to build, but probably the bladesinger is better straight, without multiclass it, and that's the reason why i normally don't play it unless i want to play a wizard with insane AC, as after lv 9 it will probably play mostly as a wizard and rarely as a gish.

Ps of course it should start int 16, con 14 somehow.

I’m currently playing a BS that casts Shadowblade in every fight that matters and you’ll want to start with 13 con and grab resilient con asap anyway. So you won’t be able to get elven accuracy until level 8 unless your DM allows you to start with a free feat which mine did.

But I’m really enjoying it, and it fights very differently from a fighter, because you can only use Bladesong in a couple of fights initially so you won’t have very high AC in every fight.

However, the beauty about Shadowblade is that you can use it to fight at range. You can throw it up to 20 feet with no issue. So you can skirmish / midline when you don’t have Bladesong or it’s a fight you don’t care to have Bladesong up.

This will work until you have 4+ bladesongs a day which should allow you to frontline fight in every encounter that matters.

[adb82]

I’m currently playing a BS that casts Shadowblade in every fight that matters and you’ll want to start with 13 con and grab resilient con asap anyway. So you won’t be able to get elven accuracy until level 8 unless your DM allows you to start with a free feat which mine did.

But I’m really enjoying it, and it fights very differently from a fighter, because you can only use Bladesong in a couple of fights initially so you won’t have very high AC in every fight.

However, the beauty about Shadowblade is that you can use it to fight at range. You can throw it up to 20 feet with no issue. So you can skirmish / midline when you don’t have Bladesong or it’s a fight you don’t care to have Bladesong up.

This will work until you have 4+ bladesongs a day which should allow you to frontline fight in every encounter that matters.

Fighter can be a good entry dip indeed for the con saves (getting the second fighter lv once you reach lv 9 BS), and for so get other feats earlier and use resilient for wis. All great stuff for a BS.
Anyway, you exactly centred my point: till lv 8 you don't have Elven accuracy, and after lv 9 you want probably be focused on something else than shadow blade. It may seem silly to say, but it have too magic powers in my opinion for keep being a gish. It's still a very good Gish, and it deal very hight damage, a monster after lv 13 with simulacrum, but it probably can be more useful to the party in some other way, or well, that was my feeling.

[Gignere]

Fighter can be a good entry dip indeed for the con saves (getting the second fighter lv once you reach lv 9 BS), and for so get other feats earlier and use resilient for wis. All great stuff for a BS.
Anyway, you exactly centred my point: till lv 8 you don't have Elven accuracy, and after lv 9 you want probably be focused on something else than shadow blade. It may seem silly to say, but it have too magic powers in my opinion for keep being a gish. It's still a very good Gish, and it deal very hight damage, a monster after lv 13 with simulacrum, but it probably can be more useful to the party in some other way, or well, that was my feeling.

Yes but it can still be very good frontline, maybe more effective as a pure caster but in the group I am in I am very up front to the group that I’m not the usual wizard so don’t expect me to blast, control the battle field and stay in the back lines. I’m the beat stick wizard that can tank in hard fights. So the pure caster niche is being filled by a sorcerer and another sorlock.

I also select spells that doesn’t allow me to be the usual wizard, which I find a rewarding exercise as well. Basically I pick spells that optimizes my role as the BSF and at the same time deemphasizes my wizard foundation.

It’s gotten to the point that even my DM forgets I’m wizard because I don’t do your typical wizard tactics but remaining a very effective contributor to the parties success. You might be surprised but to find even pre simulacrum, spells like Shadowblade, animate objects, and Tensers (especially combined with Elven Accuracy) are very effective spells that can allow you to fill the DPR / Offtank role very successfully.

If you’re good at the role you told the party there is no reason you need to go back to being a wizard. Comparative advantages matter in the party not absolute advantages.

Really didn’t need the fighter dip, however your stats are way better than what I rolled and you should consider a 2 level Paladin dip with Bladesinger.

Crit fishing smites while dual wielding using Transformation plus Elven Accuracy would be quite insane.

[RogueJK]

Fighter can be a good entry dip indeed for the con saves

Artificer is typically a better choice for a 1 level dip at the start for a caster to gain CON save proficiency. You still get Light Armor, Medium Armor, and Shield proficiency, but it doesn't slow down your spell slot progression due to the special half-caster calculations used by the Artificer class (gaining a spell level on odd numbered levels instead of even like other half-casters), and you get access to a couple additional cantrips along with a couple 1st level spells known from a spell list that's a blend of divine/nature/arcane magic so there's bound to be some options that wouldn't otherwise be available to you.

Thus, unless you're specifically planning to take Fighter 2 at some point to gain Action Surge, or you really need the fighting style or martial weapon proficiency for a gish build, Artificer 1 is typically a better choice than Fighter 1 on a spellcaster.

This is especially true for most Wizards that want armor/shield proficiency, since both Artificer and Wizard are INT-based casters.


However, I don't think dipping anything for CON save proficiency is worth it on a Bladesinger specifically, since they don't need the armor/shield proficiency, plus their access to Extra Attack is delayed to Level 6 anyway, and you don't really want to further delay it to Level 7. Most importantly, they already get +INT to Concentration checks while Bladesinging, which will apply to most serious fights. You definitely don't need both Warcaster AND CON proficiency (via dip or Resilient) on a Bladesinger.

Additionally, remember that Bladesingers are Wizards first and melee fighters second, and even with Shadow Blade they'll reach a point around spell level 4 or 5 and onward (Wizard 7+) where most of their turns are going to be better spent casting and Concentrating on bigger spells rather than wading into melee combat. And with this particular character, the fact that you only have a 13 INT will seriously cramp not only your Wizard spellcasting but also your Bladesong AC and Concentration boosts. So I'm not sure that Bladesinger would be the best choice for this PC, unless you're okay with eventually being more of a caster than a fighter, and you can swap around your ability scores to have a higher INT, such as starting 15 INT and 14 CON instead of 13 INT and 16 CON, then using Elven Accuracy to get 16 INT at Wizard 4, then doing something like Warcaster at Bladesinger 8 and 18 INT at Wizard 12. (You don't really need a 20 DEX to be an effective DEX gish in Tiers 1 and 2.)

Also realize that Bladesong requires a BA to activate, and Shadow Blade requires a BA to cast, so that's a whole turn of setup before you can be at full combat power and making Bladesinging Shadow Blade attacks starting on the 2nd turn.


Therefore, I'd recommend thinking hard and deciding which one you want to be your focus, especially in later Tier 2 and onwards: Melee fighting with a side of Wizard casting (EK X/WW 2 with your original stat spread and ASI plan), or Wizard casting with a side of melee fighting (Bladesinger with a higher INT at the start and boosting INT with ASIs)

[adb82]

Yes but it can still be very good frontline, maybe more effective as a pure caster but in the group I am in I am very up front to the group that I’m not the usual wizard so don’t expect me to blast, control the battle field and stay in the back lines. I’m the beat stick wizard that can tank in hard fights. So the pure caster niche is being filled by a sorcerer and another sorlock.

I also select spells that doesn’t allow me to be the usual wizard, which I find a rewarding exercise as well. Basically I pick spells that optimizes my role as the BSF and at the same time deemphasizes my wizard foundation.

It’s gotten to the point that even my DM forgets I’m wizard because I don’t do your typical wizard tactics but remaining a very effective contributor to the parties success. You might be surprised but to find even pre simulacrum, spells like Shadowblade, animate objects, and Tensers (especially combined with Elven Accuracy) are very effective spells that can allow you to fill the DPR / Offtank role very successfully.

If you’re good at the role you told the party there is no reason you need to go back to being a wizard. Comparative advantages matter in the party not absolute advantages.

Really didn’t need the fighter dip, however your stats are way better than what I rolled and you should consider a 2 level Paladin dip with Bladesinger.

Crit fishing smites while dual wielding using Transformation plus Elven Accuracy would be quite insane.

Absolutely, it works perfectly well also like you described, as i said it deal tons of damage, but i wouldn't consider animate object really "melee", and tenser don't let you cast anything else, so you just end being a fighter. Shadow Blade it's of course nice, but if i think about wall of force, bigbie hand, even banishment can take out from combat an enemy in one turn, these are probably all spells that i would use in big fights, but also polimorph or greater invisibility compete a lot with shadow blade. Also the fact that SB and bladesong require both a bonus action it's not so optimal, and also once you have enough bladesong a day, your spells can be far more powerful than shadow blade, talking about utilities on the table. When I played it, i felt it's nice for alternate some fights with shadow blade, with some fights concentrating on other spells, but i found out myself using much less SB after lv 9, using it again frequently from lv 13, with the simulacrum casting spells, while my pg was dealing damage with SB or tenser.
Anyway, i suppose it's all about the way i feel it, I'm probably searching for something more able to be constantly in melee even without limited uses of bladesong, also because my group is made by a ranged artificer, a bard, an healer and this character, both the healer and the artificer can fly (tiefling), the bard is an half elf, but he ll probably take glamour, so i doubt he ll want to be in melee range.

[adb82]

Artificer is typically a better choice for a 1 level dip at the start for a caster to gain CON save proficiency. You still get Light Armor, Medium Armor, and Shield proficiency, but it doesn't slow down your spell slot progression due to the special half-caster calculations used by the Artificer class (gaining a spell level on odd numbered levels instead of even like other half-casters), and you get access to a couple additional cantrips along with a couple 1st level spells known from a spell list that's a blend of divine/nature/arcane magic so there's bound to be some options that wouldn't otherwise be available to you.

Thus, unless you're specifically planning to take Fighter 2 at some point to gain Action Surge, or you really need the fighting style or martial weapon proficiency for a gish build, Artificer 1 is typically a better choice than Fighter 1 on a spellcaster.

This is especially true for most Wizards that want armor/shield proficiency, since both Artificer and Wizard are INT-based casters.


However, I don't think dipping anything for CON save proficiency is worth it on a Bladesinger specifically, since they don't need the armor/shield proficiency, plus their access to Extra Attack is delayed to Level 6 anyway, and you don't really want to further delay it to Level 7. Most importantly, they already get +INT to Concentration checks while Bladesinging, which will apply to most serious fights. You definitely don't need both Warcaster AND CON proficiency (via dip or Resilient) on a Bladesinger.

Yep, artificer it's nice for don't lose that much slots progression, but i like the action surge later on for add some nova to a character that, in my opinion, really need it.

I doubt my DM allow me to cast anything with a shield and a weapon in the hands without the warcaster feat, as i doubt the feat it's enough to be safe mostly of time with just +2 con, but getting wis proficiency and warcaster is good anyway, and yea, probably better; a straight bladesinger is more "powerful" in terms of utility on the table, that's sure, but i love the idea of action surge for crit fishing with SB and elven accuracy.

[RogueJK]

I doubt my DM allow me to cast anything with a shield and a weapon in the hands without the warcaster feat

My post was talking about a Bladesinger specifically, which wouldn't be using a shield anyway. Even if you dip Fighter or Artificer, Bladesingers lose their Bladesong if they use medium/heavy armor or a shield, so they generally fight with a 1H weapon in one hand (as you would be doing with a Rapier or Shadow Blade) and the other hand empty, which means that other hand is free for casting without necessitating Warcaster.

[adb82]

My post was talking about a Bladesinger specifically, which wouldn't be using a shield anyway. Even if you dip Fighter or Artificer, Bladesingers lose their Bladesong if they use medium/heavy armor or a shield, so they generally fight with a 1H weapon in one hand (as you would be doing with a Rapier or Shadow Blade) and the other hand empty, which means that other hand is free for casting without necessitating Warcaster.

Ah yep, it can't use a shield (my head is still focusing on the Dex fighter lol) 😅 anyway, as i said before to other member, when i played it, i felt it having too magic powers, after maybe lv 9, for keep casting SB instead than concentrate on something else (at lv 13 with simulacrum i backed to use it in melee), and for this character i need something that can be constantly in melee, as the group is made by an healer, a ranged artificer (both flying), and a bard probably glamorous.

Ps paladin 2/bladesinger x is probably the most broken thing i can play with those stats, but i don't want play that broken, for me even paladin/sorcerer create enough problem, being able to almost play alone. 😅 I would be open also to some fighter/monk, Fighter barbarian, or fighter/rogue build, I choose for now eldricht Knight just because i like gishes (even weird gishes lol, some years ago i played a barbarian/warlock, with more lv in warlock than barb, just for abuse armor of agathys and some other abjuation spell 😅 ) and it seem the best for cover both, tank and damage role, but it's not mandatory, the one mandatory is the first lv in fighter, as we already create the character.

[Gignere]

Ah yep, it can't use a shield (my head is still focusing on the Dex fighter lol) 😅 anyway, as i said before to other member, when i played it, i felt it having too magic powers, after maybe lv 9, for keep casting SB instead than concentrate on something else (at lv 13 with simulacrum i backed to use it in melee), and for this character i need something that can be constantly in melee, as the group is made by an healer, a ranged artificer (both flying), and a bard probably glamorous.

Ps paladin 2/bladesinger x is probably the most broken thing i can play with those stats, but i don't want play that broken, for me even paladin/sorcerer create enough problem, being able to almost play alone. 😅 I would be open also to some fighter/monk, Fighter barbarian, or fighter/rogue build, I choose for now eldricht Knight just because i like gishes (even weird gishes lol, some years ago i played a barbarian/warlock, with more lv in warlock than barb, just for abuse armor of agathys and some other abjuation spell 😅 ) and it seem the best for cover both, tank and damage role, but it's not mandatory, the one mandatory is the first lv in fighter, as we already create the character.

Another interesting build for EK rely on fog cloud / darkness, GWM, and blind fighting for easy advantage. You can start as vhuman, nab HAM to round your strength to 20. Take GWM at 4 or 6, depends on whether you want PAM or not.

You will want to buy stacks of fog cloud scrolls, but with some coordination with your party you can tank and DPR your heart out using concealment to get advantage and be attacked with disadvantage.

You’d probably want to get to level 11 ASAP but afterwards you can multi your heart out.

[adb82]

Another interesting build for EK rely on fog cloud / darkness, GWM, and blind fighting for easy advantage. You can start as vhuman, nab HAM to round your strength to 20. Take GWM at 4 or 6, depends on whether you want PAM or not.

You will want to buy stacks of fog cloud scrolls, but with some coordination with your party you can tank and DPR your heart out using concealment to get advantage and be attacked with disadvantage.

You’d probably want to get to level 11 ASAP but afterwards you can multi your heart out.

Yea, i was thinking about that also, grabbing drow or better half drow for the free darkness. I'm just not sure one object interaction (from familiar) and other object interaction (from my character covering the point on the rapier where he casted darkness) it's enough for let my casters do their work AND give disadvantage to enemies trying to attack me, as i suppose both object interaction have to be taken during my turn, and so i would need other player having an object interaction in time for make everything work...probably it gonna become a too complicated mechanic; it's a nice build anyway, but it requires all the group ready to interact with what cover the point where the darkness is casted, otherwise casters and ranged characters can't do so much, unless they have devil's sight or similar.

Ps backing to the bladesinger, also monk 1/ bladesinger x can be fun. You use a quarterstaff with dex, grab the PAM feat and whatever push the enemies away from you, and enjoy playing flipper throwing enemies in your hazardous spell range. Sleet storm and similar are very nice spells for this Character, but there is a huge potential, it's a very powerful pseudo tank battlefield control. 😅